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(PIT/MTL/SJS) - Granlund, Rutta, Petry, DeSmith, Légaré, 2024 1st (PIT), 2025 2nd (PIT) for Pitlick, Hoffman for Karlsson, Hamaliuk, 2026 3rd (SJS)

Who won the trade?
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6 août 2023 à 13 h 11
#76
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Quoting: sensonfire
1. San Jose Sharks traded:

2023 Norris Trophy Winner Erik Karlsson at 10 million x 4
ECHL Prospect Dillon Hamaliuk
San Jose's 2026 3rd round pick

for

Mike Hoffman
Mikael Granlund
Jan Rutta
Pittsburgh's 2024 1st round pick with Top 10 Protection


This is awful for San Jose




2. Montreal traded:

Mike Hoffman
Rem Pitlick

for

Jeff Petry at 4.6875 million x 2
Casey DeSmith
AHL prospect Nathan Legare
Pittsburgh's 2025 2nd round pick


Montreal did good here.





3. Pittsburgh traded:

Mikael Granlund
Jeff Petry at 4.6875 million 2
Jan Rutta
Casey DeSmith
AHL Prospect Nathan Legare
Pittsburgh's 2024 1st round pick with Top 10 Protection
Pittsburgh's 2025 2nd round pick

for

2023 Norris Trophy Winner Erik Karlsson at 10 million x 4
Rem Pitlick
ECHL Prospect Dillon Hamaliuk
San Jose's 2026 3rd round pick


Pittsburgh did better than San Jose, but worse than Montreal.




In conclusion,

There is way too much value in this trade for Montreal and not enough for San Jose.

And Pittsburgh has about as much to lose in this trade as San Jose did when they acquired Karlsson 5 years ago.




The Montreal Canadiens win the trade.


This is amazing work by San Jose.

People on a cap site should appreciate what Grier pulled off here.

He got a 1st round pick to dump one of the most difficult contracts in the league, and get almost entirely out of the final two years of it, when his team will be on the upswing. He should not have gotten a 1st round pick here.

Granlund and Rutta are also relatively cheap buyouts next year if they need further cap flexibility at the expense of pushing more cap to the third year.

You also have to frame all of the above with the high probability that Karlsson wanted out. Teams cannot hold on to players forever when that happens. For a rookie GM to pull off what he did is very impressive.
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6 août 2023 à 13 h 15
#77
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Quoting: A_Habs_fan
I love this for Montreal, San Jose meh, Pittsburgh meh


Homer response
6 août 2023 à 13 h 17
#78
Banni
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Great win now for the Pens.
SJ taking what hey can get,
Amazing asset management by Habs.

Valueless Hoffman & Pitlick Out. Useful, tradeable assets brought in. And a 2nd. for +900K.

Masterfully opportunistic.
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6 août 2023 à 13 h 17
#79
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Quoting: Justafan79
Homer response


With the tag.. fire Julien Brisebois. A guy that got you two Cups.
6 août 2023 à 13 h 24
#80
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Quoting: budgeteam
This is amazing work by San Jose.

People on a cap site should appreciate what Grier pulled off here.

He got a 1st round pick to dump one of the most difficult contracts in the league, and get almost entirely out of the final two years of it, when his team will be on the upswing. He should not have gotten a 1st round pick here.

Granlund and Rutta are also relatively cheap buyouts next year if they need further cap flexibility at the expense of pushing more cap to the third year.

You also have to frame all of the above with the high probability that Karlsson wanted out. Teams cannot hold on to players forever when that happens. For a rookie GM to pull off what he did is very impressive.


He got fleeced. I'm not saying he should be fired...he hasn't had the job long enough, but EK has 3 Norris trophies...including the reigning winner. YES, he more offensively minded these days, but Grier did a terrible job maximizing return. He took on THREE cap dumps that alone...probably cost as much (if not more) than the conditional 1st. Josh Bailey...2nd. Zaitsev...2nd&4th as examples.

Also, why not retain 50%??? They're not remotely close to contending...so why not maximize value?

This wasn't a good job at all imo.
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6 août 2023 à 13 h 25
#81
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mtl - takes back a bad contract, brings in a third backup goalie but gets a second round pick for the trouble

pit - replaces petry in the old man RD slot for $5M AAV more, praying that karlsson’s feet don’t fall off within four years

sjs - eating salaries from terrible contracts that will expire by the time they’re done rebuilding (hypothetically) but get significantly less value than what they initially offered

did everyone lose this trade???
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6 août 2023 à 13 h 27
#82
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My vote goes to Montreal here simply because it's the team that has no losses in this deal.
-Pitts get an aging defender that got one incredible year after not playing a full 82 game schedule for six years in a row for a small 10M$. I think this year was a fluke and PItts will regret the trade sooner than most think on this one when he once again suits up for 50 games and gets 40 points in 2023-24.
-SJ had no leverage here and I guess it was the only offer on the market but did they really go from 11.5M$ of Erik to 12.25 + 4 years of 1.5M retention for a single protected first round pick?! Only silver lining here is that the franchise saves 17M in real money and SJ sheds the one player that kept them from getting top two picks this past year and this coming one so they get a better pick with their own.
-Montreal sheds 2 NHL contracts that were a problem for them, get a retained guy to flip in Petry (Expected before puck drop) and DeSmith who I think had a down year but at 1.8M$ will likely gather interest from teams in a package with something else (Don't think they use a retention slot for him but if you're not looking to use it this year why not).
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6 août 2023 à 13 h 29
#83
Banni
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Quoting: exo2769
He got fleeced. I'm not saying he should be fired...he hasn't had the job long enough, but EK has 3 Norris trophies...including the reigning winner. YES, he more offensively minded these days, but Grier did a terrible job maximizing return. He took on THREE cap dumps that alone...probably cost as much (if not more) than the conditional 1st. Josh Bailey...2nd. Zaitsev...2nd&4th as examples.

Also, why not retain 50%??? They're not remotely close to contending...so why not maximize value?

This wasn't a good job at all imo.


Yup. No clue what he's galaxy braining, again. Sharks fans for months were asking for multiple 1sts yet this is win?!? Ok yeah sure. The easy play was rentaining max especially with only 1 retention spot left now. This is as confusing as Poile using a retention spot long term for less than 250k on Ekholm. Sit or get off the pot. Grier didnt show much creativity here. This is simply a white flag by the Sharks.
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6 août 2023 à 13 h 29
#84
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So Pitt traded their bad players for a good player.
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6 août 2023 à 13 h 30
#85
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I'm not entirely sure That involving Montreal was just to stick it to Toronto
6 août 2023 à 13 h 33
#86
Out Come The Wolves
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I like Petry. I still think there is value there. Montreal can trade him again if they want. If he stays healthy, he's valuable.
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6 août 2023 à 13 h 49
#87
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Quoting: exo2769
He got fleeced. I'm not saying he should be fired...he hasn't had the job long enough, but EK has 3 Norris trophies...including the reigning winner. YES, he more offensively minded these days, but Grier did a terrible job maximizing return. He took on THREE cap dumps that alone...probably cost as much (if not more) than the conditional 1st. Josh Bailey...2nd. Zaitsev...2nd&4th as examples.

Also, why not retain 50%??? They're not remotely close to contending...so why not maximize value?

This wasn't a good job at all imo.


Why would they retain that much for the next 4 years? This gives them alot of moves to make in 24 onwards. either keep getting more prospects or then try to get a good player in the UFA market... That would be impossible with retaining that much salary
6 août 2023 à 13 h 51
#88
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Actually even simpler if I get it.

Montreal

paid Pitlick

And got desmith and a 2025 second

To essentially turn 1 year of Hoffman into two years of Petry at roughly the same contract.

That seems some good moving
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6 août 2023 à 13 h 52
#89
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Honestly, I like Montreals return the most! Can move Petry again and get another pick if they want. Even turning Hoffman and Pitlick into a 2nd is tidy business. Pittsburgh return is okay, I mean they get Karlsson which should help at least be competitive for a playoff spot, and move salary out is nice. SJ, just dreadful return plus eating 4 years of cap and only really return a 1st, oofff
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6 août 2023 à 13 h 58
#90
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Modifié 6 août 2023 à 14 h 6
This is giving NBA blockbuster trade that involves Russell Westbrook or Chris Paul

For real though, Pittsburgh wins short-term, and EK's contract won't be a bad buy-out option for the last two years of his contract (EDIT: I made a mistake. This WILL be a bad buyout). I don't expect him to be good for too long. Montreal didn't need Petry but he's not a bad veteran to use to teach the young defensemen. DeSmith is a solid backup goalie too. San Jose just gets rid of a contract so they can be Lackin' for Macklin
6 août 2023 à 14 h 0
#91
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Modifié 6 août 2023 à 14 h 14
Quoting: F50marco
Bonkers, absolutely bonkers I tells ya!

Just looking at it from a Habs perspective but if KH moves out Petry and one of either Desmith or Allen, than this is a masterclass. If he's stuck with Petry/Desmith/Allen for any amount of time it starts to not be as good. Im confident one of Allen/Desmith will be moved quite easily and if Habs retain 50% on Petry now, teams should be knocking down the door to get him. 2.6M for a top 4 dman is great value. Even if he had an off year last year.

Can't wait to see what happens next for the Habs but this appears to be Habs get a 2nd rounder+ Legare + (insert value from future Petry/Desmith trades) for approx 3M in dead cap and 1 less retention spot this year and next. Actually the fact that the Habs moved out Hoffman and Pitlick who are pending UFA's means they actually will have not gained any cap overall but rather swapped approx 3M from this year, to next year in the deal.

Its a very convoluted trade just like the Monahan one but when you look at it in the fine details, this is very smart work for Hughes and company.


Do you really think petry gets traded so soon? He blocked the SJ trade for this long. Just curious as to how Montreal fans think he is gonna be gone before the puck drops for 2024.
Quoting: Ghost789
Interesting trade, not quite sure what Pitt is thinking with the whole retaining thing? They get SJ to retain 1.5M off EK but then turn around and retain 1.5M off Petry for MTL? It’s a complete wash , makes no sense.

Dubas wants so bad to win NOW with Pitt to prove himself.. it’s either going 1 of two ways.. either Pitt wins a cup .. which is probably only a 2 year window left or they miss playoffs again/have major injuries and now they’re stuck with paying two RD 16M for the next 4+ years , not a good look. Dubas will be Axed from the league if this doesn’t work out. His handling of contracts and inability to get Toronto over the top with that talent .. what makes u think he can do it with 4 aging 35+ year old star players ? He better be praying.

EK thrives off being “THE GUY” there’s a reason why he struggled when Burns was still in SJ. You can’t have two OFD with EK, he needs to be out there on every PP playing 26+ minutes a night.

SJ comes away as the winner in this all. In 2 years from now it’ll be even more obvious. They dump EK’s huge contract, get 1st round pick and two proven serviceable 2/3rd liners that are responsible 2 way forwards who can teach SJ’s young guys coming up. If both healthy Granlund and Hoff are 50 point guys . Only thing I would’ve like to see is SJ get a B+ or higher level prospect out of this. They only took Rutta because Pitt needed to dump some cap. SJ is 3-4 years away from being a contender again, this window they’ll be free off all bad contacts, Burns, EK, Vlasic, etc They’ll have some solid prospects coming in and will have a ton of cap space to sign some FA’s.


Bahahahahahaha. Dude the 1st is even top 10 protected. SJ got fleeced because their owners suck. SJ fans trying to back track like they all wanted to just dump salary when a week ago they wanted 3 first round assets for EK alone. Just stop. SJ also isnt competing anytime soon. In 4 years they still wont be relevent and will be the laughing stock they always have been. Theyre the Pittsburgh Pirates of the NHL.
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6 août 2023 à 14 h 4
#92
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Quoting: exo2769
He got fleeced. I'm not saying he should be fired...he hasn't had the job long enough, but EK has 3 Norris trophies...including the reigning winner. YES, he more offensively minded these days, but Grier did a terrible job maximizing return. He took on THREE cap dumps that alone...probably cost as much (if not more) than the conditional 1st. Josh Bailey...2nd. Zaitsev...2nd&4th as examples.

Also, why not retain 50%??? They're not remotely close to contending...so why not maximize value?

This wasn't a good job at all imo.


See this guy gets it. Though SJ didnt retain the max because of ownership. This will age like the Burns trade. Pens get the best player and sj gets to not pay money to a great hockey player. Syure its a huge win if your an accountant, but last i checked the Sharks were an NHL franchise. Though should probably just demote them to the AHL at this point.
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6 août 2023 à 14 h 8
#93
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Quoting: SnakeDelilah
mtl - takes back a bad contract, brings in a third backup goalie but gets a second round pick for the trouble

pit - replaces petry in the old man RD slot for $5M AAV more, praying that karlsson’s feet don’t fall off within four years

sjs - eating salaries from terrible contracts that will expire by the time they’re done rebuilding (hypothetically) but get significantly less value than what they initially offered

did everyone lose this trade???


Dont see how pitt "loses" this trade. At worst they broke even. Karlsson only needs to play well for the first 2 years of this contract. Dubas took a window every deemed shut, locked, and somehow pryed it back open for what looks to be 2 or if we are VERY lucky 3 seasons. Not saying we win the cup but it certainly is FAR more likely than it was 3 months ago.
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6 août 2023 à 14 h 8
#94
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This isn't real...

It's one of those bad unrealistic laughable ACGM's we've been trashing for the past 2 months.
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6 août 2023 à 14 h 9
#95
exo2769
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Quoting: drizzt
Why would they retain that much for the next 4 years? This gives them alot of moves to make in 24 onwards. either keep getting more prospects or then try to get a good player in the UFA market... That would be impossible with retaining that much salary


Because they're just starting the tank...or at least should be. They just traded their best player. What UFA thinks the Sharks are more attractive now than before this trade? AND they weren't attractive before the trade. They can't possibly think they'll win the Stanley cup in 4 years. Why is MTL even in this trade? Just take Petry and the 2nd! That's better for the Sharks than Hoffman. Heck, you coulda probably forced PIT to keep Rutta then. The more you think about this trade...the worse it gets for Grier and the Sharks.
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6 août 2023 à 14 h 12
#96
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Quoting: drizzt
Why would they retain that much for the next 4 years? This gives them alot of moves to make in 24 onwards. either keep getting more prospects or then try to get a good player in the UFA market... That would be impossible with retaining that much salary


Dude your gonna be picking in the top 5 for the next 4 years. Who cares that you are paying on a guy for 4 years. SJ owners got THEIR win which is more money in THEIR pockets. The SJ hockey team loses their best player and got a protected 1st for it.... but yea dont worry sharks didnt get fleeced at ALLLLLL
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6 août 2023 à 14 h 16
#97
Banni
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Quoting: exo2769
Because they're just starting the tank...or at least should be. They just traded their best player. What UFA thinks the Sharks are more attractive now than before this trade? AND they weren't attractive before the trade. They can't possibly think they'll win the Stanley cup in 4 years. Why is MTL even in this trade? Just take Petry and the 2nd! That's better for the Sharks than Hoffman. Heck, you coulda probably forced PIT to keep Rutta then. The more you think about this trade...the worse it gets for Grier and the Sharks.


Its a half measure trade by Grier for appearances. Didn't retain max 50% so he didnt 'flush the future' and got a 1st round pick even though it's top10 protected and came with the cost of multiple bad money deals in exchange. For anyone to compare this to say the OEL trade has lost the plot. EK65 was flushed down the toilet for little turds that rose to the top of the bowl. That is the 'value' There's no Dylan Guenther here and EK wasnt signed for another decade like OEL.
6 août 2023 à 14 h 16
#98
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Quoting: Newgod77
So Pitt traded their bad players for a good player.



Are you sure? He's averaged barely more than 30 points three out of the past four seasons. Even if you include the past seasons, he's only managed an average of 50 points since he signed this massive contract.
6 août 2023 à 14 h 17
#99
Pete
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Who lose this trade?
SJS.
6 août 2023 à 14 h 17
#100
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Quoting: Wilson_W_Wilson_Jr
I like Petry. I still think there is value there. Montreal can trade him again if they want. If he stays healthy, he's valuable.


His contract is bad, but at 25% off, it's no longer an issue.
 
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