You're right. I was just giving an example on how a Trevling in this case might want to approach spending the cap.
Sometimes it doesn't really matter if you can sign a player at fair value, it's whether you want to spend the cap elsewhere.

With the PHI/ANA trade I got a feeling Walker's getting traded

I think whats gonna happen is Marner is gonna get extended and JT either takes a significant haircut or hes gone and they sign someone in FA

Heck maybe they move on from both and sign Draisaitl

Talk about burying the lead here.
This could shake Zegras loose

Its a bit of an odd trade for PHI but I kind of suspected ANA was gonna move Drysdale considering how many solid D prospects ANA has rn

But yea I feel Walkers getting moved and this is his replacement

Maybe they move on from both. Don't know 30 year old Draisaitl i, but maybe the following year McDavid

Man if TOR could try to get Egor Zamula out of PHI

Yah I agree for the most part

I’d say 12.5 should be the max, but absolutely with Willy getting 11.5 Mitch has all the leverage

Got a feeling its gonna be Walker or if serious retention is involved Ristolinen

So…I don’t know how accurate that tweet marner was…but what I hate about it most, if there’s any truth to it…would be that marner and his team immediately feel he is a superior player to nylander and had a complete lack of class by telling someone ‘my guys better so we expect more’ instead of saying they’re happy for nylander and happy to hear he’s staying.

Again, I’m taking it with a grain of salt, but I think it’s completely classless if that was a comment today out of his camp

Tough to take it with a grain of salt when they did the exact same thing (except even worse) after Matthews signed his first extension.

“That’s probably the best contract in the National Hockey League,” said Darren Ferris, the agent whose client list includes Maple Leafs star Mitch Marner. “There’s no team-friendly discount there”

“So far they’ve been trying to lowball (Marner),” Ferris said. “That’s the reason we’ve come to this point.”

“Nobody else is taking a discount. And now you’re asking (Marner) to take one again? It’s nonsense,” Ferris said. “Mitch already did them a favour on the entry-level deal.”

“This is great for all players. I think it’s a great contract for the player,” Ferris said. “As long as they treat Mitch with the same respect, there shouldn’t be an issue.”

These are from, I believe, the same day Matthews signed. Clown sh*t. A lot of fans have never forgotten how that negotiation was handled. It was a major turning point in a bad way for him.

Tough not to take anything from social media without a grain of salt, unless coming direct from the source.

Technically huh..
Well it was was clear right from the beginning that getting Nylander and Marner on team friendly deals was going to be the way to go and neither happened the first time around and second time around not looking so good either.

If Matthews, Marner, Nylander, Tavares and Rielly could play the entire game, for me this would be a non issue but the fact is 2 more lines have to play and this is where my disappointment in roster building comes in.

We've seen the the top heavy roster for what? 5-6-7 years? Didn't learn that the roster needs more balance?

I'm wondering what Shanahan is thinking since he's been here the longest from the current management group.

In general the lesson learned by management if your guys asking for 10m ****ing give it

As otherwise your gonna end up 1.5m

Still think they should have called his bluff as what competitive team was gonna hand him 12m or anything close to 11.5m (like hey if someone good offers we will match)

Chicago they wont be competitive for at least 3 years

Anyways for Marner if that boy asks for 12m ****ing give it dont do PT. II of this fiasco


But yea Toronto has nice cheap goaltending, 2 nice top 4 LD at reasonable prices, Jarnkrok whose a good top 9 guy for cheap. Just need to fill around

Minten and Benoit

Agreed, winning culture should start now with Bert/Domi extension and go into the JT and Mitch extensions... You say: look, Willy's been outplaying you this season, you sign a 10.5-11 or you walk and end conversations there...



Two points: First, I would have let both walk... And I was with you on that.

Second, Willy is more likeable than Mitch and Leafs fans are starting to se why you, me and other Leafs fans didn't want the contract in the 1rst place



Leafs will have (assuming everyone next summer signs 2+ years) coming off the books to resign:
- Marner
- JT
- Knies
- Woll
- Holmberg
- McCabe
- Timmins

They will have 32 mill to do so assuming the cap goes up to 92.5 mill

You have to sign: Knies, Woll, Holmberg, Timmins

The tough question is: Do you sign Marner to his boat anchor (And yes, it will be) contract? or do you go after upgrading the defence and rolling with only 2 guys at 10+ (Bc JT should be getting a 4-6 mill contract)?

^ ^This^ ^



"Mitch already did them a favour on the entry-level deal" 😂

And this is why we should start with winning culture... Stuff like this should have ended up in a Marner trade but nope... Gotta make sure the core 4 is happy

I know I've posted a lot consecutively but I'll end it with this:

Thank god Morgan Rielly took 1.5-2.5 mill off of his deal... Imagine how difficult it would be to navigate the cap if Rielly were to take the Nurse contract and not take a discount...

That's a leader; JT refusing 13 mill from SJ to take 11 in TO at the height of his prime... Another leader (As much as some people don't want to admit it)

The thing is...I don't blame his camp.

Lou pressed Marner on the ELC to not include those 2 bonuses that most teams include for top draft picks...so that's where Feris was coming from saying he did them a favour.

And taking team-friendly deals needs to come from the top and trickle down. Boston is a great current example of that. Detroit used to always be like that. But Willy held out and got more than everyone thought he would (even though, in hindsight he out-performed that contract)....Auston got top dollar on a shortened term...so why is Mitch supposed to come in and be the one guy to take less? Because he's a local kid? Because he was the last of those 3 to put pen to paper?

Think about your own workplace...if you knew the company handed out big raises to everyone else around you...and you've been a key contributor...and management comes to you and says they already blew more of the budget giving your colleagues raises, are you willing to be a team-player and take less to help the company out? You're gonna tell them to get bent.

For me, the issue isn't these guys pushing for everything they could get...it was the strategy in getting them signed. It is forever burned in my memory when Lou left and Kyle took over. Everyone thought the situation was going to be Lou taking Kyle under his wing and showing him the ropes...but that wasn't Lou's style....and the one and only think that Dubas said he took away from Lou was "if you have time, use it"....and so he waited until all those dudes continued their rise to stardom before cracking down on negotiations and losing all leverage.

I know specifically that when Mitch was first approached in July prior to his final year of the ELC....his team asked for $8m x 8yrs and the team walked away...waited...then paid significantly more on a shorter term.

Willy we feel would have come in at $6m if they signed him immediately. I'm not sure about Auston but logic says he would have been north of $10m but likely not more than $11m. There was $4-5m there on longer term deals that could have made an impact. Maybe that's keeping Hyman. Maybe that's adding quality to the back end....but this team had to scrape by for years when the cap never went up.

The same mistake was made with Willy...and now there's no way Mitch is going to look at that $11.5m and NOT want to come in above that. It's really not Mitch's fault, nor should he be blamed for it.

And while I do think Matthews took less than he could have gotten....if he took even less...or even if they made a bigger facade out of him taking less than was offered....he needed to be the guy that sets the tone that stars in Toronto are willing to take less to play here and win. Instead...everyone else is just looking to get their fair share.

I 100% do...

Lou pressed Marner to not have the bonuses bc that's what Lou's plan was... A

That's why the Leafs can change it starting now... Starts with everyone they negotiate with and Marner and JT being 2 upcoming easy examples to do... Marner also got nearly double what Nylander got... Should've taken the 2 mill more than Nylander and be done with it...

But here's the thing: The NHL is not like other businesses... Most organizations are trying to win the cup and most players go to orgs that are trying to win... And if your boss said: "Hey can you make 8 mill instead of 10.9 so we can win?" I'd say 100%, no worried bc 8 mill is still a ton of money...

For me, The issue was not putting your foot down on Nylander and getting him to sign 8 years... BC if that happens, then Matthews prob signs 8 years and so does Marner... Making it easier to sign everyone else

If that's true, Dubas screwed up big time

Then let Mitch walk, it's that simple... go after all of the big time FAs and use your cap space effectively...

And you can't ask that of Matthews... Matthews should've gotten 15, instead, he got 13.25... How much more of a discount do you want... Tre should have put his foot down on Nylander and forced him to take less or walk but that doesn't fall in line with Shanahan's vision, that's why Dubas got fired...

a) how do you blame a player's representative for trying to get him the best possible deal?
b) Leadership comes from the top...and that's Matthews in this case. I can't fathom any scenario where you give everyone else their big raise and are then able to single out one guy and say you're the dude we're putting our foot down on and think that's fair.
c) I know the NHL isn't like other businesses...but where everyone's salary is a known figure...how do you isolate just one of your star players and decide he's the guy that should sacrifice so that everyone else around can get their raise? It's not about how much money is enough for you to be happy with...it's about respect.
d) I don't think Nylander's situation had any impact on the Matthews' deal off their ELC's. Matthews was always going to do his thing....but I do know that once the team rejected $8m x 8yrs for Marner, he was always going to wait to see what Matthews did and piggyback off of it because they felt his impact to the team wasn't far off of Matthews' contribution (and coming off their ELC's he wasn't wrong)
e) Dubas did screw up big time....as did Shanny giving him the keys during such a crucial time trying to re-sign these guys
f) They may have to let Marner walk. I love the guy and think he's a big lynchpin to their success...but with Nylander becoming a top-tier player in the league and Matthews being a perennial Rocket trophy candidate...Marner now finds himself way closer to Nylander's end of the spectrum vs Matthews (although I doubt he sees it that way)....but maybe the team looks at this and made the decision between Nylander and Marner and decided they would rather hitch their wagon to Willy
g) Matthews got just about exactly what he should have...we go back to cap %....he slotted right in between McKinnon and McDavid which feels appropriate. Could he have held out for $15m? Sure. But he could also have taken $12.5m, still been very comfortable, and made it clear that he wanted to take less to allow for team success. Or he could have made his deal 8yrs...for all we know his ask was $14-15m on an 8yr deal

Minten needs a year with the marlies

I know he had a feel good but thats a kid whose gonna need some time

Probs Steeves and Kokkonen

Benoit technically already here as #7

Which Marlies will no longer be waiver exempt? That's usually a good indicator of who makes the squad out of training camp. When they gave Woll his extension last year we knew the writing was on the wall that he'd be on the Leafs this year because they wouldn't risk losing him to waivers.

a) I thought we were talking about players taking hometown discounts to win? In that case, Marner had the leverage and decided not to take a discount...
b) Big raise? 1.6 million dollars in the cap world, isn't that big of a raise... A raise that is big though, is 3.4 million dollars or 4.1 million dollars
c) you have to start somewhere though... And out of the 4, Marner and JT's contracts are coming up bc they screwed up Nylander's, winning culture starts somewhere...
d) It did though... It set the precedent that Leafs stars don't have to sign 8 years...
e)He did
f)That's exactly what I'm saying
g) Are you talking about at time of signing? BC Matthews would have a similar cap hit to Mackinnon at time of signing and a percent lower than McDavid when IMO, I'd put Matthews closer to McDavid's percent then Mackinnon's