Dermott and a 1st maybe? I dunno, this is a tough deal to swing. Rakell hasn't been where he's usually at the past couple seasons.

We wouldn't really be looking at a LD in return for Rakell.

Niemela and a 2021 1st round pick seems like a fair price

Does he come with a time machine? I mean kerfoot is having a better season with vesey and Mikheyev in a ****diwn roll playing 3rd line minutes.

I like Rackell, he is a guy I wouldn’t mind adding... not at 2018 prices though,

So dial up a suggestion. You know I value your input highly. I just think it's an interesting topic for discussion.

On the other hand, Anaheim sucks at basically everything. Their bright spot is a top 5 goalie in the league who's saving more pucks than he should be, analytically speaking. Their offense and defense are both a dumpster fire. There's no fun to that team's game right now.

I would consider lily and a second but the leafs can’t make it work without retention. I think there are better rentals/2-year control guys that can be had with our first+prospect.

Rakell has a positive corsi on the ducks. Kerfoot negative on the Leafs. Kerfoot has more points and I won’t lie I don’t watch TOR games here in SoCal but Rakell still gets chances. Idk if one breaks the ice or what but he’s still pretty good at creating chances.

Comment on the first trade, additional details section - I agree that the price is too high, but I'm a bit befuddled by the lumping in of Hirvonen with Robertson/Amirov. I like Hirvonen and I think there's an NHL player there, but I don't personally think he's in the same class as the other two. Without comment on whether I'd do the trade with Hirvonen (I'd probably consider it), subbing him in for Amirov/Robertson certainly makes it more palatable, imo.

If the Leafs are willing to spend a 1st + A prospect I hope it’s for Garland or Buchnevich. Agree with some of the other comments, Rakell’s play has been on the decline for two seasons now. I do like the player but the most is a 2nd + B prospect. IMO

I’d prefer to take a flyer on Terry. Both him and Steel haven’t developed as high as I’m sure Ducks management would have liked

I wouldn’t.

Niemela was very impressive at the under 20. He may be pushing for a shot at the nhl in 3 years which may leave a gap for him. As much as I would hate to lose Lilly I think he is the more expendable piece.

Still not sure how happy I would be if we moved Lilly in that deal either.

I think the leafs offer would be Engvall a 1st and a b prospect. If there’s retention we add a 3rd.

Kerfoot has been okay. Good both ways my point is how much would you give up for kerfoot? The value between the two has to be close.

Iafallo.

That's the target imo.

1. Expiring deal
2. Less to send in assets
3. Cheaper contract
4. Albeit not as productive as Rackell can be, he is still a 40-50 point winger.

The whole point of making a deal here is to add depth. The RW is solid when healthy. Now, Hyman, Soup and ???. Looking ahead, Hyman wants to remain a Leaf - and most of us agree he is a player that is a priority signing. Soup or Robertson (if he can get some games in this year) round out the LW. Rackell is basically telling Hyman he is done.

Right idea here, wrong target.

Scary to think that half of our wins so far are 1-0 shutouts by Gibson.

I could live with that. I certainly wouldn't call for Murray's head for it. Maybe you add Villeneuve, we add one of our fifths?

The primary assist on our one goal in a 1-0 shutout.

I didn't intend to imply equivalency there, just a range of impossibility. One shouldn't get into the habit of trading recent first- or second-round picks even aside from their projected value.

Yes, I had quite a good discussion with my friend @LeafsFanForSomeReason the other night about Garland vs. Rakell. That's a valid point.

Liljegren, Engvall and a 2nd seems like a fair price to me. What you think? Maybe something else for retention or up the pick to a 1st

I wouldn't be overjoyed, but I wouldn't be unhappy. I'm just philosophically opposed to taking on a guy I know we don't need.

Honestly I think Rakell is the wrong target for the Leafs. They need a winger for Tavares and Nylander but the first priority should be giving Robertson a chance to take that spot (his LTIR time ends shortly, Saturday I think). If Robertson doesn't work out, using Kerfoot on a shutdown 3rd line hasn't been amazing and its our penalty kill that is really worrisome, not the offense(with the most goals per game in the league after Montreal got shut out tonight). I think the right move for the Leafs is to find a defensively sound 3rd line center to play with Mikheyev and +1 who isn't Hyman while moving Kerfoot back up to play with JT and Nylander like he did for most of last season. Paying a 1st + a good prospect for Rakell seems like throwing money away when you can chase a cheaper position and have the answers for a top 6 winger on the team already.

If Hyman stays and Robertson and Amirov are able to meet expectations, you will turn out to have been right.

I suppose, yeah. The specification of 1st or 2nd round picks seems a bit arbitrary though. For instance Topi Niemela was an early 3rd round pick, five spots after Hirvonen. I'd be more opposed to trading him than Hirvonen.

I just don't see the gap there where subbing in Hirvonen for Amirov, making the trade 2021 1st + Hirvonen for Rakell at 50%, is in the realm of 'absurdity' or 'impossibility', yet 2021 1st + Niemela at full price (though you did mention the Ducks might have to retain) is 'a lot closer/in the ball park'. That's where my perception of lumping Hirvonen into a higher class came from.

The fact that I think you shouldn't trade first- or second-round picks until you've given them a fair chance to prove what you have doesn't imply the converse, that you should trade any third-round pick without hesitation. That's where judgment comes in. To me, Niemela, Hunt and Poirier are very good prospects, my teams' picks (Simontaival and Moore) are possibles, and no one else in that third round impresses me yet. If I were you, I wouldn't trade Niemela, either, but the fact that defensemen take longer to develop is why I think Niemela is valued less highly than Hirvonen. But I love the trade Dubas made to get the two of them.

What I was trying to say is that I don't think Dubas would even entertain the idea of trading Amirov, Hirvonen or Robertson, so we (Anaheim) shouldn't bother asking, but he just might consider moving Niemela.

A former leaf pick finally with the team and playing next to Matthews and Marner or Tavares and Nylander is a juicy thought.

When Friedman mentioned leafs were looking for a forward I did see a lot of people pointing to Rakell. Dont know if Dubas pulls the trigger but April 12 should be very intriguing