How's 2012? Caps just won the Cup with John Carlson as their #1 dman and basically competent bums around him on the defense.

I wouldn't say Washington was surrounded by bums on defense but ok

Johnsson was a presence in the series against Boston, Grundstrom is most certainly NHL ready. In fact Grundstrom may not play next season because our wings are so deep.

I'm not saying they're going to score 20 goals each next year, but they are ready and in a few seasons will be valuable roster players.

That is all opinion based, but we will see

Competent bums. Okay, I'll give you Orlov as a legit #3 guy. After that? Niskanen, Orpik, Kempny and Djoos. Yep, competent bums.

Kem

Kempny was Elite. Niskanen was decent. So 4 decent defensemen win you the cup, Unlike Toronto's 1

If he was elite, why did he just sign a 4x2,5? And yes, Niskanen is servicable, I've been saying that for the whole time. Zaitsev, Gardiner and Hainsey are all that. They're servicable.

Our left side is capable of winning a cup. Hainsey and Ozhiganov will be solid on the second and third pairing, and Zaitsev should bounce back this year. Liljegren also has 1D potential. Our defense isn't as bad as the media says it is.

Zaitsev is trash... Hainsey perhaps but he isn't getting any younger. Gardinar is a pure offensive defensemen that doesn't know what defense is.

And yet people call Brent Burns elite even though he is exactly that as well?

He is more offensive minded, but he actually knows how to play defense.

What if I told you that Zaitsev is fairly close to Alec Martinez when looking for a numbers comparable? Zaitsev scores a bit less, but is defensively bit better.

Lol

Oh yeah?

yep

The dream is real!!!

I actually suggested a while back that the Leafs may do this and go all in on Tavares and then trade Nylander (or someone else down the road to make room for Matthews)... I got totally flamed tor suggesting that BTW. but here we are a few months later and it's nice to be vindicated.... I said all along he would end up in Toronto, but I figured it would be a one 1-year deal for 12 per in an attempt at a Cup run then he would resign with the Islanders next season...

Well, I suppose the Leafs will be in "cap hell" next season ... I wonder what their strategy is? let Nylander get offer-sheeted? or are they planning to let Marner go??

I'm shocked this happened - not that he signed in Toronto but the fact he signed for 7-years.... Hey, it's a risk but it may be worth it..... Trade Nylander for a top 4 defenseman?

Either way the Leafs cant afford Matthews, Tavares, Nylander & Marner - it's not going to happen especially when Marner and Nylader will want 7+ to stick around..

Current cap space: ~13,6M.

Let's assume Nylander and Johnsson make in total around 8M. Now there's 5,6M cap space.

LTIR Horton and you have another 5,3 to use. 10,3 cap space now.

Dump Marleau next july 1st after his bonuses get paid, to a team who needs to reach the floor. 17,5m cap space.

Dump Martin's contract. 19,65m cap space.

Hainsey comes off the books. 22,65m cap space.

Assuming they're gonna promote from within, Gardiner comes off the books. 26,7m cap space.

Now we're at July of 2019. There's plenty of cap space to sign Matthews, Marner, Carrick and Kapanen. Any of the other guys down in the AHL can be extended with cheaper deals by this point or let go.

Matthews is getting at least 12m, possibly 13m, (around 12.5) Marner will get Draisaitl type money 8.5, Nylander will want 7m.... That's 28.M locked up in just Matthews, Marner & Nylander.....Factor in Tavares' 11 per and you have 39M locked up in just 4 players - that is half of the damn salary cap right now...

The Leafs cannot afford:

Tavares - 11
Mattews -12.5
Marner - 8.5
Nylander -7

You cant have 39 million locked up into 4 players and expect to fill out the other 21 pieces of the roster with 41 million...

Leafs fans will be in total denial next summer..

You better hope the Leafs win a Cup this season because they will certainly be in cap hell this summer........

Leafs will have the best offense in the league. Even if getting JT doesn't solve their defensive problems, it still gives TOR more flexibility to move forwards (not necessarily Nylander) for defensive help. I can see TOR giving Gardiner this upcoming season to redeem himself for his embarrassing playoffs, but if he doesn't show any signs of improving his defensive game, I can see him being moved with a pick or prospect for a young RD.

No, because it can't hold a website that produces signings.

Except you're overvaluing the guys. Nylander is gonna get Pasta-money. Matthews is in the 11-12-range and Marner probably 7-7.5. You're forgetting Drai was getting paid with the assumption he'd be a center.

12 + 6,6 + 7,5 = 26,1, add Tavares and you're looking at around 37m. Hawks have tad under 34m locked in Toews, Kane, Seabrook and Crawford. And Kane is the one player of that bunch who I'd say is clearly as good as or better than Matthews, Nylander, Marner and Tavares.

Wrong.....

The cap went up - that means salaries go up too, the only comparable to Matthews is McDavid, and no doubt Matthews will get McDavid money if not more. 12.5

Marner is going to want Draisaitl money and he will get it 8.5

Nylander is going to want 7.5 at least..

Look, JVR just got 7, are you saying Nylander at his age isn't worth more than that?

Toronto is going to be in cap hell with 40 million tied up in 4 players..

And the notion that these kids will just take a "discount" isn't going to happen - this is the first huge contract these kids are going to have to get paid and they're going to want as much as possible, because who knows, they could get injured 2 years down the road and they're no longer the player they once were - but at least they will be set for life... So you better believe they're going to get paid...

I mean at the very least Toronto is going to have to dump Kadri and Marleau..

The notion these guys are going to take lowball offers is just insanity when you look around the league and there are guys that aren't as good as them making more .....

Age, potential, production and comparisons is how you determine these salaries - not what you believe they are "subjectively" worth..

I'm just very glad I'm not an Islanders fan right now.

If Dubas wants to play hardball with Nylander all he has to do is look no further than Nik Ehlers' deal in Winnipeg, who is set to make $6M per for the next 7 years starting in 2018-2019. So if the Leafs were to lock up Nylander for $6M per for 7 years, both players would make 7.5% of the $79.5M salary cap in 2018-2019. What makes these two players comparable is nearly everything. So using your metrics of age, potential and production for comparison you will see that Nylander and his agent are not in a position to demand $7.5M.

Age:
Both are 22 years old and were drafted in the first round of the 2014 draft (8th and 9th overall) and both signed their ELCs at age 18.

Production:
In two full seasons Ehlers scored 54 goals, 70 assists and 124 points (25 on the PP) in 164 games for 0.76 points per game, playing 16:30 minutes a night on average. In the same two seasons Nylander scored 42 goals, 80 assists and 122 points (38 on the PP) in 163 games for 0.75 points per game, playing 16:30 minutes a night on average. Both players have played with elite line-mates at both 5v5 and on the powerplay.

Potential:
Both players have the potential to be top line scoring wingers (which they already are). So judging by their past performance it is easy to project that both players will consistently score within the 60-70 point range over the course of a full season.

Thus, since many of the contracts in the league are decided by comparable player contracts, a precedent has already been set that a winger of Nylander's caliber, at his age, is objectively worth $6M per year. What statistics can his agent bring to the table that would merit his client being paid more? Maybe David Pastrnaks contract? lets see.

Pastrnak is also 22 years old and signed his ELC at 18.
In the same two full seasons, he has scored 69 goals, 81 assists, and 150 points (50 on the PP) in 157 games for 0.96 points per game. Making it likely that he gets 70-80 points a year in a full season.
He makes $6.6M per season which started in 2017-2018 meaning he made 8.8% of the $75M salary cap, which for Nylander would only come out to $6.9M per year. However, based on production and potential it does not appear that he deserves as much as Pastrnak.