Forums/Armchair-GM

The only trades that actually make sense

Créé par: ZiggyPalffy
Date de création initiale: 8 janv. 2021
Publié: 8 janv. 2021
Équipe: 2020-21 Blue Jackets de Columbus
Description
CBJ is perhaps the most fit for contention as they've ever been. Maybe some D upgrades at the deadline, but not much else.

They are not a rebuilding team so any trades such as picks and prospects that we keep seeing are not realistic. The only way they trade Dubois is if they get a center of the same stature or an upgrade at the same position. Otherwise they are walking themselves out of contention and have to explain that to their fan base who's suffered enough over the years.

The only teams that make sense are LA and Montreal.

LA is a bit unrealistic simply due to Blake saying they aren't trading Kopitar, Doughty, Brown, or Quick. I think they would at least consider it if Dubois and Bemstrom were offered. Kopitar is a massive upgrade over Dubois, yes he's older, but has shown no signs of slowing down nor has he had a huge lack of production despite being on a bad rebuilding team. He also has the Cup experience CBJ doesn't have. He fits their CBJ mold as well.

Montreal, Dubois and Suzuki would solidify their top 6 center group which would make Danault and KK expendable. I think Danault extended and KK would make a fair return for Dubois and Grigorenko(3C replacement for KK) Not a lot of Montreal fans like this proposal because of what they are giving up, but it is a fair return and they get Dubois out of it. You have to remember, KK is struggling player that still hasn't proved much yet. That is why Danualt must be extended.


I personally think the Montreal trade makes most sense.
Transactions
1.
CBJ
  1. Danault, Phillip
  2. Kotkaniemi, Jesperi
Détails additionnels:
Danault Extended: 5.75M x 5 years.
MTL
    Dubois
    Grigorenko
    2.
    CBJ
    1. Kopitar, Anze (2 000 000 $ retained)
    LAK
      Dubois
      Bemstrom
      Rachats de contrats
      • Scott Hartnell: 1 250 000 $
      • Alexander Wennberg: 441 667 $
      Transactions impliquant une retenue de salaire
      • Nick Foligno: 2 750 000 $ (50%)
      • David Savard: 2 125 000 $ (50%)
      • Max Domi: 2 650 000 $ (50%)
      ANNÉE DE REPÊCHAGE1E RONDE2E RONDE3E RONDE4E RONDE5E RONDE6E RONDE7E RONDE
      2021
      Logo de CBJ
      Logo de CBJ
      Logo de CBJ
      Logo de CBJ
      Logo de NJD
      Logo de CBJ
      Logo de CBJ
      2022
      Logo de CBJ
      Logo de CBJ
      Logo de CBJ
      Logo de CBJ
      Logo de CBJ
      Logo de CBJ
      Logo de ANA
      2023
      Logo de CBJ
      Logo de CBJ
      Logo de CBJ
      Logo de CBJ
      Logo de CBJ
      Logo de CBJ
      Logo de CBJ
      TAILLE DE LA FORMATIONPLAFOND SALARIALCAP HITEXCÉDENTS Info-bulleBONISESPACE SOUS LE PLAFOND SALARIAL
      2381 500 000 $66 418 333 $0 $3 600 000 $15 081 667 $
      Ailier gaucheCentreAilier droit
      Logo de Blue Jackets de Columbus
      Texier, Alexandre
      897 500 $
      AG, C, AD
      RFA - 1
      Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
      Danault, Phillip
      3 083 333 $
      C
      UFA - 1
      Logo de Blue Jackets de Columbus
      Bjorkstrand, Oliver
      2 500 000 $
      AD, AG
      UFA - 1
      Logo de Blue Jackets de Columbus
      Foligno, Nick
      1 375 000 $
      AG, C, AD
      M-NTC, NMC
      UFA - 1
      Logo de Blue Jackets de Columbus
      Domi, Max
      1 325 000 $
      C, AG
      UFA - 2
      Logo de Blue Jackets de Columbus
      Atkinson, Cam
      5 875 000 $
      AD, AG
      M-NTC
      UFA - 5
      Logo de Blue Jackets de Columbus
      Nyquist, Gustav
      5 500 000 $
      AG, AD
      UFA - 3
      Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
      Kotkaniemi, Jesperi
      925 000 $
      C
      UFA - 1
      Logo de Blue Jackets de Columbus
      Bemström, Emil
      925 000 $
      AD, AG
      RFA - 2
      Logo de Blue Jackets de Columbus
      Jenner, Boone
      3 750 000 $
      C, AG
      UFA - 2
      Logo de Blue Jackets de Columbus
      Koivu, Mikko
      1 500 000 $
      C
      NMC
      UFA - 1
      Logo de Blue Jackets de Columbus
      Nash, Riley
      2 750 000 $
      C, AD
      UFA - 1
      Défenseur gaucherDéfenseur droitierGardien de but
      Logo de Blue Jackets de Columbus
      Werenski, Zachary
      5 000 000 $
      DG
      UFA - 2
      Logo de Blue Jackets de Columbus
      Jones, Seth
      5 400 000 $
      DD
      M-NTC
      UFA - 2
      Logo de Blue Jackets de Columbus
      Korpisalo, Joonas
      2 800 000 $
      G
      UFA - 2
      Logo de Blue Jackets de Columbus
      Gavrikov, Vladislav
      2 800 000 $
      DG
      UFA - 3
      Logo de Blue Jackets de Columbus
      Savard, David
      1 062 500 $
      DD
      UFA - 1
      Logo de Blue Jackets de Columbus
      Merzlikins, Elvis
      4 000 000 $
      G
      UFA - 2
      Logo de Blue Jackets de Columbus
      Harrington, Scott
      1 633 333 $
      DG
      UFA - 2
      Logo de Blue Jackets de Columbus
      Kukan, Dean
      1 650 000 $
      DG/DD
      UFA - 2
      Laissés de côtéListe des blessés (IR)Liste des blessés à long terme (LTIR)
      Logo de Blue Jackets de Columbus
      Gerbe, Nathan
      750 000 $
      AG, AD
      UFA - 2
      Logo de Kings de Los Angeles
      Kopitar, Anze
      8 000 000 $
      C
      M-NTC
      UFA - 4
      Logo de Blue Jackets de Columbus
      Robinson, Eric
      975 000 $
      AG
      UFA - 2
      Logo de Blue Jackets de Columbus
      Dubois, Pierre-Luc
      5 000 000 $
      C
      RFA - 2
      Logo de Blue Jackets de Columbus
      Carlsson, Gabriel
      725 000 $
      DG
      RFA - 2
      Logo de Blue Jackets de Columbus
      Grigorenko, Mikhail
      1 200 000 $
      C, AG
      UFA - 1
      Logo de Blue Jackets de Columbus
      Dubinsky, Brandon
      5 850 000 $
      C, AG
      M-NTC, NMC
      UFA - 1

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      8 janv. 2021 à 14 h 13
      #1
      Former Hockey Fan
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      Stop trying to take our players just so you can offload PLD. There is clearly a terrible fit trade-wise between the Jackets and Habs, and we aren’t making a trade just because someone is French-Canadian. KK is untouchable, so stop making ridiculous offers.
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      8 janv. 2021 à 14 h 19
      #2
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      The habs trade is a no, the Kopitar one very interesting though. Those types of trades make the most sense for a Dubois deal I think.

      Of course, nothing would be better than if CBJ could just lock Dubois up long term. CBJ needs to get that part figured out.
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      8 janv. 2021 à 14 h 25
      #3
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      Quoting: Kotkaniemi15
      Stop trying to take our players just so you can offload PLD. There is clearly a terrible fit trade-wise between the Jackets and Habs, and we aren’t making a trade just because someone is French-Canadian. KK is untouchable, so stop making ridiculous offers.


      I've probably seen 10 trades on here for PLD with KK. Easy bud. most made by hab fans
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      8 janv. 2021 à 14 h 26
      #4
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      Quoting: dzad96
      I've probably seen 10 trades on here for PLD with KK. Easy bud. most made by hab fans


      I know. And I’m sick of it, but at least it’s usually easier to reason with fans of other teams than it is to reason with the many insane habs fans of the website.
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      8 janv. 2021 à 14 h 33
      #5
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      Quoting: Kotkaniemi15
      Stop trying to take our players just so you can offload PLD. There is clearly a terrible fit trade-wise between the Jackets and Habs, and we aren’t making a trade just because someone is French-Canadian. KK is untouchable, so stop making ridiculous offers.


      Dude everyone know PLD is better than KK. Makes a lot of sense for the habs.
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      8 janv. 2021 à 14 h 51
      #6
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      I think that this is what it would take for the Habs to get him.

      This site is funny in a way though, Habs always need more value in a trade to get a star player then other teams posts for people on this site to think its a good deal. I have seen far less for PLD on this site that people think are good trades and here we are with a good offer and people think its not enough.
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      8 janv. 2021 à 15 h 18
      #7
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      Quoting: Kotkaniemi15
      I know. And I’m sick of it, but at least it’s usually easier to reason with fans of other teams than it is to reason with the many insane habs fans of the website.


      You're the only Habs fan that comes off insane. No other Habs fan values KK like you. In a trade for Dubois, KK is involved in reality not fantasy. Get used to it
      8 janv. 2021 à 15 h 25
      #8
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      Modifié 8 janv. 2021 à 15 h 32
      Quoting: ZiggyPalffy
      You're the only Habs fan that comes off insane. No other Habs fan values KK like you. In a trade for Dubois, KK is involved in reality not fantasy. Get used to it


      He didn't say KK would not be involved (from a CBJ perspective), he said Dubois to the Habs is not realistic, which I agree with.

      I personally would not trade our Selke candidate center who also outplayed and outproduced Dubois at 5 on 5 last season while also adding Kotkaniemi who all habs fans expect to be a #1 or #2C in the near future. Yes KK is not Dubois, but he is also two years younger and was drafted with the expectation that long term he would become a #1C.
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      8 janv. 2021 à 15 h 49
      #9
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      I have made a few Dubois trades myself and included KK in a couple. OK is not the player I would give up for Dubois if I had my choice. And I definitely am not giving up both KK and Danault. Montreal is not trading 2 Centers for 1 especially not one they view to be a Barkov type player in the future and Danault who is one of the best 2 way centers in the league. I only ever in Clyde one of alDanault or KK in any proposal and prefer the Danault proposals as Danault fits with Columbus' win now mentality. A package of Danault + Tatar + Norlinder with both Tuna and Danault extended has more than enough value for Dubois. However even if we don't trade for Dubois I would be just as happy with the team we have now. So yes having Dubois would be great but IMO it doesn't improve the team enough to go out of our way and overpay significantly for him.
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      9 janv. 2021 à 14 h 7
      #10
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      Quoting: Saskleaf
      Dude everyone know PLD is better than KK. Makes a lot of sense for the habs.


      Disagree. Maybe at the moment. Not in a year or two. Habs keep KK. He's gonna be a beast.
      9 janv. 2021 à 14 h 17
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      Quoting: ZiggyPalffy
      You're the only Habs fan that comes off insane. No other Habs fan values KK like you. In a trade for Dubois, KK is involved in reality not fantasy. Get used to it


      Disagree. We don't need to trade KK for Dubois. Why make a move for the sake of making a move. Kk + Danault is better than Dubois everyday of the year. Losing both makes our team worse. Kk will be just as good as Dubois.

      If you're trading with MB. Danault + a high level prospect (Poehling, Caufield) or a first round pick. Might get it done. Even then I'm not sure you even make the trade. If we can re-sign Danault long term and keep KK and Suzuki we've got a Trio down the middle that not many teams can match.

      We only trade for Dubois if IT IMPROVES our team. The above trade and comments here don't improve us. Everyone is salivating over Dubois. We have a solid group of three I'll take all day. Why trade for someone that may or not make us better as a group.
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      9 janv. 2021 à 17 h 27
      #12
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      Quoting: HabsRealGM
      Disagree. Maybe at the moment. Not in a year or two. Habs keep KK. He's gonna be a beast.


      It's hard to tell. I think KK will be about as good as PLD in like 3 years. But he's still too young to know just how good he'll be. At the moment, I'd say PLD is worth more than him.
      9 janv. 2021 à 17 h 44
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      Quoting: Saskleaf
      It's hard to tell. I think KK will be about as good as PLD in like 3 years. But he's still too young to know just how good he'll be. At the moment, I'd say PLD is worth more than him.


      If it's straight up I'm taking PLD all day every day. Maybe KK is better than him at one point, but I'm going with the surefire guy.
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      9 janv. 2021 à 18 h 27
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      Quoting: HabsForEver
      If it's straight up I'm taking PLD all day every day. Maybe KK is better than him at one point, but I'm going with the surefire guy.


      I agree.
      9 janv. 2021 à 18 h 59
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      Quoting: Saskleaf
      It's hard to tell. I think KK will be about as good as PLD in like 3 years. But he's still too young to know just how good he'll be. At the moment, I'd say PLD is worth more than him.


      Agree. At the moment. But you have to consider long term when you' re making trades of this caliber. A trade like this is a 5-10 year bet. Talk to me at the end of the year and see if KK is as good a PLD. I'm willing to bet they will be closer than you think. I'd also be willing to wait and find out. #notrade
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      9 janv. 2021 à 19 h 3
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      Quoting: HabsForEver
      If it's straight up I'm taking PLD all day every day. Maybe KK is better than him at one point, but I'm going with the surefire guy.


      Of course you are. Because you are looking at right now. No GM makes trades like this without considering the long term. No question at this moment in time PLD is better. No debate. The question is who is the more complete player in 3-5 years? It's like when MB trade Subban for Weber. At the time Subban looked like the better player. Who would you rather have today? Who is better for your team?
      9 janv. 2021 à 19 h 20
      #17
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      Quoting: HabsRealGM
      Agree. At the moment. But you have to consider long term when you' re making trades of this caliber. A trade like this is a 5-10 year bet. Talk to me at the end of the year and see if KK is as good a PLD. I'm willing to bet they will be closer than you think. I'd also be willing to wait and find out. #notrade


      Oh course. But I'm just not sure if in 3-5 years that KK will be better than PLD.
      9 janv. 2021 à 19 h 24
      #18
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      Quoting: HabsRealGM
      Of course you are. Because you are looking at right now. No GM makes trades like this without considering the long term. No question at this moment in time PLD is better. No debate. The question is who is the more complete player in 3-5 years? It's like when MB trade Subban for Weber. At the time Subban looked like the better player. Who would you rather have today? Who is better for your team?


      I'm thinking 100% long term. It's not like Dubois is 28 or 29 and already out of his Prime, we are comparing two players here who are 2 years apart and we both know Montreal's development problems. In the perfect world, Kotkaniemi maxes out at PLD's level, and that's best case. Like I said, I'd rather go with Dubois because he guarantees we are getting a good 1C.

      Who is the more complete player? I'm going with PLD because there's no surefire shot that KK becomes anything better than a 3C. This doesn't compare to the PK vs Weber trade whatsoever, I said MB won the trade when he made the deal and I say he won it now. Subban wasn't the better player then and he sure as hell isn't now.
      9 janv. 2021 à 20 h 31
      #19
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      Quoting: HabsForEver
      I'm thinking 100% long term. It's not like Dubois is 28 or 29 and already out of his Prime, we are comparing two players here who are 2 years apart and we both know Montreal's development problems. In the perfect world, Kotkaniemi maxes out at PLD's level, and that's best case. Like I said, I'd rather go with Dubois because he guarantees we are getting a good 1C.

      Who is the more complete player? I'm going with PLD because there's no surefire shot that KK becomes anything better than a 3C. This doesn't compare to the PK vs Weber trade whatsoever, I said MB won the trade when he made the deal and I say he won it now. Subban wasn't the better player then and he sure as hell isn't now.


      Agree to disagree I guess. I think KK is definitely better than a 3C. I think we've only seen a small sample size and from what I've seen he has all skills to be a 1C or 2C, he just hasn't put it together yet. Up till now he's been a kid. He got drafted 3rd overall for a reason. Everyone develops slightly different. 2 years is a big difference when you're talking about 22 vs. 19.I haven't seen enough PLD to know all his intangibles but I'm pretty high on KK as a pretty complete player. Don't see the need at this point to make a trade if CBJ want KK +... Too much to lose when you could hold onto the chips you have. Agree, Weber much better then and now. It is similar situation though.
      9 janv. 2021 à 20 h 47
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      Quoting: HabsRealGM
      Agree to disagree I guess. I think KK is definitely better than a 3C. I think we've only seen a small sample size and from what I've seen he has all skills to be a 1C or 2C, he just hasn't put it together yet. Up till now he's been a kid. He got drafted 3rd overall for a reason. Everyone develops slightly different. 2 years is a big difference when you're talking about 22 vs. 19.I haven't seen enough PLD to know all his intangibles but I'm pretty high on KK as a pretty complete player. Don't see the need at this point to make a trade if CBJ want KK +... Too much to lose when you could hold onto the chips you have. Agree, Weber much better then and now. It is similar situation though.


      For KK being better than a 3C, I'm talking about right now. There are no guarantees he develops into anything more. There's a real good shot he does, but nothing is guaranteed. I'm not saying KK is a bust or anything (Way too early to even consider that), I'm just talking about who will be the better player. Dubouis is 22 so everything you are saying about KK is the same for PLD. Neither players are even in their primes yet.
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