Habs 2010
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Forum: Armchair-GM28 jui à 14 h 10
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>DirtyDangle</b></div><div>he's played 171 games in the league and he's only got 31 points. he was on pace for less than 20 this season. he's not productive enough to be an offensive defenseman. he's too small and not good enough defensively to make it as an all around guy. montreal has a bottom-5 ld in the league and mete might not even crack that. why would a team give up anything more than that for him? he's a dime a dozen player.</div></div>

Ok... would love to hear what you think Vince Dunn's trade value is. I see a lot of people making trade for him to the habs on this site.

Dunn had 13 5v5 pts in 71 games this year, 0.183 5v5 pts per game.

Mete had 10 5v5 pts in 51 games this year, 0.196 5v5 pts per game.

Dunn also received 55% OZ starts while Mete only received 45%. Dunn is used as an offensive defenseman and Mete is used as a defensive defenseman (for his speed and transition), yet Mete is on par with Dunn at 5v5?

What's more, Mete is only 21 and Dunn is 23. That's just one example, there are countless examples around the league. 5v5 production for defenseman is generally low, what makes the difference is powerplay time, something Mete gets almost exclusively none of. There is a huge misconception that because Mete is small that he is an offensive defensman and that he is weak defensively. Mete is better defensively than offensively, but he would be more than adequate offensively if the habs used him in that role.

I don't even get what you are arguing. The athletics stats guy has a model which using advanced statistics to determine a players value. At 21 years old his model already classifies Mete as a solid 2nd pairing defenseman.

You would trade that for a 4th round pick? What are the odds of a 4th round pick even making the NHL?
Forum: Armchair-GM28 jui à 8 h 47
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>DirtyDangle</b></div><div>tatar - 1st, 3rd, c-prospect
danault - 1st, 2nd, cond 3rd(if team wins cup)
armia - 2nd, 4th
byron - 4th
lehkonen - 2nd
weal - late pick or waivers
kulak - mid or late pick
hudon - nothing
mete - 4th</div></div>

Mete 4th?

"Like Pittsburgh, Montreal’s second pair is also anchored by a strong two-way defender though this time it’s the much more experienced Jeff Petry who led the team with a 56 percent expected goals rate. He looks to be paired with Victor Mete who is the only defender other than Weber to be above break-even in both actual and expected goals percentage. He has a bright future and grades out as a solid second-pairing defender for now." - Athletic Dom stats guy

Statistics already show Mete is a "Solid Second Pairing Defender" and he is only in his 21 year old season.

Honestly, Mete is so under appreciated. Despite playing on non playoff habs teams in every season of his career he is always a + player and among the leaders of defenseman in +/-. This while getting the most defensive zone starts / 60 on the team.

Also his 5 on 5 production is right there with most defensman around the league, but he gets no powerplay time so his offensive numbers seem underwhelming. If he played powerplay he would be like Jared Spurgeon. Seriously, look where Jared Spurgeon was at 21 years old.

It's actually funny he gets no powerplay time considering how bad Montreals powerplay has been over the past three years, he should have gotten a chance at least. In his limited time, his powerplay P/60 is as good as Weber's over the least 3 years. Yet Weber is one of MTL's main PP guys.
Forum: Armchair-GM24 jui à 23 h 19
Sujet: Powerplay
Forum: Armchair-GM24 jui à 22 h 40
Sujet: Powerplay
Forum: Armchair-GM 9 jui à 11 h 17
Forum: Armchair-GM22 jun à 20 h 59
Forum: Armchair-GM22 jun à 10 h 57
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>ColonelX</b></div><div>Romanov regardless of whom he's playing with couldn't be sheltered if he's playing top pairing. If you want to shelter him you make him play bottom four with a steady/proven veteran, not 25 minutes a game against Kane, Crosby and McDavid. Second pair with Petry or a third pair with a UFA veteran (Looking at you Shattenkirk!) should be where Romanov begins his NHL career, he's hyped but still a rookie.</div></div>
I think the word "insulate" fits better in this case than the word "shelter".

Mete was playing with Weber as a 19 year old straight out of junior (no KHL experience, no WJC, etc.). Mete was also the best option out of Alzner, Benn, and Schlemko that year, the defence sucked, but having said that Mete did just fine finishing with a +5 on a terrible team.

I'd like to see Romanov with Weber to start. On paper it's a good fit; Romanov's mobility is an upgrade over Chiarot, his physical play is much better than Mete's. He is known for his defensive play so he should be able to handle playing against top players. He also has a good shot, something Mete didn't have (teams could cheat with Weber).

If it doesn't work out then you can change things around, we already know Mete and Chiarot can play with Weber. I want Romanov to get a real look in the NHL (Top 4 minutes with PP and PK) otherwise he is better off developing in the AHL. This organization needs Romanov to work out, so I'm willing to live with the rookie mistakes as long as he is being developed for the role they want him to play.
Forum: Armchair-GM18 jun à 11 h 13
Forum: Montreal Canadiens16 jun à 14 h 03
It's been 4 seasons since the trade, I just wanted to point out some of the financial details about the trade.

It's something most of us fans don't even think or care about, but hockey is a business, and looking back at this trade along with Subban's contract being signed, Bergevin did some pretty good financing for Molson.

Let's start by looking at Subbans 8 yr × $9M contract. Conveniently for MTL, the first two years of that contract paid Subban the lowest $ amount, $7M each year. Also conveniently, Subban was traded right before the year he started to make $11M, a $4M raise. Was this contract signed with the intention of trading Subban at this time, or was this just a coincidence? It's an uncommon contract structure, not to mention the NMC didn't kick in until this season. All in all, compared to the average cap hit, Bergevin saved $4M total by structuring the contract this way.

Now moving on to the Subban vs Weber contract, over the past 4 years Bergevin has saved $6M to bring the total to $10M. Over the next two remaining years of Subban's contract, another $4M will be saved, bringing the total savings of how Bergevin handled Subban to $14M. I remember back when Subban signed the deal and Bergevin was criticized for losing negotiations (mostly having to do with the bridge he made Subban signed). Although Bergevin put himself in a bad position for Subban's next contract, he still managed to handle it really well.

Considering Weber is looking like a better player than Subban right now, this trade seems like a significant win for Bergevin, if not in the eyes of the fans, in the eyes of Molson at the least.

There is no telling how Weber will age moving forward, but in the final 4 years of his contract he will only make $5M total. It's possible he retires before playing it out, but if not one would have to assume he is still an effective player, and if he is thats a huge bargain.
Forum: Armchair-GM15 jun à 7 h 57
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>mhockey91</b></div><div>Subban struggled his first regular season in Nashville
but again, he was great in the playoffs. Weber had the better regular season, but where it counted, Subban was better in the playoffs. Was Nashville that much better than Montreal in 2016/17? Idk about that. Nashville had a better defense, a similar forward group, but Price &gt; Rinne. After all, Nashville was the 8th seed. They really turned it on the playoffs.</div></div>

Subban had the better playoffs based on what exactly? Weber was essentially perfect for MTL in that playoff series against the rangers, MTL just didn't have it. Lundquist outplayed Price badly, but MTL had no offence. All they had was Radulov that year, and he went from 54 pts to 72 pts just by switching teams.

It's easy to get caught up in the hype of that Nashville run, but did you honestly watch Weber in the MTL vs NYR series? He had 3 pts in 6 games which pro-rates to 11 pts in 22 games vs Subban's 12 in 22. Additionally, if you had watched the series you would have seen Weber hit 3 posts and Lundquist get lucky with a puck to the head that he couldnt even react to. In the interviews Lundquist was in shock with how hard his shot was.

Then there was the game where Weber beat the snot out of JT Miller, and while he was in the box serving his fighting penalty the rangers scored like 3 goals while MTL didnt have Weber.

Weber was a beast all year, in year one he was clearly the better player in my opinion. Subban having a longer playoff run does not mean he was better in playoffs, I don't see how you can make that arguement (seeing as both players were good for their respective teams).

The optics of Subban in the cup final and then the Weber injury is what turned the trade for a while, but as soon as Weber returned it's been Weber again.

Weber's contract is miles better than Subban's too which is something many people don't understand or consider. It was one reason I was upset Initially with the trade (look at the term Weber had), but when I looked at the structure of the contract, there was nothing to worry about, it was actually genius.