"Attempting to buy low on players like Dubois and Laine" I don't think either of those trades are buying low.
2 middle 6 wingers for a middle 6 C on a bloated contract? No thanks.
Our best LHD/best defensive defenseman and one of our young, cost controlled wingers for a top 6 winger on a bloated contract with significant injury issues? No thanks.

You move the contract of Rakell in the deal and get significantly younger. Smith probably doesn't have a lot of value so it's a change of scenery for both teams. Hopefully playing on the same team with Crosby helps Dubois mature. Laine is a player who has scored 40 goals before and when healthy is a sniper. Pettersson is a loss but Megna has played well with Karlsson in the past and Chycrun becomes the top left side defenseman. This lineup uses 7 defenseman so paying Pettersson 5 million to share 35 minutes among 3 defenseman isn't a good use of cap space. If Dubois and Laine can get straightened out then you have two players in their mid 20's who could be cornerstone pieces after the current core is gone but also elevate the current roster to contender status. Puustinen isn't going to move the needle for this team and won't provide any use in a 4th line role but has some value and Koivunen has more upside.

chych has far far more value than Jarry, OTT decline

I'm sorry but this is awful lol

That defense is atrocious. You're sending away your best defensive defenseman and adding Brodie, which is not needed.

I have negative desire to acquire PLD and that contract. He's a locker room cancer.

OTT says no to that trade.

I could be interest in Laine, but not at the expensive of Pettersson.

Also Ned is not a starting goaltender.

I think this team being any good requires that Dubois and Laine both being healthy and playing up to their contracts. Going to be honest, I don't see it happening. It's a really really risky move that locks up a lot of cap space that I think can be used to improve the team on defense and in the bottom 6.

As for Megna, he and Karlsson played together as a top pairing on a bad team. He could do it in a pinch, but I think he's best suited in a depth role. This lineup still doesn't have a good enough blue line IMO.

We'd probably want something slightly nicer or a better fit than Puustinen back in that trade - maybe a mid pick - but otherwise that's a basis for Laine I'd strongly consider, given how much we need good defensive blueliners.

Maybe Owen Pickering? He’s Mateychuk’s cousin. Could add to Laine for that one. But agreed, I don’t hate a deal based in Laine for Pettersson.

Kings might do it

I’m not a fan.

What’s that extension going to look like? It’s easy for it to be too long and expensive, and not worth the trade if he’s only going to sign short term. I’m fine with Petersson, but not really with him being the centerpiece of a trade. Just feels like another straddle signing to me.

Even then, PIT’s prospect system is too thin (and I doubt
Dubas agrees to Yager or so), and their 1sts too compromised (does it go to SJ this year? If so, do they gamble on another window extending move with 2026’s 1st) and their future pick-quality too murky to make it feel like something will work.



Long live the PLD-validation 🙏

It's a top pairing only because someone has to be listed as being in spot number 1. In terms of who would play the most minutes on the left side it would be Chychrun and I would have him at about 25 minutes a game. This was also done with the idea of dressing 7 defenseman. So Megna, Gustafsson and Brodie are combining for about 35 minutes among the 3 of them. Gustafsson would get all the powerplay time possible so his split would ideally be 5 minutes on the powerplay and then 5 minutes of even strength ideally on offensive zone starts. That would leave 25 minutes for Megna and Brodie combined.

The defense is always going to be a problem with Letang and Karlsson both playing the right side and eating so much cap room. I'm going the assumption that they won't move those guys so changing the pieces around them are probably what's needed. While Pettersson is a very good defensive defenseman in this model it doesn't make sense to pay him a lot of money and he has more value in a trade for what he could bring back. He's a good player but it's about fit. Megna is a big body that excelled playing with Karlsson. Brodie blocks a lot of shots and is a better passer than Pettersson. I think a lot of the Penguins problems were because while Karlsson and Letang like to bring up the puck, opposing defenses don't have to fear their partners will do anything because they can't make outlet passes. This changes that. The power play is really the biggest issue with the Penguins and Gustafsson is a power play specialist.

Changing the pieces around the defenseman is needed in my mind. As stated I think playing 7 defenseman is the right move. In this scenario Pettersson is moved because his minutes are the ones being sacrificed and you free up his cap hut and he is one of the few players we have that would get back value in a trade. While Laine has his issues he is south of 30 and has multiple 30 goal seasons and a 40 goal season.

Ned is simply signed because you need someone and he has shown he can be a capable goalie. He's here in a tandem scenario with Campbell until Bloomqvist is ready.

Ottawa has to do something. They can't afford to run it back with the goalies they have. They need to make the playoffs next year. Jarry has far more value to them than moving Chychrun for draft picks. If they feel confident in Jarry for 4 seasons as their starter I think that's a fair price to pay for 1 season of Chychrun

The only trade here the penguins would be even remotely interested in is the OTT trade. But It's probably better off, Jarry for Chychrun with out over complicating it. Just let the teams swap cap.






you two are on some good smoke. Laine at this point isn't bringing you back Pettersson, let alone adding.
The penguins have no interest in destroying what's left of their defense for Laine. None at all.

I think that they would have interest in Jack Campbell. Dubas likes his guys and acquired Campbell originally. He tried hard to resign him but couldn't make it work. I think he would like a do over on Graves and if had a deal in place to move out Jarry I think Campbell makes sense as a bounce back guy in a trade of teams problem players. Most of these trades are change of scenery deals where both teams are looking to move their problem hoping the player coming back is a better fit. All these players were once productive and it's clear a lot of players are simply just not fits in certain situations. I think the Penguins would have interest because it accomplishes multiple goals. With guys like Laine and Dubois the team gets younger and also raises the talent level. Then it's up to coaching to maximize that talent Elite organizations can buy low on players and improve their performance. There certainly is a lot of risk from the Penguins view point but I don't see a different path to improve the team without being willing to take risks as if they just do the usual free agent tinkering then they will likely be life and death to make the playoffs again next year. I would rather target guys still in their prime and have performed than go after past their prime free agents or mid tier prospects that even if they hit will likely be low upside players.

I stopped at Jack Campbell. You are high as a kite or drunk.
They have 0 interest in Jack Campbell. They have 2 outstanding young goalie prospects in Blom and Murashov. They have no need for a goalie and that's that.
Pit has no interest in destroying what's left of their defense for Laine. That isn't an opinion that's a fact. MP is off the table. They don't really have chips they are going to give up for Laine.
Any Laine trade would look like Rackell for Laine. Or Smith for Laine.... which I don't see CBJ agreeing too.
They aren't trading away their 1st round picks, they aren't in position to. They aren't trading away their few good prospects.
Laine A. doesn't have the value to be worth those to Pit, B. he doesn't have the designer to sign in PIT long term. For the same reasons he's not willing to resign in CBJ.

Laine can't sign an extension. He's too far away from free agency to even have that discussion. Campbell for Graves is simply both teams moving their problems to another team. Campbell becomes a backup and if one of the younger prospects takes his spot when they are ready then that's no issue. Campbell goes on waivers and to the minors and they bank a little cap space. If Campbell returns to form then you can move him for a minimal return if the younger guys push him for a spot. The main reasoning is to move off of Graves contract which is negative value.

I didn't say anything about any team trading their first round pick. Most of these trades were simply about moving negative value contracts for other teams negative value contracts.

Given the shape of Pittsburghs defense I would say it's more likely than not that Pettersson is going to be moved this offseason. They already have a lot of money locked in for defense and handing out an extension for Pettersson would be a bad use of resources. If you can get get value for Pettersson it makes sense to move him and try and replace 90% of what he does with someone else at a lower cost. I personally value the idea of buying low on Laine because of his upside. If he has chemistry with Sid I could see a path to him having a 50 goal season. Not to mention he could be the trigger man that fixes the powerplay. Both those are far more valuable than anything Pettersson can provide. I'll gamble on players that can raise the ceiling of the team any day. Laine will, Pettersson just keeps the floor higher. The Penguins are a better defensive team (13th) than they are an offensive team (19th) Everyone will be a year older next season so increasing the offense is much more likely to improve the teams fortunes next year. Lain is probably worth a 20 goal upgrade to this team. I think you can replace Pettersson with a player that maybe isn't as good but won't be a 20 goal negative to what Pettersson prevents.

Pettersson has more value to a championship contending team or a team that has a deep prospect pool and hopes to turn their fortunes around in a year or two. The Penguins are not that team. Hanging onto Pettersson for the teams post core dark days would be a massive mistake.

there is 0 chance MP is moved this offseason. 0.
Graves isn't a problem or a cap dump, he has the lowest goals against per 60 in 5v5 play of any defenseman on the penguins.

Your takes are really bad.

Has a team ever run 11 forwards/7 defenseman for an entire year? I can't even remember a team doing it for more than a couple games at a time.

I'd pass on the Kings trade. As much as I agree that Rakell and Smith have struggled, I'd rather keep them and hope they bounce back than bring in PLD. Unless OTT can dump Korpisalo, I think that would be a tough trade to make. Easy no on the CBJ trade for the Pens. Pettersson is invaluable to this team

Genuine question - are you related to Graves in some way? Because he is a problem - he's had a bad season. Maybe he can turn it around and get back to the very average defenseman he's been previously, but you have to acknowledge he's been bad this year.

And it's hilarious that you would say other people's takes are really bad.

I'm a former defenseman, I know what a "bad" defenseman looks like.... it ain't Graves.
You keep wanting to rip the guy who doesn't cough up goals and plays hard minutes.
Grass isn't greener on the other end.
He's not a 1LD... get over that, everyone knew that when they signed him at 4.5 because no 1LD is signing that.
Your problem is you just don't know what an average 2LD looks like.
Just for a comparable look at Oleksiak. It's almost the exact comparable except Graves is far better.
You don't have a bad player or a bad contract. What you have is a bad expectation and a willingness to blame 1 guy and not the others.
Instead of just targeting 1 guy because that's what the others do, maybe go be real about the play.
oiGA/60
Graves 2
MP 2.6
EK 2.6
Letang 2.8
The rest aren't even worth mentioning because they are AHL level.

I know you don't get this, but the more the season went on, the more Graves got more and more shifts in his own end because he's really the best defender they have and the one guy they actually trusted to shut it down. And he did.

So maybe instead of telling us all how "bad" he is, you should try not chasing another good defender out of PIT.
You sound like the people who chased out Cole, Mattheson, and Dumo.
None of which were smart moves by this team. So just put a sock in it about how "bad" he is.
There are many worse defensemen on the team.
Let me know when you are ready to start on the AHL collective of POJ, Ludvig, Shea, and Ivany.
Who are all FAR more problematic on the ice than Graves is.

Obviously you don't. Yes - it is - this season. No - I'm ripping the guy who is having a bad season - the same thing everybody else is doing that has watched this team play. You are the only person on planet Earth defending Graves.
Dude - nobody ever called him a 1LD. Stop saying that. You just completely made that up and then keep trying to use it as a deflection.
No actually I do - so I guess I don't have a problem then. Your current problem is making up strawmans that nobody else has ever said and then arguing against the nonsense that you made up.
No - it's a player having a bad season and therefore a bad contract. There's no bad expectations here. Nowhere did I blame one guy - but sick strawman. Again.

Since you love numbers why don't you look at on ice save % - which is the entire reason Graves GA/60 is as low as it is. Maybe if you took 2 seconds to look at the entire picture instead of cherry picking one stat to base your entire argument on, you'd see where you're wrong. Also, you realize there's a whole different side of the game right? Right? And there you go with the AHL nonsense again haha.

Correct - I don't get something you just completely made up and isn't even remotely correct.

It's not bad in quotes - it's just bad. He's had a bad season. I'm not chasing a good defender out Pittsburgh. You sound like the alt accounts on twitter that made there account just to argue with people instead of living in reality. How about I don't put a sock in it for giving a factual statement. Is there? Who? 3rd pair guys making league min? That's who you're comparing him to? That's your genius proof that he isn't having a bad season? Yikes dude that's just embarrassing. Please tell me you're just trolling

Are you kidding me?
People have literally said on here they wanted Graves to come in and "shut down" the other teams "top line"....
Say I want a 4.5 mil 1LD with out saying 1LD....So no that's no straw man argument. People wanted him to come be THE shutdown guy. Well you got a 2LD.

on ice save%.... It's the same Freaking goalie...
Maybe the save% is better because he doesn't F give up high danger shots left and right which is why they bleed a goal more per game.
Maybe the save% is better because he doesn't wander half way across the rink leaving his goalie in a bad position.
Maybe the save% is better because he doesn't just stand there and watch the play happen without doing anything.

Did you ever think their play might be a reason for that difference when it's the EXACT same goalie behind them?
Or are we suppose to believe that the goalie goes...OMG Graves is out here I have to play great...and then just takes the time off when he's off the ice?

Or maybe it's those mistakes like watching the puck go past them in a must win game right into a high danger area that is causing them to lose games?

I mean call me crazy but I've seen enough.

I watch POJ wander all over the ice like he expects someone else to clear the front of the net out ever damn game. Like why be in front of the net...someone else will do that right?

While Pens fans give straw man arguments about how Graves is demoted to 3rd pairing... while playing 18-20 minutes a night and the 3rd pairing guys are out there for 12.

Maybe if anyone of them was actually capable of playing in their own end, Graves wouldn't have to be in his own end every damn shift.
In the mean time lets all make some more ACGM where POJ is a 1LD playing with Letang, but he can't even be trusted to PK.

I really hate to break it to you, the problems on defense, aren't Graves.
You can start with Ludvig, Shea, Ivvany, and POJ. Because collectively the 4 of them are worth maybe 1/2 a bag of pucks.
EK, should never be left to play in his own zone. He's not capable of it.
Letang has a history of very stupid decision making. But because we can't hide him in the Ozone like they use to, as they now have to hide EK there, we see those errors more and more.
Fact is this team has 2 to 2 1/2 players who can actually play in their own zone to any level of useful ness. Graves and MP. They are usually saddled with poor help from their partner.

I'm gonna need to see some evidence on that. I mean there's obviously some weirdos out there - but I haven't seen anyone say that. No - it's a strawman. And that's not what people wanted. They wanted him to be the 2nd pair guy. Everybody and their mother knows Pettersson was the 1LD.

"It's the same goalie" - did you think this was some great point or something? And we know 100% that's not maybe the case. He has the 2nd worst SCA/60 on the team. Just because it's the same goalie doesn't mean it's the same goalie play. Yes - I did think that. But unlike you I actually looked to see if that was the case. And it's not. Please tell me you don't actually think "it's the same goalie" is an argument? That's one of the worst arguments I have ever heard. Like you genuinely think that a goalie plays the same in front of every single player throughout an entire season? You think every player would have the same on ice sv%? That makes no sense.

We have irrefutable evidence that it's not those mistakes though. You're just incorrect. Okay - you're crazy.

Clearly you don't have any idea what strawman argument means haha. So I wouldn't use that phrase. And he was demoted for periods of time.

Graves isn't even capable of playing in his own end. And maybe if he didn't have a terrible season - people wouldn't be pointing it out.

I really hate to break it to you, but Graves has been a problem. This is just objectively true. Every single person agrees except you. And you are incapable of proving otherwise. Why in the world are you comparing Graves to league min 3rd pair defenseman? That is an absolutely horrendous point.

And yet EK has been better in his own zone this season than Graves. Not to mention EK isn't here to play in his own zone. There is an entirely different facet of the game that he is elite at that you are conveniently leaving out. You can't include Graves with Pettersson - not based on the season he's had. He's shown no signs that he can play in his own zone either. Dude - Graves is the poor help lol

I'm not going back to dig up proof. People have said it, and that has been the attitude.
People have acted that he was the "Dumo replacement" The 1LD who would come in and shut people down. If you can't admit that I don't know what to tell you.
It was a foolish view of that signing then and it remains it. No one is singing a 1LD for that cost. No one. The pens were fortunate to get Dumo at that low contract for years. Then turned around and treated him poorly while coming off a broken ankle.

The goalie play is the law of averages. Which balance out in 70+ games. If you think he plays 1 way for 1 guy and another for another that just isn't how it is. It's like saying the goalie always played bad for Jack Johnson. No. Jack Johnson was just a bad defenseman. Which effected the goalies numbers. Not the other way around.
It's no difference here. If the goalie play was dragging down 1 defense man, it would drag down multiple.
It's a many to 1 and 1 to many relationship

Graves was never demoted. You go find me the game he played 5th or 6th minutes a night.
He's consistently been3rd or 4th in minutes all year

Not going back because you can't you mean. No - that hasn't been the attitude. Yes - the Dumo replacement. As in Dumo is leaving and they are bringing in another LHD. Really not that hard to understand bud. Also, Pettersson was the 1LD last year anyway. So your point is moot multiple ways. Nobody said Graves was the 1LD who would come in and shut people down. If you can't admit that - I don't know what to tell you. Stop making things up or something like that maybe? I obviously can't admit to something that isn't true. It's not foolish - it's made up. By you. Correct - nobody is. You're just helping my point. Thanks for that. Dumo wasn't treated poorly - he was a fan favorite and team favorite. It's like you don't follow this team at all.

Yes - that is how it is. Different players will have different on ice sv%. It's not all going to be equal. If there was any proof that it was based on his play then I would admit it - but there isn't any. Yeah and Ryan Graves has been a bad defenseman this year.

Dude he was literally demoted to play with Ruhwedel. I'm starting to think you just don't follow this team at all. Idk why you're so adamant to say Graves has been good when he obviously hasn't

again people have stated this, when he was signed and afterwards. The burden is not on me to find the posts. They are there. if this site allowed search it would be easy to find, but sadly it does not.

B. saying "he was demoted" when his ice time never went down means nothing, his role changed, not his ice time.
I'm going to say this again. Show me your statistical proof he's a bad defenseman. You keep thinking the burden is on me to prove he's good. I've laid out the numbers and show what happened on the ice.

Where is your proof he's a bad defense man other than the already disproven theory of "he was demoted" which isn't true. Every night he still got more ice time than POJ, Shea, Ludvvig and Chad R or what ever other 3rd pairing guys there were. You can't point to the game, where he did not get injured, where that's not true. So his ice time clearly wasn't demoted. His role just shifted to make up for the bad 3rd pairing which was bleeding a ton of goals. So by all means, point the games out where his ice time was 5th or 6th for defenseman. aka 3rd pairing aka demotion. If you can't it's a dead argument.

So where is your stats that prove that a guy who gets mainly defensive starts in a shut down role as your own number have show, is a "bad" defenseman at the 2LD level.
If you are going to call it, you must prove it. The burden isn't the other way around. I have shown how he isn't and how his numbers are what should be expected. Now the burden is on you.
If you can't prove it. The convo is over.