I mean I'm not really giving up hope yet. Atleast we aren't buying into a team that we know is garbage. These are the growing pains of retooling a roster to fit a different mindset, like the 2019-20 Leafs. I have no doubt they'll figure it out, and I am a fan of Treliving's roster construction philosophies (that Calgary blueline was a work of art). I can't say that the results this season have really been surprising, and atleast the core is locked up so we don't have to worry about them

I'm not giving up yet. Whether that belief is blissful ignorance or not is yet to be seen, but I think the Leafs will be fine. Keefe will finish this season as head coach, the Leafs will make no major moves at the TDL (maybe a Robertson / Timmins prospect swap of sorts?), and we will get bounced in the first round of the playoffs. It'll be the same old story as always.

I personally like to think that the lack of success recently has fallen largely on our goaltending. This team will be fine when Woll is back. I also believe that this kind of forward group is EXACTLY what Treliving wants, but the blueline is still a long ways off. That'll be the priority this summer. For now, I want to see some strategic long term additions. Give me Alex Texier, give me Brandon Duhaime, give me Mario Ferraro (unless he costs more than like a 2nd round pick combined). Just be smart with our assets, that's all I want

I mean I'm not really giving up hope yet. Atleast we aren't buying into a team that we know is garbage. These are the growing pains of retooling a roster to fit a different mindset, like the 2019-20 Leafs. I have no doubt they'll figure it out, and I am a fan of Treliving's roster construction philosophies (that Calgary blueline was a work of art). I can't say that the results this season have really been surprising, and atleast the core is locked up so we don't have to worry about them

I'm not giving up yet. Whether that belief is blissful ignorance or not is yet to be seen, but I think the Leafs will be fine. Keefe will finish this season as head coach, the Leafs will make no major moves at the TDL (maybe a Robertson / Timmins prospect swap of sorts?), and we will get bounced in the first round of the playoffs. It'll be the same old story as always.

I personally like to think that the lack of success recently has fallen largely on our goaltending. This team will be fine when Woll is back. I also believe that this kind of forward group is EXACTLY what Treliving wants, but the blueline is still a long ways off. That'll be the priority this summer. For now, I want to see some strategic long term additions. Give me Alex Texier, give me Brandon Duhaime, give me Mario Ferraro (unless he costs more than like a 2nd round pick combined). Just be smart with our assets, that's all I want

Lastly, as a full on Sheldon Keefe hater, he is not the problem right now. This is a bad roster construction

On the roster construction part yep, right there with you.

I remember you and I wanted Keefe gone at least a year ago and that didn't happen and really nothing has changed as far as I'm concerned except that I don't see a point to get rid of Keefe mid season because I don't believe the coaches currently available are good fits for this roster.

I do believe Keefe is a problem but there's many problems and he just happens to be part of a long list.

It's like being stuck between a rock and a hard place.

I could not be more on the other side of this thought process but I appreciate you still having faith 🤜

I am petrified we are entering the world of the “mushy middle” in the NHL.

We have Auston Matthews on pace for 67 goals, Nylander on pace for 111 points, Marner on pace for 92 points, Rielly is on pace for 14 goals 69 points (his highest since 18/19) and every single addition Treliving has made is terrible.

This team is actually in danger of missing the playoffs. That’s fukcin nuts.

Tyler Bertuzzi for all his super underlining numbers has less goals than Morgan Rielly.

Max Domi has no natural fit on this roster.

David Kampf is dragging down everyone he plays with.

John Klingberg was a disaster.

Ryan Reaves is a disaster.

Noah Gregor is fast, with no idea what do to next

I have zero faith in Treliving’s ability to build around this group and we are totally fukced now because everyone of consequence that you could move has a full NMC.

I am definitely half glass empty

Lastly, as a full on Sheldon Keefe hater, he is not the problem right now. This is a bad roster construction

The refs are not good tonight

Let's be real...

Leafs were the better team last night, so why are we all frustrated...

EDM lucking the refs were so awful (i.e. allowing them to punch Rielly in the head or high stick Matthews or slash Gregor or pick on Marner etc.)

I mean if you think last night is the only reason for some of us having frustration, not sure what to say.

I guess beauty is in the eyes of the beholder but for a team you believe was the better team last night:

ozone time of possession EDM: 10:50
ozone time of possession TOR: 6:53

I honestly don’t see how we improve much without moving on from Shanny

Yeah, bc Toronto was up in the game was early that they were playing conservatively...

Then factor in Matthews post, Skinner SOY candidate, etc. and the Leafs were the better team

And then, factor in that the Oilers should've have had a 2 minutes interference for screening (JT much?) and a high stick on Matthews which would have prevent a 2+ minutes shift from Benoit which would have stopped the winning goal from happening... And the 1rst goal being horses**t from Jones. Leafs were the better team

Now, I acknowledge that the better team doesn't always win game like in this instance so what's my solution?

Truthfully, couldn't tell you... Bc the issue was that the Leafs didn't trade a player when their value is at his highest and now his current play makes him unmovable

I guess you'd have to start thinking about Keefe, but the only solution there is Gallant but 2/4 of the core 4 don't like being told they need to start playing hard so Shanny won't do it...

Hes a 1 year wonder coach hell nah

His system basically works for one year then comes down to earth the following year

Were not gonna go sign this guy to fire him after 2 years like VGK and NYR did

You mean when they'll be a better solution to the problem?

In general MLSE wont want to go get a coach thats gonna be fired in only 2 years

They gonna want someone for at least 4 years

As we cant keep getting new coaches.

Gallant's a guy whose system is a 1 year wonder. We dont need that

And your solution is another 1 year coach or a coach who's worse than Keefe?

Berube is better than Keefe lul

Who has a cup?

Keefe hes got the handshake cup

1 year wonder right there...

Then right back to 1rst and 2nd round exits he goes

Berube is better than Keefe lul

Who has a cup?

Keefe hes got the handshake cup

Tor really cant claim back to 2nd round exits when they only acheived it once since the Matthews era

Berube with the blues = cup, 2nd round, 1st round, 2nd round. Lot of the later struggles came thanks to Binnington and roster construction afterwards.

Thats better than Keefe's record Qualifying Round Loss, 1st round, 1st round, 1st round, 2nd round. Keefe should have been fired after the MTL series but nope Dubas didnt want his buddy to go heck Cassidy was available but nope

Give Berube these guys to work with he will get em further as look what he did for a Blues team outside a playoff spot, was fighting eachother during practice, and who almost a week before sold the TDL contemplated selling.

16 and 10 playoff run and a game 7 win over Bruins for first cup since 1967

As when we look at cup winners last 5 years hes up there

Berube
Cooper x 2
Bednar
Cassidy

That's a lazy reason

Babcock had cups
Carlyle had a cup

Vegas and Avalanche won with Bruce Cassidy and Jared Bednar as first time winners

Reality is that none of us are in the leafs' dressing room and none of us know what type of coaching personality is going to be able to come in, implement a system that we can win with, and get the players to buy in.

Maybe that's Berube...maybe it's friggin Doug Gilmour for all I know....maybe it's Keefe and he just needs guys that can play defense and a goalie to stop the puck.

Part of me thinks that Shanny needs to walk into the room and tell these guys that they aren't getting a new coach and they aren't getting any re-enforcements in. If they care about winning then the solution needs to come from within the group and someone needs to step the f* up and lead the charge. Stop waiting for someone else to fix the problem for them...go out and fight for a win

That's a lazy reason

Babcock had cups
Carlyle had a cup

Vegas and Avalanche won with Bruce Cassidy and Jared Bednar as first time winners

Reality is that none of us are in the leafs' dressing room and none of us know what type of coaching personality is going to be able to come in, implement a system that we can win with, and get the players to buy in.

Maybe that's Berube...maybe it's friggin Doug Gilmour for all I know....maybe it's Keefe and he just needs guys that can play defense and a goalie to stop the puck.

Part of me thinks that Shanny needs to walk into the room and tell these guys that they aren't getting a new coach and they aren't getting any re-enforcements in. If they care about winning then the solution needs to come from within the group and someone needs to step the f* up and lead the charge. Stop waiting for someone else to fix the problem for them...go out and fight for a win