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10 Game Progress Report

Créé par: A_K
Équipe: 2023-24 Blues de St-Louis
Date de création initiale: 27 oct. 2023
Publié: 6 nov. 2023
Mode - plafond salarial: Basique
Description
Recap:
Blues are 5-4-1
4th in the central
19th in the NHL

The Good:
The last 2 games. I waited for 10 games because I remember Ken Hitchcock preaching that it was the correct number to analyze. Luckily they played much better hockey in #9 and #10 because 1-8 were mostly depressing.

Binnington is seeing the puck very well. Depending on perspective, that can be good or bad. But overall, nice to see him going for a bounce back after his numbers have gotten worse each season before this. My favorite criticism of Binner is that he's a one-hit wonder, in a world of mostly zero-hit wonder goalies.

Blues are 7th best in GA/GP at 2.7. The advanced stats don't really support the narrative that the defense is very much improved. But Colton Parayko has bounced back in a massive way - the best d-man on the depth chart. He's still getting tough deployment but thanks to some changes to the system and added commitment to defending the slot, Parayko once again looks like a top pair shutdown guy.

The Bad:
While the system changes have reduced the scoring chances against, the offense has been pretty horrible as a result. Berube has doubled down on the "dumb it down" approach and it has made a lot of the games nearly unwatchable in my opinion. The Blues are one of the worst teams in the NHL in real possession, corsi, xG, eye test... however you want to slice it they cannot hang with good teams unless the goalie stands on his head.

I wish there was a narrative at the 10-game mark that Kyrou and Thomas have taken over ownership of this team, but we are still waiting. However, we may not have to wait much longer because Kyrou was dominant last game and Thomas looks like he's gaining some confidence.

The Ugly:
The powerplay going an abysmal 1 for 27. Just despicable. If you're going to try to play low-event, defensive hockey, you have to win the special teams battle. I think teams are more dangerous shorthanded than the Blues are on their PP.

25 GF in 10 GP is 4th worst in the NHL.

I didn't think getting Kevin Hayes at $3.5m for next to nothing could have been a bad thing. 10 games in it looks like a bad move. He's so slow and he doesn't play with any sort of urgency; he's not useful on either special teams package; and there are 2 more seasons after this one. I liked the other cheap, stopgap pick-ups (Vrana/Kapanen/Blais) because the term avoided commitment and they increased our overall team speed. This one is feels different; seems like Army found himself yet another immovable contract to add to his pile.

I hate to say it but Marco Scandella is no longer an NHL-caliber defensemen and with younger, more able players on the roster who need to prove their worth, it's time he takes a seat in the press box or finds some feel-good value in helping the guys in Springfield.

The Verdict:
I think this is potentially a bottom five team this year. They may "overperform" (hate that term) and get closer to a playoff spot, but I don't take them very seriously. Immediately following the 2019 cup this has been one of the most poorly run franchises in the league. Awful pro scouting has led to some boneheaded decisions with respect to personnel and contracts, and the amateur scouting / draft choices don’t seem like they’re going to bail them out, at least not soon enough. Time for a more committed rebuild in my opinion. Otherwise they run a risk of being middle of the pack for a long time.

Some deadline possibilities are shown here. Thanks for reading!
Transactions
1.
STL
  1. Choix de 3e ronde en 2024 (NYI)
  2. Choix de 5e ronde en 2025 (CHI)
2.
STL
  1. Regula, Alec
  2. Choix de 3e ronde en 2025 (BOS)
BOS
  1. Hayes, Kevin (1 785 714 $ retained)
3.
STL
  1. Choix de 3e ronde en 2024 (CAR)
CAR
  1. Kapanen, Kasperi (1 600 000 $ retained)
4.
STL
  1. Choix de 2e ronde en 2024 (PIT)
PIT
  1. Vrána, Jakub (1 312 500 $ retained)
Transactions impliquant une retenue de salaire
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2024
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2025
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2026
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TAILLE DE LA FORMATIONPLAFOND SALARIALCAP HITEXCÉDENTS Info-bulleBONISESPACE SOUS LE PLAFOND SALARIAL
2283 500 000 $79 735 714 $20 000 $32 500 $3 764 286 $
Ailier gaucheCentreAilier droit
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835 833 $835 833 $
AG, AD
RFA - 2
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8 125 000 $8 125 000 $
C, AD
UFA - 8
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5 800 000 $5 800 000 $
AG, AD, C
M-NTC
UFA - 2
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4 500 000 $4 500 000 $
AG, AD
NTC
UFA - 3
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6 500 000 $6 500 000 $
C, AG
NTC
UFA - 5
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8 125 000 $8 125 000 $
AD
UFA - 8
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775 000 $775 000 $
AG
UFA - 1
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852 500 $852 500 $ (Bonis de performance32 500 $$32K)
C
RFA - 3
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775 000 $775 000 $
AD, C
UFA - 1
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762 500 $762 500 $
AG, C
UFA - 1
Logo de Blues de St-Louis
816 667 $816 667 $
C
RFA - 1
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1 250 000 $1 250 000 $
AG, AD
RFA - 2
Défenseur gaucherDéfenseur droitierGardien de but
Logo de Blues de St-Louis
4 000 000 $4 000 000 $
DG
NTC
UFA - 3
Logo de Blues de St-Louis
6 500 000 $6 500 000 $
DD
NTC
UFA - 7
Logo de Blues de St-Louis
6 000 000 $6 000 000 $
G
NTC
UFA - 4
Logo de Blues de St-Louis
775 000 $775 000 $
DG
RFA - 1
Logo de Blues de St-Louis
6 500 000 $6 500 000 $
DD
NTC
UFA - 4
Logo de Blues de St-Louis
775 000 $775 000 $
G
RFA - 2
Logo de Blues de St-Louis
6 500 000 $6 500 000 $
DG
NTC
UFA - 4
Logo de Blues de St-Louis
800 000 $800 000 $
DG/DD
RFA - 2
Laissés de côtéListe des blessés (IR)Liste des blessés à long terme (LTIR)
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775 000 $775 000 $
AG, AD
UFA - 2
Logo de Blues de St-Louis
3 275 000 $3 275 000 $
DG
M-NTC
UFA - 1

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6 nov. 2023 à 11 h 3
#1
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What would it take for Parayko?
6 nov. 2023 à 11 h 4
#2
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Dean simply isn’t ready
Him and Bolduc haven’t looked impressive in the AHL at all

They will be fine but I wouldn’t trade Hayes until we are confident they can take over

Also the Defense desperately needs a hanifin type dman to compliment Faulk and Parayko

I’d like to see but next season, Vrana, Kappy, Saad, Bortz, Krug, Leddy moved out and have the young guys start to take over
I’d like to keep blais and Alexandrov as our 13th 4th Fwds and Tucker as our 7th dman

Also we need a true shutdown guy in that 3RD role. Maybe a guy like Schenn
6 nov. 2023 à 11 h 5
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Quoting: matty_top_2_not_2
What would it take for Parayko?


A lot from any team
Doubt the blues move him anytime soon
6 nov. 2023 à 11 h 11
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Quoting: matty_top_2_not_2
What would it take for Parayko?


Such a polarizing question. On one hand, trading him would make the Blues defense crumble entirely, something I don't think they're willing to do (even if some people, including me, think they should). On the other hand, his play this season could be the ticket to getting out of that forever contract with some positive value. As for value, I never underestimate NHL GMs when it comes to big, defensive right shot defensemen. I think someone would pay up if he was ever on the block. I just don't see it happening though.
6 nov. 2023 à 11 h 21
#5
Craig Laughlin Fan
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Would be shocked to see any team pay a 2nd for Vrana, since St Louis got him for a 7th and he's already been scratched this year.
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6 nov. 2023 à 11 h 30
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Quoting: NoVaSpartan
Would be shocked to see any team pay a 2nd for Vrana, since St Louis got him for a 7th and he's already been scratched this year.


He got scratched after a bad turnover on an errant drop pass at the blue line. Not sure why he was held accountable when everyone else on the team does the same stuff. And Detroit selling him for nothing due to off-ice reasons shouldn't really determine his TDL value this year. If he continues how he has played in a Blues jersey - 18 pts in 28 GP under 15:00 per night - he should be a good deadline option for any team that needs a shooter.
6 nov. 2023 à 11 h 33
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No cap, no interest.
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6 nov. 2023 à 11 h 35
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Quoting: xercuses
Dean simply isn’t ready
Him and Bolduc haven’t looked impressive in the AHL at all

They will be fine but I wouldn’t trade Hayes until we are confident they can take over

Also the Defense desperately needs a hanifin type dman to compliment Faulk and Parayko

I’d like to see but next season, Vrana, Kappy, Saad, Bortz, Krug, Leddy moved out and have the young guys start to take over
I’d like to keep blais and Alexandrov as our 13th 4th Fwds and Tucker as our 7th dman

Also we need a true shutdown guy in that 3RD role. Maybe a guy like Schenn


Yeah I was really just showing what the team could look like if they do a hard sell at the deadline. Def wouldn't bring up Dean/Duc until then, if at all.

Buying out Krug and signing Hanifin would be a fun move if they think they can keep it going with this core. That's something I could see happening.
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6 nov. 2023 à 11 h 37
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Quoting: Gofnut999
No cap, no interest.


Be a lot cooler if you did cool
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6 nov. 2023 à 12 h 27
#10
pens1991
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A 2nd for Vrana? Lol. Maybe a 5th.
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6 nov. 2023 à 12 h 34
#11
mokumboi
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I need to run a few errands now (does bisuits and gravy count as an errand?), so I will comment more later... but bruh... climb down off the ledge and pull your head from the oven. They have a winning record and suddenly just remembered how to play Blues hockey this past weekend and a couple of their best players haven't even shown up yet. Bottom five is some major pessimism overload.
6 nov. 2023 à 12 h 35
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Quoting: pens1991
A 2nd for Vrana? Lol. Maybe a 5th.


Can argue about value till we're blue in the face but NHL GMs make the trades. Max Domi, Mikael Granlund, Lars Eller, Connor Brown... these guys all brought back 2nd rd picks. Thanks for reading!
6 nov. 2023 à 12 h 39
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Quoting: mokumboi
I need to run a few errands now (does bisuits and gravy count as an errand?), so I will comment more later... but bruh... climb down off the ledge and pull your head from the oven. They have a winning record and suddenly just remembered how to play Blues hockey this past weekend and a couple of their best players haven't even shown up yet. Bottom five is some major pessimism overload.


Nah, I'm not on the ledge, I'm just calling it how I see it. They are extremely lucky to get 11 points from the first 10 games. They get outshot every night and can't score goals. They can't defend even when the entire gameplan is to play defense. One (really good) game vs MTL and the other vs NJ on a travel-heavy back to back with no Hughes or Hischier isn't enough to convince me they're good. On to the next 10 games.
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6 nov. 2023 à 12 h 42
#14
Good Opinion Haver
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Binnington has been impressive. I was critical of him last year. Obviously the defense was bad but I felt Binnington had to shoulder some of the blame. I don't know how much the new system changes have really affected the Blues' defensively- I still feel they're very porous and the metrics would back that up. But Binnington is papering over those problems in a way he wasn't the last two years. I gotta give him props. I still don't expect him to be a .920+ goalie for the entire year, but if he's above league average that's a very strong development for a goalie that they're paying above league average.

With the offense, I really do think people (maybe including the Blues' front staff) really bought into Vrana/Kapanen/Blais' end of season performances, and ignored the elevated shooting percentages. They were good low cost bets to bring in, but were they a replacement for what Tarasenko and O"Reilly and Barbashev might have brought? I admit even I thought Vrana would be playing a lot better than he has been. I think Hayes is still finding his way, but I do think he's a perfectly serviceable 3C. 3x3.5 for a 3C is not bad.

The big problem with Hayes is that his role is redundant on the team because Schenn is playing like a 3C himself, at least at 5v5. I love his energy, I love what he brings to the table, I think it was a slam dunk to make him Captain. But he's looked over-exposed in the 2C spot this season. I hope it's just a slow start. He's currently on pace for less than 40 points.

I think where the offense has really suffered has been Kyrou. Yes he's been snakebitten. But everyone screaming about how bad he was defensively (on a team with two goalies below .900 and one of the worst defenses in the league) I think failed to consider that if we go down that road with him he might just be a player that ends up good at nothing. His defense has been better, but it's not anything spectacular. And now he's also not scoring. Again, maybe he's starting slow (and he's playing a lot of minutes with Schenn). You don't add a new dimension to your game overnight. But if this holds all year- is it going to have been worth it to turn your 8million dollar 30 goal scorer into a mediocre two way player?
6 nov. 2023 à 12 h 44
#15
Good Opinion Haver
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Quoting: A_K
Nah, I'm not on the ledge, I'm just calling it how I see it. They are extremely lucky to get 11 points from the first 10 games. They get outshot every night and can't score goals. They can't defend even when the entire gameplan is to play defense. One (really good) game vs MTL and the other vs NJ on a travel-heavy back to back with no Hughes or Hischier isn't enough to convince me they're good. On to the next 10 games.


yeah them winning those two games were fun to watch but I don't see how you could draw many conclusions from it, unless you just want to say it was a confidence boost. Even with their flaws the Blues should have beaten both of those teams once Hughes went down.

I certainly can't relate to the impulse of watching 8 games where they're mostly bad and then two games where they're pretty good and going "ah see, there's the team I know and love, we're back on track"
6 nov. 2023 à 12 h 53
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How’s big Kev looking? And my boy Alexandrov, anything good there?
6 nov. 2023 à 12 h 58
#17
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Quoting: TheEarthmaster
Binnington has been impressive. I was critical of him last year. Obviously the defense was bad but I felt Binnington had to shoulder some of the blame. I don't know how much the new system changes have really affected the Blues' defensively- I still feel they're very porous and the metrics would back that up. But Binnington is papering over those problems in a way he wasn't the last two years. I gotta give him props. I still don't expect him to be a .920+ goalie for the entire year, but if he's above league average that's a very strong development for a goalie that they're paying above league average.

With the offense, I really do think people (maybe including the Blues' front staff) really bought into Vrana/Kapanen/Blais' end of season performances, and ignored the elevated shooting percentages. They were good low cost bets to bring in, but were they a replacement for what Tarasenko and O"Reilly and Barbashev might have brought? I admit even I thought Vrana would be playing a lot better than he has been. I think Hayes is still finding his way, but I do think he's a perfectly serviceable 3C. 3x3.5 for a 3C is not bad.

The big problem with Hayes is that his role is redundant on the team because Schenn is playing like a 3C himself, at least at 5v5. I love his energy, I love what he brings to the table, I think it was a slam dunk to make him Captain. But he's looked over-exposed in the 2C spot this season. I hope it's just a slow start. He's currently on pace for less than 40 points.

I think where the offense has really suffered has been Kyrou. Yes he's been snakebitten. But everyone screaming about how bad he was defensively (on a team with two goalies below .900 and one of the worst defenses in the league) I think failed to consider that if we go down that road with him he might just be a player that ends up good at nothing. His defense has been better, but it's not anything spectacular. And now he's also not scoring. Again, maybe he's starting slow (and he's playing a lot of minutes with Schenn). You don't add a new dimension to your game overnight. But if this holds all year- is it going to have been worth it to turn your 8million dollar 30 goal scorer into a mediocre two way player?


IMO the major problem with Hayes is that there are 2 more years after this one. Even if he can find enough game to excel in the 3C role, is he going to be yet another immovable, declining asset holding the team back until 2027? Because the other "freebie" acquisitions are gone after this year (fingers crossed Army doesn't start another contract extension party). They aren't here and ready now, but Snuggerud, Dean, Bolduc all need to get NHL time in the next couple years and they have Dvorsky and Stenberg that should be ready soon after.

I tend to agree with you on Kyrou - it scares me how many people think he needs to be a Selke guy to be valuable - although I think there is a happy medium where he backchecks without sacrificing all of his offense solely because of his skating. He can get himself to a lot of spots on the ice to disrupt things and still get up the ice on attack. I think it comes down to the mental side, knowing where to be, where the puck is going, etc. - and maybe this is a dissenting opinion but I do think those type of things are teachable.
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6 nov. 2023 à 13 h 2
#18
Xercuses
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Quoting: A_K
Yeah I was really just showing what the team could look like if they do a hard sell at the deadline. Def wouldn't bring up Dean/Duc until then, if at all.

Buying out Krug and signing Hanifin would be a fun move if they think they can keep it going with this core. That's something I could see happening.


yea i havent checked in a week but through there first 7 games i think bolduc had one point and dean had none
6 nov. 2023 à 13 h 4
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Quoting: phillyjabroni
How’s big Kev looking? And my boy Alexandrov, anything good there?


Hayes is off to a slow start, literally and figuratively. Actually in preseason I really liked his combination with Blais and Vrana, but they've been moving lines around and he hasn't really driven the 3rd line enough for me to say he's been good.

Alexandrov plays a good game but he's not getting much time because they want the 4th line to be in-your-face physical and he plays more of a quick/smart/possession style. I hope the time in the PB doesn't stunt his development because I think he can be a good bot6 NHLer, maybe a 4C a la casey cizikas. Only played 18 min total so far this season.
6 nov. 2023 à 13 h 5
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Quoting: xercuses
yea i havent checked in a week but through there first 7 games i think bolduc had one point and dean had none


It ain't much better, I think Bolduc has 3 and Dean 1 through 11 GP.
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6 nov. 2023 à 13 h 6
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Quoting: A_K
Hayes is off to a slow start, literally and figuratively. Actually in preseason I really liked his combination with Blais and Vrana, but they've been moving lines around and he hasn't really driven the 3rd line enough for me to say he's been good.

Alexandrov plays a good game but he's not getting much time because they want the 4th line to be in-your-face physical and he plays more of a quick/smart/possession style. I hope the time in the PB doesn't stunt his development because I think he can be a good bot6 NHLer, maybe a 4C a la casey cizikas. Only played 18 min total so far this season.


Haha, yeah he’s going to play with next to zero pace moving through the NZ and especially in the ozone. When’s the sell off coming?
6 nov. 2023 à 13 h 7
#22
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Quoting: A_K
It ain't much better, I think Bolduc has 3 and Dean 1 through 11 GP.


lol
6 nov. 2023 à 13 h 17
#23
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Quoting: phillyjabroni
Haha, yeah he’s going to play with next to zero pace moving through the NZ and especially in the ozone. When’s the sell off coming?


I don't think the deadline sell off will be anything more than some of the UFA guys like Vrana, Kap, Bortuzzo, maybe Blais. And with the central division looking pretty lousy after COL and DAL, it may not happen at all. I think the FO is still hoping to slide into playoffs.
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6 nov. 2023 à 13 h 23
#24
Good Opinion Haver
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Quoting: A_K
IMO the major problem with Hayes is that there are 2 more years after this one. Even if he can find enough game to excel in the 3C role, is he going to be yet another immovable, declining asset holding the team back until 2027? Because the other "freebie" acquisitions are gone after this year (fingers crossed Army doesn't start another contract extension party). They aren't here and ready now, but Snuggerud, Dean, Bolduc all need to get NHL time in the next couple years and they have Dvorsky and Stenberg that should be ready soon after.

I tend to agree with you on Kyrou - it scares me how many people think he needs to be a Selke guy to be valuable - although I think there is a happy medium where he backchecks without sacrificing all of his offense solely because of his skating. He can get himself to a lot of spots on the ice to disrupt things and still get up the ice on attack. I think it comes down to the mental side, knowing where to be, where the puck is going, etc. - and maybe this is a dissenting opinion but I do think those type of things are teachable.


They Hayes thing would worry me more if I thought the Blues were contenders now. If they were a contending team that needed a 3C and they got Hayes and this is how he was performing, that would be concerning. But the Blues aren't that good, and unless Armstrong gets aggressive they're probably not going to be that good for a few years. I think having a veteran center around to soak up some minutes, and shelter the young guys for a few years isn't so bad. Although, like I said, I thought Schenn kinda filled that role already so what can you do.

But as far as "holding the Blues back", I've got five or six contracts I'm more worried about before his, frankly. But certainly if he plays like this through the end of the year though, I won't be as nonchalant about it.
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6 nov. 2023 à 13 h 52
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Modifié 6 nov. 2023 à 14 h 3
Ok so I totally see your point. However, there is no way this team is a bottom five team. Blues hockey is not like most other teams play style. Locker room chemistry and the gelling of a team is arguably more important than point production. There are many issues with this team, yes and are they a playoff team, doubt it, but this season has showed me they are capable of being competitive. I would rather have trouble scoring yet play good defense and help out Binner and Hofer. I think Thomas has been the best forward this year and has taken some good steps. I think its still early and this team needs more time to gel. I think they're in a limbo spot right now but I see no reality where they embrace a deep rebuild.
mokumboi a aimé ceci.
 
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