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Toronto Maple Leafs 2022 2023 Season Discussion (Part 3)

23 févr. 2023 à 18 h 20
#1176
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Quoting: aadoyle
**** would have loved Clifton

But man a 1st + 2nd + 3rd + Smith for Orlov and Hatthaway paying for ROR doesnt seem so bad


Nah that's a great trade for Orlov + Hathaway. Terrific value
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23 févr. 2023 à 18 h 56
#1177
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24 févr. 2023 à 0 h 3
#1178
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Per The Athletic:

What are Kekalainen’s options? Edmonton, Los Angeles, and Toronto are all said to be seeking help on defense, but it’s possible that the Gavrikov return will be minimized now that there are fewer teams involved in the bidding.


If Gavrikov's price comes down from the ~Savard deal, I'd be all over that. If we actually do wind up trading Sandin for forward help, I'd run a defense group as follows:

Rielly - Brodie
Gavrikov - Liljegren
Giordano - Holl

I'm not sure what forwards are available that would cost Sandin (Laughton?), or how much the ask on Gavrikov has become, but it's an interesting thought. I know Gavrikov isn't a very well liked target on this forum, but I'm still a believer. Gavrikov and Liljegren could be real nice together. That being said, I am also firmly against trading Sandin. This roster would be real nice if Sandin is actually on the way out:

Bunting - Matthews - Nylander
Tavares - O'Reilly - Marner
Engvall - Laughton - Jarnkrok
Aston Reese - Kampf - Acciari

Rielly - Brodie
Gavrikov - Liljegren
Giordano - Holl
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24 févr. 2023 à 0 h 27
#1179
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Quoting: Nathaniel
Per The Athletic:

What are Kekalainen’s options? Edmonton, Los Angeles, and Toronto are all said to be seeking help on defense, but it’s possible that the Gavrikov return will be minimized now that there are fewer teams involved in the bidding.


If Gavrikov's price comes down from the ~Savard deal, I'd be all over that. If we actually do wind up trading Sandin for forward help, I'd run a defense group as follows:

Rielly - Brodie
Gavrikov - Liljegren
Giordano - Holl

I'm not sure what forwards are available that would cost Sandin (Laughton?), or how much the ask on Gavrikov has become, but it's an interesting thought. I know Gavrikov isn't a very well liked target on this forum, but I'm still a believer. Gavrikov and Liljegren could be real nice together. That being said, I am also firmly against trading Sandin. This roster would be real nice if Sandin is actually on the way out:

Bunting - Matthews - Nylander
Tavares - O'Reilly - Marner
Engvall - Laughton - Jarnkrok
Aston Reese - Kampf - Acciari

Rielly - Brodie
Gavrikov - Liljegren
Giordano - Holl


Dont want Gavrikov. Watched him twice against us and let me say I would prefer keeping Sandin
24 févr. 2023 à 0 h 39
#1180
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Quoting: aadoyle
Dont want Gavrikov. Watched him twice against us and let me say I would prefer keeping Sandin


It is also important to note that Gavrikov plays on the Blue Jackets, who currently sit in last place. Look at Lindholm last year compared to this year. I'm a big analytics guy, but the advanced stats for defenseman on bad teams are always iffy. If the asking price for Gavrikov is still as high as it was rumored to be, then no, I'll pass. If it drops however, I'd make the call. He's a very solid 2 way defenseman making little to no money. If we are in the market for a defenseman, he is really the only guy I would bother inquiring about (out of the defenseman we know are available for trade).
24 févr. 2023 à 0 h 44
#1181
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Quoting: Nathaniel
It is also important to note that Gavrikov plays on the Blue Jackets, who currently sit in last place. Look at Lindholm last year compared to this year. I'm a big analytics guy, but the advanced stats for defenseman on bad teams are always iffy. If the asking price for Gavrikov is still as high as it was rumored to be, then no, I'll pass. If it drops however, I'd make the call. He's a very solid 2 way defenseman making little to no money. If we are in the market for a defenseman, he is really the only guy I would bother inquiring about (out of the defenseman we know are available for trade).


Even then I just dont see him being a needle mover. Like if im moving Sandin I want an upgrade

Gavrikov to me does not feel like an upgrade. Yes maybe in Toronto he would be the guy but I just dont see it

As rn if we look

Sandin (22 years)

4 goals 16 assists 20 points
ATOI: 18mins
Hits: 113
Blocked Shots: 57

Gavrikov (27 years)

3 goals 7 assists
ATOI: 22mins
Hits: 56
Blocked Shots: 89

The real focus should be getting a RD upgrade

As rn its

Rielly-Brodie
Sandin-?
Gio-Liligren

Tanev, Gudas, Ekholm, Etc.
24 févr. 2023 à 0 h 50
#1182
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Quoting: aadoyle
Even then I just dont see him being a needle mover. Like if im moving Sandin I want an upgrade

Gavrikov to me does not feel like an upgrade. Yes maybe in Toronto he would be the guy but I just dont see it

As rn if we look

Sandin (22 years)

4 goals 16 assists 20 points
ATOI: 18mins
Hits: 113
Blocked Shots: 57

Gavrikov (27 years)

3 goals 7 assists
ATOI: 22mins
Hits: 56
Blocked Shots: 89

The real focus should be getting a RD upgrade

As rn its

Rielly-Brodie
Sandin-?
Gio-Liligren

Tanev, Gudas, Ekholm, Etc.


? = Liljegren
3RD = Holl

He has been fantastic this season. I have been beyond impressed and would go as far as saying he is about on par with Brodie for being our best defenseman. I think Liljegren is more than ready to be a genuine top 4 defenseman. Obviously Sandin throws a lot of hits, but thats not a defining attribute. Gavrikov's experience, shot blocking, and defensive awareness make him a clear cut upgrade over Sandin. Like I said, I dont want to trade Sandin and would be more than happy to roll our current defense group into the playoffs. If we are to add a defenseman, it needs to be someone that clears the netfront and prioritizes defense. The Leafs definitely still have another trade in the works given we went the extra step to get ROR double retained, but I don't know what area we are going to address
24 févr. 2023 à 0 h 54
#1183
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Modifié 24 févr. 2023 à 1 h 18
Quoting: Nathaniel
? = Liljegren
3RD = Holl

He has been fantastic this season. I have been beyond impressed and would go as far as saying he is about on par with Brodie for being our best defenseman. I think Liljegren is more than ready to be a genuine top 4 defenseman. Obviously Sandin throws a lot of hits, but thats not a defining attribute. Gavrikov's experience, shot blocking, and defensive awareness make him a clear cut upgrade over Sandin. Like I said, I dont want to trade Sandin and would be more than happy to roll our current defense group into the playoffs. If we are to add a defenseman, it needs to be someone that clears the netfront and prioritizes defense. The Leafs definitely still have another trade in the works given we went the extra step to get ROR double retained, but I don't know what area we are going to address


I feel Holl might be on the move to the press box as Brodie and Liligren are just playing so well and while hes got PK advantages hes not the guy to build a shutdown pair around vs a team whose gone to the finals 3 times

As rn our shutdown pairing is Gio-Holl.....Do you got confidence in that pairing vs. Tampa nope (I like Gio but get that man a proper partner or if not move Sandin up and get him a more experienced partner)

Last year we had Muzzin-Brodie and it worked well enough

Were gonna need an upgrade on 2nd pair RD who is a menace in front of our net and will make u wish u never stayed there.

If we can do it to where we keep Holl as the #7 even better.

In general if we look at Sandin vs. Gavrikov I would rather have Sandin. As man Gavrikov fell off hard from last year





And if we compare pairings that have played over 300mins together Sandin is 6th

https://www.moneypuck.com/lines.htm

RD partner for Gio if we decide hes second pair should be priority. But if were insistent of Sandin being moved a clear cut 100% guaranteed upgrade has to happen
24 févr. 2023 à 2 h 48
#1184
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https://twitter.com/sdpnsports/status/1628955675169529857?cxt=HHwWgoCx1cqjm5stAAAA

I actually forgot about that with Kadri. I just remembered the last stuff

But man the similarities are scary and not in a good way. Luckily Bunting hasnt gone suspension playoff level
24 févr. 2023 à 11 h 35
#1185
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Who else is excited to see ROR pot another hatty against a former team tonight
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24 févr. 2023 à 11 h 44
#1186
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Quoting: Nathaniel
Who else is excited to see ROR pot another hatty against a former team tonight


put his number in the minny rafters
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24 févr. 2023 à 12 h 53
#1187
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Quoting: Nathaniel
Who else is excited to see ROR pot another hatty against a former team tonight


My f*cking fantasy team that's who
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24 févr. 2023 à 12 h 58
#1188
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Wonder if Brian Dumoulin would be available. Has had a tough season but the pedigree is still there and it's only this season that has been shaky. The bounce back potential under a better defensive system and perhaps a more defensive-oriented partner like Brodie is there. Could be a good guy to add into the mix for likely a very inexpensive acquisition cost. And for the Pens it would mean you could clear that cap to go for a bigger fish. Would of course mean Kerfoot gets dealt to make room, even if we can find a 3rd party to retain on Dumoulin, and we acquire another gritty 4th liner to form a hitting/depth scoring line with ZAR and Acciari
24 févr. 2023 à 13 h 18
#1189
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Remember when the Penguins gave us the 15th overall pick for Kapanen? Good times
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24 févr. 2023 à 13 h 20
#1190
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Quoting: Nathaniel




Remember when the Penguins gave us the 15th overall pick for Kapanen? Good times


unfortunate events after that (hope Amirov can make it to the NHL one day) but yes
24 févr. 2023 à 13 h 35
#1191
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Quoting: leafs101
Wonder if Brian Dumoulin would be available. Has had a tough season but the pedigree is still there and it's only this season that has been shaky. The bounce back potential under a better defensive system and perhaps a more defensive-oriented partner like Brodie is there. Could be a good guy to add into the mix for likely a very inexpensive acquisition cost. And for the Pens it would mean you could clear that cap to go for a bigger fish. Would of course mean Kerfoot gets dealt to make room, even if we can find a 3rd party to retain on Dumoulin, and we acquire another gritty 4th liner to form a hitting/depth scoring line with ZAR and Acciari


Dumo is alright but his injury history and what im seeing this year makes me go no thank you

Toronto needs a RD more so than a lefty

As the shutdown pair needs an upgrade.

Like if Sandin comes out I want someone way better
24 févr. 2023 à 13 h 45
#1192
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I remember Kapenan in Toronto and especially in the playoffs vs. WSH

If he passes waivers and Pitts willing to retain heck throw something in take him back.

Keefe will get him back on track and with his ability to finish along with a potential C like ROR on the third line could be fun
24 févr. 2023 à 13 h 50
#1193
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My guess either back for the b2b in Alberta or Vancouver
24 févr. 2023 à 14 h 5
#1194
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Quoting: aadoyle
I remember Kapenan in Toronto and especially in the playoffs vs. WSH

If he passes waivers and Pitts willing to retain heck throw something in take him back.

Keefe will get him back on track and with his ability to finish along with a potential C like ROR on the third line could be fun



There would be a ton of risk but no questioning he scored some big goals as a Leaf









And the OT goal against WSH
24 févr. 2023 à 14 h 20
#1195
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Quoting: MatthewsFan
There would be a ton of risk but no questioning he scored some big goals as a Leaf









And the OT goal against WSH


In general imagine a 3rd line of

Jarnkrok-ROR-Kapenan

That aint bad

Like ROR needs guys who can finish as Jfresh chart even highlighted that

Both Jarnkrok and Kapenan are fast and finish at around 73% wouldnt be the worst

If he clears I want retention but a 1.6mill Kapenan for our 3rd line wouldnt be the worst.
24 févr. 2023 à 14 h 31
#1196
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Quoting: aadoyle
In general imagine a 3rd line of

Jarnkrok-ROR-Kapenan

That aint bad

Like ROR needs guys who can finish as Jfresh chart even highlighted that

Both Jarnkrok and Kapenan are fast and finish at around 73% wouldnt be the worst

If he clears I want retention but a 1.6mill Kapenan for our 3rd line wouldnt be the worst.


I wouldn’t want him on the Leafs. Too many off ice issues.

He gave us some good memories but it’s over
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24 févr. 2023 à 14 h 57
#1197
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Man for a potential cup run when looking at our Dcore vs. our competitors kind of scary

Boston

Orlov - McAvoy
Lindholm - Carlo
Gryzlyc - Forbort

Tampa

Hedman-Bogosian
Sergechev - Cernak
Cole - Perbix

Carolina (Has 10mill to spend)

Slavin-Burns
Skeji-Pesce
De-Haan-Chatfield

Toronto

Rielly - Brodie
Gio-Holl
Sandin - Liligren

Yea our shutdown pair gonna need work
24 févr. 2023 à 15 h 10
#1198
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Quoting: MatthewsFan
I wouldn’t want him on the Leafs. Too many off ice issues.

He gave us some good memories but it’s over


The left the Leafs in the most ideal way: in a fleecing of a trade. Imagine if ERod stuck around after that deal
24 févr. 2023 à 15 h 11
#1199
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The more I think about it the more Gudas kind of makes sense

Is a nasty Blue Liner

Dubas wanted him 2 years ago

Brings physicality and Grit to the Blue line

Will make it where all that free real estate in front of our net is taken away

And has the hardest shot for a Dman in the NHL rn

Just needs to curb taking dumb penalties

But a Gio-Gudas shutdown pair or the GG pairing would be interesting



24 févr. 2023 à 15 h 30
#1200
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Quoting: Nathaniel
The left the Leafs in the most ideal way: in a fleecing of a trade. Imagine if ERod stuck around after that deal



Everyday lol


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