As a leafs fan - omg yes please

Ha! "Hey Edmonton, this winger we have that plays on the 4th line a lot of nights is PERFECT for McJesus...We'll also throw in Zaitsev who, for the Leafs, would be a cap dump...Just looking to grab Larsson from you...Want a 3rd rounder to make the deal???"

First off, let's look at the optics of this deal. Chia overpaid and gave up Hall to get Larsson. Now you think he'll turn around and go with Brown and Zaitsev?

Come on. This is like the Leivo garbage posts that people used to make. "Leivo is a star! Leivo for Manson! Leivo is the GOAT!". Connor Brown is a good hockey player, but he doesn't even come close to moving the needle to get you Adam Larsson.

Seems like a fair deal with the second. Moving zaitsev sucks. I think he is solid defensively and has some offensive upside. But his trade value is low right now.

Brown and mcdavid together again would be great.

Larsson is a 20 point defenceman. Lets maybe tone it down with the Larsson is a high end defenceman. Just because he was acquired with an all star, doesn't make him one himself.

This clearly isnt like that garbage posts.. I said add pick/s to make it more fair. I also added that 2nd round pick or two might make it fair. Its just the base of the deal. Brown and McDavid would be legit great together. Brown can snipe it and he is responsible and gritty with very underrated skating and speed. He would be a great tool for Oilers. Also Zaitsev is horrible because of Gardiner, he was not with him the first season and he was great. Zaitsev has tools to work with and in Edmonton he could be very very good. Along with picks I dont think its bad offer for Top-4 D..

Most likely as long as Chiarelli is the GM of Oilers, he is not moving Larsson for lower level players...it'd be a big defeat for his image for acquiring him with so much and then getting so little for him in exchange...

I didn't say that Larsson was an allstar, I said that Chia overpaid to get him, and that likely means that he's not going to turn around and give him away for peanuts.

Also, why are you only valuing d-men based on how many points they put up?

Doesn't this then dig Edmonton another hole on their back end? Zaitsev is a significant downgrade from Larsson.

You say Brown is the guy, and I disagree. If the Oilers want a winger for McDavid, why not get someone with a some sort of history of success?

2nd Brown and Zaitsev is not peanuts. Brown scored 20 in his rookie season..I agree with points thing. You dont base Dmen by points.

It doesnt, they have young guns coming up in Bouchard and Bear who are going to be upgrades from what they have and adding Zaitsev would help. Larsson is better than Zaitsev but Zaitsev is no joke. And for what they would receive they would fine.

We can disagree on this and im fine with that. Everybody has different opinion. But Brown has history of success and history of success with McDavid as well. He scored 20 goals in his rookie year in Toronto and then he received defensive role covering bs for Bozak and JVR who were brutal and this season Kappy surpassed him but Brown is the type of guy who battles for skilled guy on his line and thats McDavid. Also Brown and McDavid were linemates for 2 seasons for Errie Otters. Brownie is very underrated and would be great besides his buddy.

Here is the thing, he already looks terrible for this trade. If he traded Larsson for Zaitsev and Brown and Brown proved to be a good winger for McDavid, then it would save face. To expect Larsson to bring a high level package back is unreasonable.

I value defenceman for the impact they have on the game. Larsson doesn't have hardly any offensive abilities, and he doesn't have great possession numbers. Those two issues suggest he's a guy who just gets in the way of the puck a bunch but never really has it on his stick. If you look at him from an advanced stats aspect he's historically not been that great of a defenceman. He's actually not far off from Zaitsev in most statistical categories. Brown on the other hand may be a 3rd or 4th liner in TO but he could very well be the top RW in Edmonton. If you ignore the Hall for Larsson trade stuff and look at this proposed trade at a player for player level, I'd say Brown and Zaitsev for Larsson is either completely fair or really it could be a terrific trade for Edmonton. Moving 1 ok defenceman and getting almost the same player back Zaitsev and a talented, fast winger who could play higher in your lineup. This is the type of trades Edmonton desperately needs to make right now. They have a huge depth issue in their forward ranks and they need value contracts of which Brown would fall under.

Like Rattie? Edmonton needs talented wingers of which they have very few and they don't really have the pieces (Picks and prospects) to go out and obtain higher end talent. They also don't have the best cap situation due to several bad contracts on the team. On top of that, Larsson isn't a signficant upgrade over Zaitsev, they are statistically very similar. Zaitsev has shown much more offensive upside (Perhaps not this year but his defensive game has been markedly improved) and Larsson is more polished defensively, but really they aren't really far apart.

Ugh, leaf fan wants a top 4 dman for spare parts what a surprise

I wouldnt call top-9 forward with history with McDavid (which was the purpose), top-4 defender and 2nd rounder (in team explanation part there it is) spare parts.

Zaitsev is a top 4 defenceman. Brown would be a middle 6 winger on almost ever other team in the NHL, its not his fault the Leafs have 3 RW who are way better than he is. Who else can run players equal to Marner, Nylander and Kapenen on the right side?

Ah, the old "He's not that much of an upgrade!" argument. If he's not that much of an upgrade, why do you want to help Edmonton out by giving them future superstar Connor Brown?

Hint: Because Larsson is a significant upgrade over Zaitsev.

...Brown plays on the 4th line most nights? Zaitsev is in the top 4 because the Leafs D-core isn't all that good? The 2nd rounder would be in the bottom 5 if the season ended today?

That's the definition of spare parts, amigo.

Here is the actual thing, you're right, he does look terrible for this trade. If he traded Larsson for someone good, then it would save face. To expect Larsson to bring back Hall is unreasonable. To expect him to bring back more than Connor Brown, a late second, and a defenceman that you guys would have to move because of cap issues, is COMPLETELY reasonable. How about Kap, Zaitsev and that 2nd? That's much more reasonable.

No, the trade makes sense from a Leafs perspective because it sheds about 2.5 million of cap space. Its not really a cap dump in a traditional, "Take Lucic because we don't want to pay him" cap dump. Its more just a reorganization of players and cap space from TO and trying to get some value for Brown by using him to get a bit of an upgrade on the Blueline and shedding some cap space at the same time.

Brown would very likely play on the top line in Edmonton, and on the flip side, I am not sure any wingers in Edmonton could even make the Leafs roster. This is the problem with Edmonton, you have no depth, this will get you depth without costing you much of a downgrade on the blue line. Its a smart hockey move that benefits both teams. Or you can keep saying its spare parts and watch your team try to make guys like Rattie become NHLers when they are AHLers at best. Why wouldn't you want to move Larsson and get a winger who could blossom playing important minutes he'll never get in TO and also get a defenceman who isn't much of a drop off from Larsson.

Not an Oilers fan.

Interestingly, they're 7-2-1 in their past 10. The Leafs are 6-3-1.

You made an argument earlier about how "The Oilers don't have the picks, prospects or cap space to upgrade", or something along those lines. So, why would they take an extra $2.5 mil flyer on a winger that could also end up playing on the 4th line?

Kap+Zaitsev+2nd.

Now you are being silly. Kapanen by himself is worth more than Larsson. Larsson is best suited as a middle pair defenceman but can play higher in the lineup in a pinch. That is pretty much what Zaitsev is as well. Brown scored 20 goals as a rookie and since then has been put on the 4th line because of the crazy depth TO has at RW. He'd be top 6 in Edmonton. Brown and Zaitsev for Larsson is fair, if you want a 2nd to make the added cap hit feel less then fine, I think its an overpay but its not a bad deal for TO still. But lets not get crazy here. Don't overvalue Larsson because he was traded for Hall, it was a terrible trade because Larsson isn't at all what Chiarelli thought he was and he still isn't the player Chiarelli thought he was getting, which means you can't trade him for a great package, simply because he isn't worth it.

This is just silly. Edmonton isn't a good team and they are on a streak right now that doesn't look sustainable. Their differentials on scoring chances are still very much in the negative, meaning they are giving up way more chances than they are getting. Their goalies have been playing better and they are playing a better defensive game but its cost them in their chance generation. Eventually the depth guys who have historically struggled to produce will continue to struggle and then its going to be a lot of 4-3 losses where McDavid has 3 points and the rest of the team manages to lay an egg. They need depth so bad, especially on the wings, they really should be targetting teams with great depth and trying to get guys who could produce if given a bigger role than they have on their current team. Guys like Brown are the exact type of player you should be wanting. Guys who are stuck playing bottom 6 minutes but have shown the ability to do more if given a chance.

If you look at numbers in a vacuum and don't look at who they are playing, yea thats a great way to do things.

Zaitzev's underlying numbers are helped because matthews, tavares, marner, nylander, marleau etc have great puck possession numbers and anderson has played great this year.

larsson is on a bad team, of course posession numbers, corsi etc will be worse.

Its like some bat signal comes up everytime there is a leafs trade to sign the praises of guys.

Then eventually carrick gets dealt for a 7th, leivo for a career minor leaguer, nielsen for a career minor leaguer. look at leafs posts from over the summer, all these guys were in trades for doughty etc.

reality checks eventually come.