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Why the Panthers got fleeced

Créé par: hairyberry
Équipe: 2022-23 Flames de Calgary
Date de création initiale: 23 juill. 2022
Publié: 23 juill. 2022
Mode - plafond salarial: Basique
Description
I know most people already agree with this, but just wanted to lay out the sheer value sent to the Flames. People will say "Oh but Weegar and Huberdeau are UFAs this year!". Doesn't matter; it's about value in vs. value out.

Imagine trading Huberdeau and Weegar before the season/at the deadline for futures. This is what I've done here in deals that I think are fair value-wise. These are NOT meant to be realistic trades in the sense that it makes sense for any of these teams. They're just supposed to represent fair value.

Now, look at the return for Huberdeau and Weegar. Would you trade all of that, PLUS a 1st, plus a prospect for Tkachuk? Imo, when it's laid out like this, it's hard to argue for Florida's asset management.
Transactions
1.
CGY
  1. Bourgault, Xavier
  2. Choix de 1e ronde en 2023 (EDM)
2.
CGY
  1. DeBrusk, Jake
  2. Lohrei, Mason [Liste de réserve]
  3. Choix de 1e ronde en 2023 (BOS)
  4. Choix de 2e ronde en 2025 (BOS)
Repêchage1e ronde2e ronde3e ronde4e ronde5e ronde6e ronde7e ronde
2023
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2024
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2025
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Logo de FLA
Logo de CGY
Logo de BOS
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TAILLE DE LA FORMATIONPLAFOND SALARIALCAP HITEXCÉDENTS Info-bulleBONISESPACE SOUS LE PLAFOND SALARIAL
2082 500 000 $59 762 500 $0 $377 500 $22 737 500 $
Ailier gaucheCentreAilier droit
Logo de Flames de Calgary
5 350 000 $5 350 000 $
C
M-NTC
UFA - 2
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2 125 000 $2 125 000 $
AD, AG
UFA - 2
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5 250 000 $5 250 000 $
AG, AD
M-NTC, NMC
UFA - 1
Logo de Flames de Calgary
4 850 000 $4 850 000 $
C, AD
UFA - 2
Logo de Flames de Calgary
800 000 $800 000 $ (Bonis de performance200 000 $$200K)
AD, C
UFA - 1
Logo de Flames de Calgary
4 900 000 $4 900 000 $
AD, AG
NTC
UFA - 5
Logo de Flames de Calgary
2 300 000 $2 300 000 $
AG, AD, C
RFA - 2
Logo de Flames de Calgary
1 300 000 $1 300 000 $
C
UFA - 2
Logo de Oilers d'Edmonton
925 000 $925 000 $ (Bonis de performance177 500 $$178K)
AD
RFA - 3
Logo de Bruins de Boston
4 000 000 $4 000 000 $
AD, AG
UFA - 2
Défenseur gaucherDéfenseur droitierGardien de but
Logo de Flames de Calgary
1 237 500 $1 237 500 $
DG
M-NTC
UFA - 2
Logo de Flames de Calgary
4 550 000 $4 550 000 $
DD
UFA - 4
Logo de Flames de Calgary
6 000 000 $6 000 000 $
G
NMC
UFA - 4
Logo de Flames de Calgary
3 750 000 $3 750 000 $
DG/DD
UFA - 2
Logo de Flames de Calgary
1 125 000 $1 125 000 $
DD
M-NTC
UFA - 2
Logo de Flames de Calgary
750 000 $750 000 $
G
UFA - 1
Logo de Flames de Calgary
950 000 $950 000 $
DD
UFA - 1
Logo de Flames de Calgary
1 550 000 $1 550 000 $
DG
RFA - 1
Logo de Flames de Calgary
912 500 $912 500 $
DG
UFA - 1
Logo de Flames de Calgary
762 500 $762 500 $
DG
UFA - 2
Laissés de côtéListe des blessés (IR)Liste des blessés à long terme (LTIR)
Logo de Flames de Calgary
6 375 000 $6 375 000 $
C, AG, AD
M-NTC
UFA - 1

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23 juill. 2022 à 0 h 43
#1
In Zito We Trust
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Weegar doesn't net that return
23 juill. 2022 à 0 h 45
#2
CGY
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It's a gamble by Treliving, but that's why he gets paid more than us.

If he can extend both, it's a really good deal for the Flames
23 juill. 2022 à 0 h 45
#3
Banni
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As long as Treliving sticks to his guns and makes the hard choice to trade Weegar and Huberdeau at the TDL instead of going for it, you are absolutely correct. This is WIN-WIN for the Flames. Whether they resign or not. Florida was never going to sell at the TDL after giving up their 2023, 2024 1sts.

Calgary had the flexibility to make this trade and Florida keeps chasing lost dreams
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23 juill. 2022 à 0 h 46
#4
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Quoting: VijayPatel11
Weegar doesn't net that return


A top pair RHD for $3.25m absolutely nets a first and a prospect at the deadline. If anything Weegar is worth more than that. ****ing Ben Chiarot just got a 1st at last season's deadline.
23 juill. 2022 à 0 h 49
#5
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Quoting: ItWasIn
It's a gamble by Treliving, but that's why he gets paid more than us.

If he can extend both, it's a really good deal for the Flames


Even if he can't resign either of them and needs to ship them out for futures, the value he'll get out of trading Huberdeau AND Weegar at the deadline AND a 2025 1st AND a prospect is definitely more than whatever futures he would've gotten for Tkachuk alone at the deadline.
23 juill. 2022 à 0 h 51
#6
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Quoting: hairyberry
Even if he can't resign either of them and needs to ship them out for futures, the value he'll get out of trading Huberdeau AND Weegar at the deadline AND a 2025 1st AND a prospect is definitely more than whatever futures he would've gotten for Tkachuk alone at the deadline.


Oh for sure.

The issue is that the Pacific isn't fantastic and the Flames should be in the playoff mix at worst.

Treliving absolutely needs to hammer down a Huberdeau extension. They may need to overpay. Can't imagine how Huberdeau is feeling, going from South Florida to Alberta.
23 juill. 2022 à 0 h 52
#7
What in tarnation
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You forget that Florida is thinking this trade in a much longer scale.

They were well aware that their current financial position did not allow them to extend both Huberdeau and Weegar, potentially neither of them. Both of them are also approaching their 30s, so it's very likely that they have peaked right about now.

They have shifted this whole issue they had with these players to Calgary, and got in exchange the best power forward in the league, signed to a max term deal with reasonable cap hit, and crucially he is only 24 years old.

On a short term Florida definitely compromised a lot of value, but long term I think it's much more likely that FLA is going to end up being the winners.

And if CGY is unable to sign these newfound assets to their team with long-term deals that are likely going to look ugly in years to come, that win is going to be theirs even sooner. Huberdeau is turning 30 and looking at an 8 year deal at 10-11 million in cap, with Weegar probably getting the same term at $7M dollars. How long are they going to be worth those deals? Not for too long I'd wager.
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23 juill. 2022 à 1 h 14
#8
IKnowPuck
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Short term yes, Calgary fleeced and when you consider the position they were in this is a great haul but at the same time if Huberdeau leaves in a year then it’s a far different situation

From floridas perspective Weegar is gone anyways and Paying Tkachuk 8x9.5>paying Huberdeau 8x10

Gonna be verrrrry interesting to see how it plays out tho
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23 juill. 2022 à 1 h 14
#9
Saskoiler for now
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I think it’s a win win, but I like it better for Calgary. If Huberdeau or even Weegar stick around or net big returns at the deadline this trade becomes a pretty massive Calgary win pretty quickly. But it is worth noting that Florida will still have 8 years of Tkachuk so can’t exactly call them losers.
23 juill. 2022 à 1 h 18
#10
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Quoting: justaBoss
You forget that Florida is thinking this trade in a much longer scale.

They were well aware that their current financial position did not allow them to extend both Huberdeau and Weegar, potentially neither of them. Both of them are also approaching their 30s, so it's very likely that they have peaked right about now.

They have shifted this whole issue they had with these players to Calgary, and got in exchange the best power forward in the league, signed to a max term deal with reasonable cap hit, and crucially he is only 24 years old.

On a short term Florida definitely compromised a lot of value, but long term I think it's much more likely that FLA is going to end up being the winners.

And if CGY is unable to sign these newfound assets to their team with long-term deals that are likely going to look ugly in years to come, that win is going to be theirs even sooner. Huberdeau is turning 30 and looking at an 8 year deal at 10-11 million in cap, with Weegar probably getting the same term at $7M dollars. How long are they going to be worth those deals? Not for too long I'd wager.


I agree, Flr only really gets fleeced if Tkachuk is doing the fleecing (aka he's a PPG player at best and not elite defensively), and CGY should be able to at least retain the value of at least 4 firsts (worst case 3) which is the best case scenario or get their Gaudreau replacement/upgrade.

I don't think Calgary will sign Weegar and they don't really need to anyways, they can let him walk as a rental if they resign Huberdeau.

Calgary does get an L if Huberdeau doesn't get 11 from Backlund and takes 13. I already saw on twitter someone converting their Gaudreau jersey to a Huberdeau one.
23 juill. 2022 à 16 h 39
#11
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Quoting: justaBoss
You forget that Florida is thinking this trade in a much longer scale.

They were well aware that their current financial position did not allow them to extend both Huberdeau and Weegar, potentially neither of them. Both of them are also approaching their 30s, so it's very likely that they have peaked right about now.


Did you read the description? I'm not forgetting this, I'm pointing out that even taking into account the ages and contact statuses, Florida still payed an awful lot.

From CGY's perspective, they knew Tkachuk was leaving. If they had signed him to a 1 year deal through arbitration, they would have had to trade him as a rental at the deadline. Now, they are at least in a position where they have a winger who, as a rental, is of similar value to Tkachuk, plus a top pair RHD, plus a 1st and a prospect. The fact that they added all this doesn't bode well for Florida's asset management.
23 juill. 2022 à 17 h 50
#12
What in tarnation
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Quoting: hairyberry
Did you read the description? I'm not forgetting this, I'm pointing out that even taking into account the ages and contact statuses, Florida still payed an awful lot.

From CGY's perspective, they knew Tkachuk was leaving. If they had signed him to a 1 year deal through arbitration, they would have had to trade him as a rental at the deadline. Now, they are at least in a position where they have a winger who, as a rental, is of similar value to Tkachuk, plus a top pair RHD, plus a 1st and a prospect. The fact that they added all this doesn't bode well for Florida's asset management.


On a vacuum yes, they paid a staggering amount. But when looking at the bigger picture the price they paid, while somewhat excessive, actually makes some sense.
 
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