You get flak from the teams you are trying to trade with. Both decline.

no reason to give up on svech this early

Nah. Svechnikov won't move without high overpayment.

Burakovsky and McDavid, as linemates, each got 80 pts as ohl rookies. Puljujarvi and Aho won gold at iihf wjhc as linemates. Burakovsky, Djoos and Connolly won some other kind of trophy last year, and each contributed more than expected.

But cool story.

I actually think this is kinda close...change on of the add ons in the Bura trade to a 2nd...and change the 2nd to a first in the Svechnikov trade and both teams will at least discuss. Don't really think Carolina would really want to trade Svechnikov tho. And yes, I don't like the idea of trading Djoos.

All of which is meaningless.

Canes aren’t moving Svech.

Kammerer is a no-risk wing prospect from Germany. Has better odds of developing into a star on a team with Burakovsky, Rieder, and Draisaitl than anywhere else. Williams is everything Oilers fans think Ethan Bear is.

Look at how few foreign players the Oilers and Hurricanes have successfully developed, and I think each team takes this and runs, just to have one less language spoken on their team (I'll count Koskinen when he plays a game, but if they want to dump him for Copley, that's cool).

It's too early to trade a 1st. Could still be Hughes, who would be much more valuable than Svechnikov. Canes mgmt have consistently taken on odds and ends and bottom six forwards from recent champs in quiet, win-win moves. This means they actively scout the playoffs and know exactly what Djoos and Connolly are worth.

As a thought experiment, imagine this offer for some recent 2nd overall busts: Ryan Murray, Jordan Staal, Kari Lehtonen, Bobby Ryan... Even without a salary cap, you couldn't get Burakovsky for all four, today.

There are also some great players at that spot, but some fourth overall players include Ryan Johansen, Alex Pietrangelo, Seth Jones, Nick Backstrom, and, going way back, hall of famers like Larry Murphy and Ron Francis.

Does draft position make Svechnikov the next Malkin? If so, is that any better than Puljujarvi being the next Ron Francis? If not (and no, it doesn't) then how does each player fit into the culture of each team. I think Svechnikov currently adds as much value to Carolina as Connolly would, but adding Puljujarvi to Aho and Tervainen is like adding Francis to Lemieux and Jagr.

Puljujarvi and Aho are awesome together. Aho and Tervainen are awesome together. Puljujarvi, Aho, and Tervainen together would be double awesome. We're talking about a 2016 4th overall power forward who is a former gokd medal linemate of Carolina's current leading scorer. We're also raising the odds of an eventual UFA deal with Laine.

Who's giving up on anyone?

Svech would take a kings ransom plus three firsts, no way he's even discussed.

Welcome to the conversation.

You can rationalize it all day, but it doesn't change the fact that even an idiot like Waddell would laugh and hang up the phone if this were offered. You're not getting a stud like Svechnikov for that package, much less adding Zykov.

I sent Zykov to Hershey... so that last part is definitely fine. By all means. Hold on to Valentin Zykov.

But have you seen the video of Aho and Puljujarvi playing together beautifully to win Gold medals at the World Junior Championships? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t0vBmvS3o34&t=224s

I think they could work really well with Tervainen. I also think Svechnikov could work really well with Kuznetsov. The Edmonton scouts who drafted McDavid after watching him and Burakovsky score 80 points each, as linemates with the Erie Otters already know that line works, but Burakovsky was born in Austria, so he also has an edge over most NHL wings at playing with Draisaitl, whose native language is German. The Caps are the only team taking a gamble here, and I've got them adding Brett Connolly, whose six playoff goals last year put him in the top 20 in the league, plus Christian Djoos a rookie defenseman who outscored Haydn Fleury and then played all but one or two playoff games, and looked comfortable winning the Cup. This is not a cheap offer. This is a 4th overall pick and two 25-ish Cup winners, for a 2nd overall pick.

I'm not swayed by your nonsensical certainty about the value, because the value is fine. I'm asking about the fit. Watch the above video of Puljujarvi winning MVP of the World Junior Championship on Aho's line, and tell me that Puljujarvi doesn't immediately and permanently add more value to the Hurricanes than Svechnikov.

Then Google the sad history of Nail Yakupov, and try to tell me that Edmonton has any idea how to help Svechnikov develop into an NHL star. You can't. They don't. They have no idea. I'm suggesting a win-win-win trade, where everybody's top line improves, and Carolina gets a really, really good 24 year old defenseman and a pretty decent 26 year old wing who just won the Stanley Cup. How sentimentally attached can they be to Svechnikov, already?

The only nonsense here is your attempts at rationalization. What happens in the Jr. Worlds doesn't automatically translate to the NHL,so Puljujarvi does not "immediately add more value" Connolly is a a semi bust that managed to score some goals in the playoffs last year (look at his career numbers, ffs). Djoos is decent, but at best he's the fifth D on the Canes. Sure, their rings as support players are nice, but the Canes already have Justin Williams, who won three rings as a key player. Svechnikov went 2nd overall for a reason, because he's an outstanding player. Whether or not the Canes are already "sentimentally attached" to him is irrelevant, he's the best player in the deal. Yakupov and whether Edmonton could help Svech is a smokescreen, because he's not even going to the Oilers in this deal. You are clearly trying to overvalue your players in a deal where, SURPRISE, your team makes out the best.

I'm a fan. I'm unaffiliated. But I appreciate the compliment.

So what we have is a disagreement over the difference in value between the 2016 4th overall pick and a 2018 2nd overall pick. To better discuss that, I have some questions:

a. do we agree that Puljujarvi and Aho were amazing together in World Juniors? because: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t0vBmvS3o34

b. Do we agree that the Canes' current top two scorers both come from Finland, and might play even better on a line with another guy who speaks Finnish and already has won a gold medal playing with Aho?

c. Then it sounds like we're just disagreeing on the difference in value based on draft position. I totally agree that Connolly looked like a bust and I am not remotely trying to value him as a 12th overall pick. He's just a great 3rd liner. Nothing more. But at 26 he might still keep improving a bit and become a good second liner. Djoos might indeed just be a #5 defenseman (or maybe #4....) but he can play either side and he's 24, so I'm sure he's still getting better, and fits in well with a team that I see as a contender for the next decade. I don't think the Canes should trade away any of their defensemen, but I don't see anything wrong with stockpiling defensive depth to make a playoff run, after the start they had.

d. A second overall pick can be Eric Staal, or it can be Jordan Staal. It can be Evgeny Malkin, or it can be Ryan Murray. A 4th overall pick can be Ron Francis, or it can be Jesse Puljujarvi. I see your point that Puljujarvi has been slower to adjust to the NHL than has Aho. Part of that is that Aho is playing with Tervainen, skating a million miles an hour all over the ice, being as creative as they can, while Jesse Puljujarvi is playing with Lucic, Strome, whoever's not busy on the Oilers, and being told to stand in front of the net and wait for passes or rebounds. There's a video on Youtube of every goal Puljujarvi has scored with the Oilers. I tried to watch it, but I could only get through half. The repetition is painful. They are wasting a ton of talent in him. Just like they did with Yakupov. Put him back with the guy he made all the awesome passes to in World Juniors, and you'll see why he was MVP there, and why he was picked 4th overall, again.

There can be a huge gulf of value between a 2nd overall pick and a 4th overall pick. In this case, though, there isn't. They're both incredibly talented guys who dominated at World Juniors. Puljujarvi is bigger and tougher and speaks Finnish. Svechnikov is a little more creative with the puck, but not much. And yeah, he would fit better with Ovechkin and Kuznetsov because they speak the same native language.

If the asking price were Puljujarvi, Johansen and a 2nd and a 3rd, I think Washington should still strongly consider it. I just think Puljujarvi, Djoos, and Connolly does more for Carolina right away, and I think that if Edmonton is down, which about half their fans seem to be, with switching Puljujarvi for someone their coaches would use, then that's an offer that Washington has the depth to make, and that with Waddell's habit of fleecing recent champions of young, peripheral players he can gradually develop into bigger roles, that's the currency he would prefer. I think either of Djoos or Kempny could be available from Washington. Djoos is younger, though, so he more closely lines up with Carolina's strengths. I think the Caps have the prospect depth to still make the playoffs without Connolly and Burakovsky. But it wouldn't be nearly as easy as getting back there with both of them.