I think there is another variation of this deal with.a forward from Carolina coming to Boston and then Hanifin coming to Boston instead of Lindholm. I don’t believe Hanifin requires as much draft compensation as Lindholm

I don't think it is worth it to trade for Orlov at this point. Lohrei is very promising and to have a few more years on a rookie contract would be huge for us.

I think this is very well thought out. All teams would have to strongly consider.

Well done!

Don't think there's a world where Boston trades their Vezina winning goalie to their conference rival mid season.

Boston also isn't giving up Lohrei, wouldn't do it last year and won't do it this year.

HEAVY ask for a goalie.

If ullmark hit UFA today does he get 8.5 mill? (what hellebuyuck & Sorokin got). WIth the retention that's what Carolina would be paying ullmark. 8 mill a year. Then you want a 2nd on top of that????

Ullmark has a higher likelihood of making that 7.5 M salary vs Orlov after this year especially if it is a 2 year deal. Player for player, i take Ullmark any day of the week if Im in Carolina’s current depth situation. Orlov is playing on their third line.

With regards to Raanta, take him out of the deal and pay his full salary by either cutting him outright or burying him in the AHL where you lose $500k against your cap off the top. What I’m suggesting does the same, but saves them $1M in actual payroll. I tossed him in more as a favor to the Canes vs a benefit.

We could go with Bussi or find another veteran buried in the AHL on a 1 way if we don’t deem him as ready. There are a few of them like Dreidger or Jones

The rival piece is the biggest concern. It basically makes Carolina’s biggest weakness into a strength, but I believe that Orlov improves our defensive structure.

With regards to Lohrei, I believe we will trade him to Calgary, but my belief is it will be in a Hanifin deal.

You're not doing Carolina a favour by getting a solid NHL goalie at 1 mill.

Ullmark almost certainly does NOT get 8 mill.

And you aren't taking on Orlov at 7.75, you're taking him on at 5.

Top 4 LD and solid backup goalie for 6 mill combined+a 2nd round pick

Or borderline top 10 goalie at 8 mill. (Helle, Swayman, Vasy, Igor, Sorokin, Georgiev, Demko, Oetter, Hill, Saros)

Goalie values simply aren't that high

Bruins last 5-goals, over 3-NHL games (2W/1L) have ALL come from Brad M.!!!!!
They need a goal scorer...

I’m putting Orlov and Ullmark at the same dollar value over the next two years. I am saying he’s worth a second round pick more under that scenario. Nothing more. Good luck finding the team that takes Orlov as the salary swap and gives you an upgrade at your weakest position for a second round pick.

Orlov hasn’t been playing like a 7.5M per year player at all. Ullmark has been easily playing like a 5m a year player with excess value. If there is no second round pick, there is no way that Boston even contemplates doing this. They can go with Raanta and see how that goes. It frankly is in Boston’s best interest to let these teams flounder in the position.

Much like Jersey, their bad goaltending is one of the reasons they are underachieving. I’d argue the good goaltending is one of the reasons Boston is overachieving

I’d be more than open to do it for a forward on their roster, but my guess is they’d rather get rid of Orlov than that forward and there is minimal incentive for Boston to do this if it’s a straight swap.

You aren't putting them at the same dollar value. In order to make them the same cost for both teams that would be retaining 1.4 mill.

Then boston pays 6.4 mill both years for Orlov on their squad
and carolina pays 6.4 both years for Ullmark on their squad.

You're having boston pay 6 mill for both Raanta and Orlov

and carolina pay 8.25 for ullmark this year and 7.75 next year.

Take Raanta out. They can trade him for the late round pick for some goalie desperate team and pay retention to do it,

Carolina doesn’t pay a dollar more than what they were paying for Orlov

Boston doesn’t pay a dollar more than what they were paying for Ullmark

Ullmark looks like the better player and the better fit for Carolina.

Jersey needs a defender. What would you give for Orlov at $5m for the next two years and what salary are you giving them back to balance it? You are acting as if the contract they gave Orlov is a rationale one. It isn’t

I’d pay more for Orlov at 5 mill than I would for Ullmark.

1st+Vilen would be my offer. Maybe just a 1st if I could
And the offer for Ullmark would be a conditional 1st as I’ve discussed.

At best they’re equal value assets at the same cap hit, which is why it makes no sense for Carolina to throw in a pick and retain on a solid backup goalie as well

You don’t have the cap position to just trade a first round pick for him. You have to include a salary.

I’m sure a crappier goalie is what they want if you are going to peddle Vitek.

Your position on Ullmark’s value is interesting. Like I said, I’m more than willing to let Jersey and Carolina flounder at goaltending. It’s probably the best thing.

With Dougie on LTIR we do.

My position on Ullmark is:
Look at historical goalie values
Look at how unpredictable goalies are
Look at the fact he's never handled a true starters workload and the only time he did something close to it he apparently was too tired and fell apart come playoff time.

And don't look now but Schmid's been better since the start of November, especially when you take out the back to back game against the sharks (ullmark doesn't play on less than 2 days rest).

They’ve split Ullmark this year more often. He won the Vezina award at a 3 to 2 split with Swayman.

I see you are reverting back to the team with crappy goalies mantra. A few goalies get traded during cap constrained years and now the market is they are low.

I will agree that the likelihood you can get a good goalie for a cheaper dollar figure is higher because of pure numbers. The few teams that are lucky enough are happy. The rest underachieve

I hope for your sake, Schmid emerges because Vitek sucks and you are paying him 1.4m less than Ullmark to suck,

I didn’t realize that Dougie wasn’t coming back until the playoffs. If he isn’t, that makes perfect sense. If he is, enjoy that call with Chicago

We'd need the same cap to bring in Ullmark via trade so it doesn't. If you're saying send out Vanacek to make room for Ullmark, that's something I could do regardless when acquiring a backup G.

I can be much more sure of what I'm getting when I bring in a dman than I can bringing in a goalie.

Besides my targets are still on the cheaper end of goalies, and to roster 3 of them.

Schmid starter, Vanacek fighting with a guy like Stolarz, Lankinen, Kahkonen, Reimer, Allen, 6K for the backup role.

Or if I'm going heavy the targets are still guys like Jarry, Saros, Gustafsson, LT, Swayman

You aren’t paying attention to the cap constraint deals that have been happening this year at all. Have you?

Boston took two AHL defenseman for Taylor Hall
Vancouver took a 5 for a solid forward in Beau
Calgary took a 3rd and 5th for Zadarov

All three of those players are something Vanecek isn’t … good.

All I’m saying is unless Dougie is out until the playoffs or your team is stupid, I don’t see a draft pick trade for a player with multiple years on their contract. You are sending them a contract and it isn’t a particularly good one

The cap constraints don't apply to a 5mill 1B in Ullmark?

They count, but the Vezina award winner is actually a good player as opposed to Vanecek. I’d rather pay the 1.6m to get a very good goalie as opposed to a bad one.

Im suggesting a net neutral cap deal for both teams as opposed to a trade that no GM makes unless he knows a player is out until the playoffs (I had not heard that Dougie is out that long)

Get guy who was the #1 goalie last year and fits in the top 10 comfortably at your weakest position for a late 2nd and the salary most of your fan base views as your most expendable.

or

keep a player you overpaid whose strengths don’t fit your system and is currently on your 3rd line

Or

Acquire a first round pick, but have to take mediocre salary that doesn’t help your team this year. One likely has 2 years of term on it.

I know which one I find more appealing for a real contender like Carolina. If in a team that’s rebuilding, I go for the picks.

Damn, If only we had an example of a reigning Vezina winner being traded recently that we could compare value to.

Surely we don't have an example of the reigning vezina winner being traded for:

Future considerations at 7 mill
and then
a conditional 1st at 3.5 mill (didn't convey and ended up being a 2nd)

If I'm carolina I trust my 3 goalies to be good enough and don't open up a gaping hole on my back end.

Running Pyotr/Freddie/Raanta +Orlov is better than running Pyotr/Freddie/Ullmark+???? Fensore up from the ECHL?

AND you have them giving up the pick.

Carolina's gonna make the playoffs regardless. Is Ullmark any more trustworthy an option when you get there than whoever the hot hand is of Freddy/Raanta/Pyotr?

36 year old and I guess the cap doesn’t matter.

Former Hart Trophy Award Winner, Taylor Hall, gets traded for a second round pick (he had a NMC and forces a deal to a market) and then traded for two AHL defenseman in a year where the team had a 4.5’ cap overage. Apparently because of this example, all scoring forwards are nominal value. I’ll give you a conditional first for Jesper Bratt as long as he scores 30 using your logic.

If it’s easy as you say to acquire a good goalie, who’s your best goalie since Martin Broduer? It’s been a decade

I assume your GM is pretty talented based on your team’s talent. Outside of this inability to secure a competent goalie despite it being so easy, I can’t name a lot of flaws

Cory Schneider was one of the best goalies of his generation. The team around him just wasn’t built to win. Kept a lot of devils teams out of the absolute basement. Lou should have never traded for him tho bc it was time to rebuild

We got competent goaltending last year. Schmid has been better than Ullmark since the start of November

Yes the cap matters. Hence why locking up 10 mill over the next 2 years for a goalie of Ullmarks caliber and paying significant draft capital for that privilege isn’t something I want to do