Quoting: turtlemountain
CoachCoach - thanks for the response! I was more mentioning that other guy because he went through the thread name calling and then disappeared when people earnestly tried to engage.
As for the list of players: of course we don’t know who would be willing to sign where, personal lives, etc. My intent wasn’t to literally say: sign each of these guys. The point of listing so many options is from those 8+ guys, I feel like you can at least find a handful of options that are more compelling than the options Detroit committed to long term.
Detroit did some of them (again, I like Petry at his low cap hit. Ghostbear at a high hit for 1 year is totally reasonable). But the Yzerplan has had some big misses imo.
Already mentioned above but I just want to echo that as a Wings fan that has truly dug into this, and looked at these signings, I don't view any of the signings as big misses like some surface wings fans and fans from around the league do. You've provided sound analysis so I believe you're one that can come around on this and I'll explain:
- There is probably no reasonable, or especially sustainable way, the wings can seriously compete before the 25-26 season (likely Yzerman aware for some time)
- As a former player, Yzerman likely believes strongly in winning culture, setting a standard, etc etc you get the picture
- There is also the business side of hockey and the Wings have missed the playoffs for what will be close to 10 years, with a fan base used to success
- The Wings had some players in their prime, or entering their prime (Hronek, Larkin, Bert) that decision day was closing in on for new contracts
- Importantly to the above, would these players want to continue on a directionless team? One that has not been very competitive their whole career (long enough now)
- either move on from that era (Larkin, Bert) completely (delaying success further down the line), or try to figure out what is worth keeping around
- Yzerman chose to become more competitive and I completely support that. Didn't exactly have pick of the litter on UFAs though as a result of the last decade.
- This results in Chiarot, Maata, Kubalik, Perron (good!), Copp being signed. Does it improve the team? Definitely. Does it send a message to the team we are trying to improve? Definitely.
-Lots happened last season that needed to be cleaned up and Larkin even acknowledged there were a lot of things in the dressing room that were addressed - In addition, Bert injuries, Vrana issues, Hronek looking great but terrible at the same time. And of course, the decisions on re-signing Larking, Bert etc.
- This results in making the most of the situation, acquiring more assets (ASP, Boston 1st), keeping Larkin and moving on from a fair amount of the older regime.
- But the important bit is keeping Larkin - Thus, we don't have forever to go before being competitive and the young guys grow with a team trying to compete.
Back around to earlier point: 25-26 as first year we might seriously compete (but keep in mind, playoffs before then are desirable).
- Chiarot 4 years at 4.75 - expires in 2026
- Maata 1 year and then 2 years at 3 mil - expires in 2025
- Copp 5 years at 5.625 - expires in 2027
- Perron think we all agree was very good signing and is up this year
- Kubalik also short term and used in trade
- Compher 5 years at 5.1 - expires 2028
- Holl 3 years at 3.4 - expires in 2026
- Ghost, Walman, Petry, Kostin, Fischer are all low-risk, low-term, low-money deals that likely make this team better.
So the conclusion here: Yes, a few of these guys are overpaid and a few got probably what they were worth on the open market. A few got a bit more term than what was maybe desirable. THAT IS HOW WINGS GOT THEM TO SIGN HERE.
But here is the big couple of points:
- Only a couple of these guys are signed past 25-26 when we expect to be competing
- They should be relatively easy to get rid of contracts if necessary, and the wings have a good cap situation
- They should help mentor the young players and provide support - heck, Copp and Compher aren't exactly going to be washed at 31 are they? Likely are very good middle six 2 way players to pair with Kasper and Danielson to ease them into their role, and also help the team win now and then.
- The ones like Chiarot and Holl that everyone think are terrible have been role players in the past, have playoff experience, and would be fairly suitable as 6/7 dmen vets on a competitive team
- Would they be paid too much in that role? Yes, but for only 1 year on a team with no current cap issues that could easily get rid of them IF HAD TO
- Are they blocking the young players? Hardly. I am all for making the prospects earn their spot and now they have to. If these guys are as bad as some believe, they easily should earn that spot. But the competitive culture created is so much better! Many of the prospects are not yet ready and there is no one to block, yet we are still becoming more competitive now, and that is what the direction is trending towards. Build through the draft, subsidize through trades and ufas.
We can't pretend to know everything that goes on in the league, but reality is that not every player wants to go to Detroit, and not every player is a fit. Yzerman can only sign willing parties and at times may have to pay extra for those that are willing. We also don't know what offers these players had from other teams - lest we forget Chiarot was traded for a 1st. Now, that's not to say gun to his head he absolutely had to sign Holl and Chiarot. But let's face it, they play a depth, solidifying, veteran presence role on a team with a lot of uncertainty and change. Some Steadiness is likely a good thing, and yes, that even means their presence on mid-term deals. Their experience, grittiness, and even expendability (easier to scratch when beat out than a fan favourite lol) can be positives. Many of these signings have improved the team, improved the competitive culture of the team, and not handcuffed us long term or blocked the prospects from a spot. There is more depth for injuries as well. Checks across the board from me.
Sorry that is a lot, hope some of it makes sense. Just trying to honestly explain what has happened, why it has happened, and that it all fits into a reasonable plan for success. I personally think they earn a playoff spot this year.