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First Post v2

Créé par: HughMann413
Équipe: 2023-24 Capitals de Washington
Date de création initiale: 22 juin 2023
Publié: 22 juin 2023
Mode - plafond salarial: Basique
Description
Breakdown :

Mantha, 4th & 5th for Arizona 6th - He needs to go. Simple. Not many teams have the cap and a use for Mantha. However, Mantha might actually be useable in a place like Arizona.

Wilson & 8 OA For Nylander & 25th OA - I will explain the pick sell off later. I feel this would be a win win for both teams. Toronto needs grit, and Washington desperately needs point producing wingers. I do feel that Nylander is the more valuable player here. Wilson gives you the intangibles but the scoring touch of a mid to lower tier 2LW. Nylander is, well, a legit top line point producer and in today's NHL, you want the point producer. It would also be a great way of showing Backstrom how appreciated he is(As Nylander and Nicky are very close).

Kuznetsov for a 2nd, 2nd & 3rd - Chicago is gonna need some established players around Bedard. Youth movements are great, however it can backfire because of many reasons. I could easily see Kuzy in the 2C spot behind Bedard and both working on the PP1. To critique my own trade here, I don't think Kuzy is worth this much(Stupid Contract), so I'm ok with adjusting it as needed.

Oshie & a 2nd for 6th - Its ashame things are this way. :( Oshie can still be productive, however, his age, contract and susceptibility to injuries just destroys his value. Im not sure exactly what team would bite on this, so I just used Seattle as default in this trade. In my mind, Oshie could be useful there.

And now for the "Big One"...

McMichael, 1st, 2nd, 2nd & 3rd for Toews and O'Connor - Hear me out on this. Early in John Carlson's career when he was paired with Karl Alzner, is when Carlson was at his defensive best. The offense has always been there, but when he is paired with a TERRIFIC defense minded LD, the man is a better overall defensemen (Yes, Alzner was GOOD most of his time on the Caps). Pairing Carlson with Toews would be phenomenal. Look how good Toews makes Makar look(lol), but seriously, Toews is SO under appreciated. Colorado isnt going to give him up cheap, but there is a need for them to shed some cap. This would be a way to do that. I figure the trade breaks down as such. McMichael, 1st & 3rd for Toews and a 2nd & 3rd for O'connor. Might still need to add or subtract a little, but this IS close.

Free Agents :
- (RFA) Fehervary 3 x $3.1M : The season before last Fehervary proved that he can be a very solid lock down D-Man. He regressed a little this year, but in all fairness, the entire team regressed. Ive included a lot of 3 year deals. Timing is everything in transitions, and when Ovi rides off into the sunset, flexibility is going to be needed.

- (UFA) Tarasenko 3 x $5.75M : Yes, Vlad is getting older, however he is still really productive and would be a "younger" option than Oshie. His $ value isnt what it once was, so I feel the $5.75M AAV is fair. Would be good to give Ovi a buddy after shipping out Kuzy, and having Vlad around to help in the development of Suzdalev and I.M. could be HUGE.

- (UFA) Bunting 3 x $5.25M : Despite some questionsble decisions, Bunting is a very solid option at 2LW. He has proved that he can be a 50 point producer and is just now coming into his prime. He looses value because of his aforementioned decision making and He isnt going to win a Selke, but can be trusted with 2nd line minutes with confidence.

- (UFA) Nosek 3 x $3M : You know what your gonna get with Nosek. His numbers stay very consistent from year to year, nothing much, but acceptable based on what else he brings to the ice. He wins faceoffs, can be physical and is responsible with the puck. I also think he would gel well with Protas and O'Connor. I would expect a 15 to 20ish percent increase in his numbers as well if put into this situation.

Final Thoughts :

Its obvious that in this scenario, Im going all in on Ovis last few years. Giving up so many picks can be dangerous, however, if you do the math, the average age of this team is about 28. So when Ovi and Nicky retire, it wouldn't be nearly as painful as our current situation. Speaking of Nicky. I was very disappointed with how we handled Holtby. He had a small rough patch and we bailed on him. I feel as if the lack of confidence from the organization played a major role in his regression. The Caps CANT do this same thing to Backstrom. Nicky has always been a warrior. From being criminally under rated in his prime(ONE All Star game...WTF?) to the IIHF stuff to his injuries, he has always been a professional. I have a lot of confidence that he can bounce back this year. Putting him on the first line with Ovi(seriously, never should break these two up) and with his bud Nylander would be amazing to watch.

Hugh Mann
Signatures de joueurs autonomes
RFAANSCAP HIT
33 100 000 $
UFAANSCAP HIT
35 750 000 $
35 250 000 $
33 000 000 $
Transactions
1.
WSH
  1. Choix de 6e ronde en 2023 (CBJ)
ARI
  1. Mantha, Anthony
  2. Choix de 4e ronde en 2023 (WSH)
  3. Choix de 5e ronde en 2023 (WSH)
2.
WSH
  1. Nylander, William
  2. Choix de 1e ronde en 2023 (BOS)
TOR
  1. Wilson, Tom
  2. Choix de 1e ronde en 2023 (WSH)
3.
WSH
  1. Choix de 2e ronde en 2023 (OTT)
  2. Choix de 2e ronde en 2023 (TBL)
  3. Choix de 3e ronde en 2023 (DAL)
4.
COL
  1. McMichael, Connor
  2. Choix de 1e ronde en 2023 (BOS)
  3. Choix de 2e ronde en 2023 (OTT)
  4. Choix de 3e ronde en 2023 (DAL)
  5. Choix de 3e ronde en 2024 (BOS)
5.
WSH
  1. Choix de 6e ronde en 2023 (WSH)
SEA
  1. Oshie, T.J.
  2. Choix de 2e ronde en 2023 (TBL)
Repêchage1e ronde2e ronde3e ronde4e ronde5e ronde6e ronde7e ronde
2023
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2024
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2025
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TAILLE DE LA FORMATIONPLAFOND SALARIALCAP HITEXCÉDENTS Info-bulleBONISESPACE SOUS LE PLAFOND SALARIAL
2383 500 000 $83 434 866 $20 000 $315 000 $65 134 $
Ailier gaucheCentreAilier droit
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9 500 000 $9 500 000 $
AG
M-NTC, NMC
UFA - 3
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9 200 000 $9 200 000 $
C
M-NTC
UFA - 2
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6 962 366 $6 962 366 $
AD
NMC
UFA - 1
5 250 000 $5 250 000 $
AG
UFA - 3
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5 000 000 $5 000 000 $
C
UFA - 5
5 750 000 $5 750 000 $
AD
UFA - 1
Logo de Avalanche du Colorado
1 050 000 $1 050 000 $
AD, AG
UFA - 2
3 000 000 $3 000 000 $
AG, C
UFA - 1
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789 167 $789 167 $ (Bonis de performance82 500 $$82K)
AD, AG, C
UFA - 1
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1 900 000 $1 900 000 $
AG, AD
UFA - 3
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1 300 000 $1 300 000 $
C
UFA - 2
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1 225 000 $1 225 000 $
AD
UFA - 1
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800 000 $800 000 $
AG
UFA - 1
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863 333 $863 333 $ (Bonis de performance232 500 $$232K)
C
RFA - 2
Défenseur gaucherDéfenseur droitierGardien de but
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4 100 000 $4 100 000 $
DG
UFA - 1
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8 000 000 $8 000 000 $
DD
M-NTC
UFA - 3
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5 250 000 $5 250 000 $
G
M-NTC
UFA - 4
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1 400 000 $1 400 000 $
DG
UFA - 1
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4 050 000 $4 050 000 $
DD
UFA - 3
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1 100 000 $1 100 000 $
G
UFA - 2
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3 100 000 $3 100 000 $
DG/DD
RFA - 3
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3 000 000 $3 000 000 $
DD
UFA - 3
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825 000 $825 000 $
DG/DD
RFA - 2

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22 juin 2023 à 23 h 26
#1
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Appreciate the work that went into this but this is not the route to go
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22 juin 2023 à 23 h 29
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Quoting: perrystreett
Appreciate the work that went into this but this is not the route to go


How so? I'm all for differing opinions and looking at multiple options.
22 juin 2023 à 23 h 31
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Really well thought out.

I know you said any team and I'm sure Oshie's family would love to see him in play for the Kraken, but I don't see how it fits on the roster there as it's their deepest position.
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22 juin 2023 à 23 h 34
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Hard no from Chicago
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22 juin 2023 à 23 h 34
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Quoting: KrakBirds23
Really well thought out.

I know you said any team and I'm sure Oshie's family would love to see him in play for the Kraken, but I don't see how it fits on the roster there as it's their deepest position.


Yeah...I get that. Did it for the same reason you mentioned. It's hard, someone like Oshie you WANT to put in a spot that he would enjoy, but in reality...you just gotta send em anywhere to give the TEAM flexibility.
22 juin 2023 à 23 h 42
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Quoting: PaulKorea
Hard no from Chicago


They don't want a semi legit 2C who can fill in as 1C as needed? No Kuzy isn't perfect and honestly I am not a fan of his, but he does have value. He can produce points, and can be very valuable(See Cup Run). He only has a couple years left on his contract. And as I mentioned I would be willing to ask less if needed. What is his value to you? What options does Chicago have right now at center? (hint: behind Bedard.nothing).
22 juin 2023 à 23 h 49
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Overpay for Nylander. All for adding Nylander but not at the cost of Willy who won’t be moved.

Toews and O’Connor are not fits. Toews is a really good player but the D is set and we need to upgrade the top 6 not the bottom 6. Plus we shouldn’t trade McMike.

Osh isn’t going anywhere. Hopefully he gets healthy and is solid like he was at times last year. Outside chance at LTIRetire but doubtful. Don’t think anyone would take him.

Don’t think Bunting or Tarasenko are great fits.

I think Kuzy prolly stays so really we are looking at plugging McMike in and upgrading one top 6 winger.

Again great work, but not the route I think we should go
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22 juin 2023 à 23 h 54
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Appreciate the thought and logic here but I think this team takes another step back with this construction. That center group is extremely questionable and weak.
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22 juin 2023 à 23 h 55
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Quoting: HughMann413
They don't want a semi legit 2C who can fill in as 1C as needed?


Im sure they are but they aren't giving up a bunch of picks for one.
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23 juin 2023 à 0 h 5
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Quoting: perrystreett
Overpay for Nylander. All for adding Nylander but not at the cost of Willy who won’t be moved.

Toews and O’Connor are not fits. Toews is a really good player but the D is set and we need to upgrade the top 6 not the bottom 6. Plus we shouldn’t trade McMike.

Osh isn’t going anywhere. Hopefully he gets healthy and is solid like he was at times last year. Outside chance at LTIRetire but doubtful. Don’t think anyone would take him.

Don’t think Bunting or Tarasenko are great fits.

I think Kuzy prolly stays so really we are looking at plugging McMike in and upgrading one top 6 winger.

Again great work, but not the route I think we should go


Nylander had 87 points last year. Was +10. And had 70 TK compared to 37 GV. Wilson in his BEST year had 52 points. Yes, Wilson is physical. Yes the fans love him. But to get a player like Nylander and put him opposite of Ovi is a no brainer in my mind. Especially with Nylander just now going into his prime. I also don't like labeling most players as "not going to move". The Caps have always been pretty closed lip on their dealings. Also with Carbery just coming from Toronto, I feel like more Leafs are coming out way. smile

To say that our D is set, is to say you are comfortable with 3 YOUNG (with a lot to prove) players patrolling the left side. Bringing in Toews gives us that ultra reliable and steady Dman on the left, hence giving the three more time to develop and gain experience.

Oshies great, but sacrifices need to be made if we are going to follow through with our promise to Ovi.

How is a 50 point producer with a little snarl a bad fit? And how is a likely hall of famer who can do about everything a bad fit? Especially when there is a connection with Ovi.

McMike is not a center...never will be. In my opinion as well, he will never be more than a Gustav Nyquist type guy. And that's probably too high of a ceiling. I personally prefer Lapierre. But that's me.

Thank you for sharing your thoughts. This is definitely fun.
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23 juin 2023 à 0 h 11
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Quoting: vikhodush
Appreciate the thought and logic here but I think this team takes another step back with this construction. That center group is extremely questionable and weak.


Ok. How so? I have a hard time thinking that adding the following would lead to regression...
50P+ LW
Solid 3rd Line LW
Beast of a 3/4C
ALL STAR Caliber RW who's only 27
Still very productive RW (possible future HOFer)
One of the top 3 Best Defensive Defensemen in the NHL

I can't agree that this team would get worse from a team that was so bad last year, they "earned" the 8th overall pick. Sorry
23 juin 2023 à 0 h 44
#12
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This team already looks a lot more realistic than the one you posted earlier. I appreciate the fresh perspective - it’s so easy to get wrapped up in the same fantasy trades and not think outside the box. There’s a few things I’d want to do differently, but nice work and explanations.
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23 juin 2023 à 0 h 53
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If I’m Chicago, I’m not putting Kuznetsov anywhere near Bedard. Bedard doesn’t need drama or drugs.
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23 juin 2023 à 1 h 23
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The return for Toews must be immediate impact. There is no chance the Avs agree to basically end their window for futures.

There isn’t a player on the caps roster that makes sense for a Toews trade. And LoC on top is just adding to the “never happening” sandwich.

EDIT: also that’s a weak set of futures for that return lol
23 juin 2023 à 3 h 24
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Quoting: HughMann413
Nylander had 87 points last year. Was +10. And had 70 TK compared to 37 GV. Wilson in his BEST year had 52 points. Yes, Wilson is physical. Yes the fans love him. But to get a player like Nylander and put him opposite of Ovi is a no brainer in my mind. Especially with Nylander just now going into his prime. I also don't like labeling most players as "not going to move". The Caps have always been pretty closed lip on their dealings. Also with Carbery just coming from Toronto, I feel like more Leafs are coming out way. smile


I don't think the difference is as big as you're making it out to be. You're leaving out that Wilson's elite defensively while Nylander's very much not. At ES their production is closer than it seems. Wilson's was down this year, obviously due to returning mid-year from a torn ACL, but over the four previous seasons he had 1.86 P/60. Nylander over the same span had 2.14 P/60. The thing that really separates them is that Nylander gets first unit PP time with Matthews and Marner, while Wilson gets second unit PP time with a tired Ovechkin who was out with the first unit and Lars Eller. I think Nylander's PP production would crater in Washington because A) it's a significantly worse supporting cast, and B) how do you incorporate a right-shot sniper onto a PP that's already built around getting the puck to a different right-shot sniper? If they keep Forsythe's 1-3-1 set up I don't know where you put Nylander. Even if they move to something else though, how do you design a PP around both Ovie and Nylander? I can't think of a way that wouldn't force one of them to go underutilized. If you keep Wilson though and they stick with something built around the 1-3-1, then he slides right into Oshie's slot in the middle and probably adds 10-15 points a year to his total.

Also, the Caps were tight-lipped under McPhee, but MacLellan's a straight shooter. He doesn't dodge questions and he pretty much always does what he says. He just seems tight-lipped because the DC hockey media is non-existent so he never gets any interesting questions. He said he wants Wilson to retire a Cap, Elliotte Friedman got pretty much the same feedback when he probed about the Wilson situation a week or so ago, so the only question for me is how long it takes after July 1 for them to get the Wilson extension finalized.

Quote:
Oshies great, but sacrifices need to be made if we are going to follow through with our promise to Ovi.


It's kind of weird to me how you're totally willing to overlook Backstrom's massive decline because of his service to the team, but you also want to kick Oshie to the curb. Backstrom's the much, much more dire medical situation IMO. There's no precedent for a guy making a comeback from the surgery he had, and MacLellan seemed extremely pessimistic about Backstrom's chances of improving this summer.

Quote:
How is a 50 point producer with a little snarl a bad fit? And how is a likely hall of famer who can do about everything a bad fit? Especially when there is a connection with Ovi.


I mean, I'd rather just keep our own 50 point producer with a lot of snarl who's beloved in the organization. As for Tarasenko, I don't think he's a likely hall of famer but I wouldn't mind him. What's his connection to Ovie though, aside from being Russian?

The two of them together seem like a bad fit though because you've already created a top line that needs to be heavily sheltered with an aging Ovechkin, crippled Backstrom, and swapping Wilson for Nylander. Then you've constructed another line here with Bunting-Strome-Tarasenko that's also nothing but offense, and you've run out of cap room so you're left with basically two 4th lines that'll be forced to play a lot of tough minutes because of the makeup of the top 6.

Quote:
McMike is not a center...never will be. In my opinion as well, he will never be more than a Gustav Nyquist type guy. And that's probably too high of a ceiling. I personally prefer Lapierre. But that's me.


McMichael hasn't been given a shot to be a center at the NHL level, which IMO is a big part of problem - he's a much better fit at center than win. At the AHL level this year he got to play center and definitely outperformed Lapierre. His boxcars won't jump out at you, but the Bears played a very D-focused style and nobody on that team had gaudy point totals. The fact that he was the 2C on a team that won the Calder Cup is enough for me to want him to get a real shot at C in the NHL.
23 juin 2023 à 5 h 47
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Remove both 3round pick and add Alexeyev .
Avs accept
23 juin 2023 à 6 h 57
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I seem to be the only caps fan that would rather have Wilson over Nylander. Before his injury Wilson was progressing towards 30 goal, 60 puts seasons, and really picked it up and caught his stride towards the end of the season. He just brings so many intangibles to the team and honestly Nylander benefits from playing with some much higher end players.
23 juin 2023 à 7 h 27
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Add the 8th overall pick and CHI accepts.
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23 juin 2023 à 8 h 5
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Quoting: HughMann413
Ok. How so? I have a hard time thinking that adding the following would lead to regression...
50P+ LW
Solid 3rd Line LW
Beast of a 3/4C
ALL STAR Caliber RW who's only 27
Still very productive RW (possible future HOFer)
One of the top 3 Best Defensive Defensemen in the NHL

I can't agree that this team would get worse from a team that was so bad last year, they "earned" the 8th overall pick. Sorry


Your 1C can barely skate and is almost completely broken down. He should be a 3C at most at this point of his career. Your 2C is average. Your 3C is better suited as a 4C. You have a good 4C.

Maybe I was a bit harsh but they also bottomed out on purpose in the second half last year. While some of the adds you made are nice, this team reminds me of the Canucks with a better defense. I just don’t think you can win consistently with the centers you have.
23 juin 2023 à 8 h 41
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The Leafs probably won't trade Nylander to a team in their conference
23 juin 2023 à 8 h 43
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Quoting: HughMann413
Nylander had 87 points last year. Was +10. And had 70 TK compared to 37 GV. Wilson in his BEST year had 52 points. Yes, Wilson is physical. Yes the fans love him. But to get a player like Nylander and put him opposite of Ovi is a no brainer in my mind. Especially with Nylander just now going into his prime. I also don't like labeling most players as "not going to move". The Caps have always been pretty closed lip on their dealings. Also with Carbery just coming from Toronto, I feel like more Leafs are coming out way. smile

To say that our D is set, is to say you are comfortable with 3 YOUNG (with a lot to prove) players patrolling the left side. Bringing in Toews gives us that ultra reliable and steady Dman on the left, hence giving the three more time to develop and gain experience.

Oshies great, but sacrifices need to be made if we are going to follow through with our promise to Ovi.

How is a 50 point producer with a little snarl a bad fit? And how is a likely hall of famer who can do about everything a bad fit? Especially when there is a connection with Ovi.

McMike is not a center...never will be. In my opinion as well, he will never be more than a Gustav Nyquist type guy. And that's probably too high of a ceiling. I personally prefer Lapierre. But that's me.

Thank you for sharing your thoughts. This is definitely fun.



Nylander is the far superior player but i think their trade values are similar. It would take a big overpay to get Wilson (the kings inquired about him and GMBM said get lost we won’t move him), and it seems likely Toronto moves 1 of the core 4 likely resulting in a little less value than Nylander deserves. I think the trade would be close to a 1 for 1 with their values. Nylander is worth his value, Wilson is not.

I’m not exactly comfortable with our D, but I think they are set. It’s not a bad group, definitely young which is exactly what this team needs. Toews is awesome and I’d be happy to have him but I think we will use our resources to upgrade the top 6 not the D. I think the top 6 needs it a bit more.

I’m all for moving osh just can’t see it happening.

This team needs to get younger and faster while adding a bonafide top 6 winger. Bunting is a good skater and somewhat young but he’s a middle 6 guy. tarasenko is a good player but will cost more then he’s worth and get too much term. This UFA class is weak and I expect to add to the top 6 via trade.

I think I’m higher on McMike than most, but i expect Kuzy to stay and McMike to be LW.

Love the convo
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23 juin 2023 à 9 h 26
#22
Birddog
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Quoting: swissmontana
The return for Toews must be immediate impact. There is no chance the Avs agree to basically end their window for futures.

There isn’t a player on the caps roster that makes sense for a Toews trade. And LoC on top is just adding to the “never happening” sandwich.

EDIT: also that’s a weak set of futures for that return lol


Wilson and Kuznetsov make lots of sense for the AVs.
23 juin 2023 à 9 h 31
#23
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AZ declines. They aren't going to pay Mantha's $6.5m actual salary. His contract is the opposite of the type of deal AZ would be open to acquiring.

Hawks decline as well. Giving up 3 picks for an aging, disgruntled veteran who has off ice baggage attached is not a good move for a rebuilding team. I honestly don't see Kuzy getting moved for much of anything w/o 50% retention.
23 juin 2023 à 11 h 56
#24
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Quoting: Newtown
If I’m Chicago, I’m not putting Kuznetsov anywhere near Bedard. Bedard doesn’t need drama or drugs.


Bedard is gonna be around drama and drugs no matter what happens. EVERY NHL player is around drama and drugs. Part of being great in the NHL is exhibiting maturity and refrain. Kuzy got caught(ish). MOST drug use just never gets the light shown on it. All sports are this way...just look at Ja Morant right now. It's an inevitable reality that happens when you mix fame, money and influence.
23 juin 2023 à 12 h 0
#25
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Quoting: swissmontana
The return for Toews must be immediate impact. There is no chance the Avs agree to basically end their window for futures.

There isn’t a player on the caps roster that makes sense for a Toews trade. And LoC on top is just adding to the “never happening” sandwich.

EDIT: also that’s a weak set of futures for that return lol


The immediate impact of a trade like this is freeing up cap space and getting draft capital as trade fodder. I do believe I mention that the trade could need to be tweaked. I have a very elevated opinion on Toews. So I understand he wouldn't be cheap. smile
 
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