SalarySwishSalarySwish
Forums/Armchair-GM

Dubois Plan Read Desc

Créé par: notphilly4383
Équipe: 2023-24 Canadiens de Montréal
Date de création initiale: 27 mars 2023
Publié: 28 mars 2023
Mode - plafond salarial: Basique
Description
ALRIGHT ALRIGHT JETS FANS. Before you yell at me in the comments on the rather low return on Dubois, let me explain myself. The return for Dubois will end up being low, and this is because Dubois can take his QO in the offseason, and that would walk him to unrestricted free agency once that contract expires. In that scenario were Dubois takes the QO with the Jets, Montreal can sign him to an 7-8yr deal in free agency. This means Montreal is treating Dubois in terms of value, as a rental. A prime comparable in value being the Bo Horvat trade, which my mock trade is sort of based off of although the return isn't exact. I also acknowledge that Hoffman isn't a fantastic player, but I think people would like him more if he was being paid less. This is also a low risk pickup for the Jets because he'll be a UFA next offseason, and could become a tradeable asset at the deadline. I also know that the Jets don't have a ton of space for Hoffman, but the spots should open up for him considering if they trade Dubois, that's signaling some sort of retool/rebuild anyways. Plus, the cap hit isn't a huge concern for the Jets anyway, especially for one year.

But why not wait if you're MTL? Well, it mainly just avoids the risk of him driving up his asking price in free agency, and getting him early naturally accelerates the rebuild. Even though some players do make it clear when they want to play for a certain team like Dubois has, the money is always a concern. Although I expect Dubois to take a small discount to play for MTL, he will still demand a good chunk of change. In my opinion, Montreal always wins somewhat in this situation because if they don't trade for Dubois with the Florida 1st, they can just draft a solid center instead (which this draft has many of), so not getting Dubois at the draft isn't the end of the world by any means.
Signatures de joueurs autonomes
LISTE DE RÉSERVEANSCAP HIT
2800 000 $
3950 000 $
RFAANSCAP HIT
88 125 000 $
88 000 000 $
1875 000 $
13 000 000 $
31 500 000 $
11 175 000 $
1775 000 $
1850 000 $
11 337 500 $
Transactions
1.
MTL
  1. Dubois, Pierre-Luc [Droits de RFA]
WPG
  1. Hoffman, Mike
  2. Kidney, Riley
  3. Choix de 1e ronde en 2023 (FLA)
2.
MTL
  1. Choix de 3e ronde en 2023 (NJD)
PIT
  1. Edmundson, Joel (1 750 000 $ retained)
Rachats de contrats
Transactions impliquant une retenue de salaire
Enfoui
Repêchage1e ronde2e ronde3e ronde4e ronde5e ronde6e ronde7e ronde
2023
Logo de MTL
Logo de MTL
Logo de MTL
Logo de NJD
Logo de MTL
Logo de PIT
Logo de VGK
Logo de MTL
Logo de CGY
Logo de MTL
Logo de MTL
2024
Logo de MTL
Logo de COL
Logo de MTL
Logo de MTL
Logo de MTL
Logo de SJS
Logo de MTL
Logo de MTL
Logo de EDM
2025
Logo de MTL
Logo de CGY
Logo de MTL
Logo de MTL
Logo de MTL
Logo de MTL
Logo de MTL
Logo de MTL
TAILLE DE LA FORMATIONPLAFOND SALARIALCAP HITEXCÉDENTS Info-bulleBONISESPACE SOUS LE PLAFOND SALARIAL
2383 500 000 $76 459 166 $1 170 000 $4 752 500 $7 040 834 $
Ailier gaucheCentreAilier droit
Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
8 000 000 $8 000 000 $
AG, AD
UFA - 8
Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
7 875 000 $7 875 000 $
C
UFA - 7
Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
3 362 500 $3 362 500 $
C, AD
RFA - 3
Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
950 000 $950 000 $ (Bonis de performance3 500 000 $$4M)
AD, AG
RFA - 2
8 125 000 $8 125 000 $
C
UFA - 8
Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
5 500 000 $5 500 000 $
AD, AG
M-NTC
UFA - 4
Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
897 500 $897 500 $ (Bonis de performance557 500 $$558K)
AD, AG
RFA - 2
Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
4 450 000 $4 450 000 $
C
M-NTC
UFA - 2
Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
3 000 000 $3 000 000 $
AD, AG
UFA - 1
Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
1 500 000 $1 500 000 $
AG, AD
RFA - 2
Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
6 500 000 $6 500 000 $
AD, AG
M-NTC, NMC
UFA - 4
Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
1 175 000 $1 175 000 $
AG, AD
UFA - 2
Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
1 700 000 $1 700 000 $
C
UFA - 2
Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
1 337 500 $1 337 500 $
AD, AG
RFA - 1
Défenseur gaucherDéfenseur droitierGardien de but
Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
4 875 000 $4 875 000 $
DG
M-NTC
UFA - 3
Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
3 500 000 $3 500 000 $
DD
UFA - 2
Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
1 925 000 $1 925 000 $
G
M-NTC
UFA - 2
Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
925 000 $925 000 $ (Bonis de performance275 000 $$275K)
DD
RFA - 1
Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
1 000 000 $1 000 000 $
G
UFA - 1
Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
863 333 $863 333 $ (Bonis de performance420 000 $$420K)
DG/DD
RFA - 2
Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
828 333 $828 333 $
DG/DD
RFA - 1
Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
1 400 000 $1 400 000 $
DG/DD
RFA - 2
Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
766 667 $766 667 $
DD
UFA - 2
Laissés de côtéListe des blessés (IR)Liste des blessés à long terme (LTIR)
Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
10 500 000 $10 500 000 $
G
NMC
UFA - 3
Équipe de réserve
Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
835 000 $835 000 $ (0 $$00 $$0) (Bonis de performance57 500 $$58K)
AG, AD
RFA - 3
Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
885 000 $885 000 $ (0 $$00 $$0)
C
RFA - 4

Code d'intégration

  • Pour afficher cette équipe sur un autre site Web ou blog, ajoutez ce iFrame à la page appropriée
  • Personnalisez les dimensions dans le code IFrame ci-dessous pour adapter votre site de manière appropriée. Minimum recommandé: 400px.

Texte intégré

Cliquer pour surligner
28 mars 2023 à 18 h 15
#1
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: juill. 2020
Messages: 16,176
Mentions "j'aime": 7,201
No from Winnipeg. They're not taking back a bad contract and less than they can get for PLD as a rental.

The QO doesn't affect his value at all. You'll need to beat a standard TDL offer and deal with your cap issues on your own.

There's no logical or rational reason for the Jets to take less than they would get for Dubois as a rental.
28 mars 2023 à 18 h 19
#2
Miss YA Killer
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: juin 2022
Messages: 3,887
Mentions "j'aime": 1,473
7 not 8 as a UFA. Even if he was your UFA if he officially becomes a UFA you can no longer offer 8.
Example Steven Stamkos that year they had the 4 day period prior to FA players and teams could meet . As Stamkos said after his meeting with Toronto on that Tuesday He walked into Yzerman's office Wednesday morning and told him to get him the most he could include the NMC and make it by our proof for 8 years. Which he had to sign before that Friday or only 7 would be able to get done.
28 mars 2023 à 18 h 19
#3
Jetsfan
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: sept. 2017
Messages: 8,015
Mentions "j'aime": 2,598
Mike Hoffman isnt as good as Beaulievier (SIC)

Take off your rose coloured glasses
28 mars 2023 à 18 h 23
#4
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: juin 2018
Messages: 1,258
Mentions "j'aime": 283
I WISH THAT WE COULD GIVE SO LITTLE probably no hoffman and add one of our young def but i would make that trade.. of course winnipeg fans think they are getting much more but winnipeg doesnt have any leverAGE.. tHEY CAN KEEP HIM ONE MORE YEar BUT THEN THEY RISK LOSING HIM FOR NOTHING and if they trade him at the deadline they will get a ist pick and not much more.... so winnipeg need to trade him at the draft and try to get a top pick and an nhl ready young player or two..... The prospects will hurt but it wont be hutson or farrell.. i think they will want to keep those guys but it could be harris or xjerex or barron who have to go...... So maybe the florida pick and harris and maybe they might want a center like dvorak and maybe even another pick
Andy_Dick a aimé ceci.
28 mars 2023 à 18 h 27
#5
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: janv. 2022
Messages: 4,070
Mentions "j'aime": 1,457
Maybe switch Hoffman to Dvorak as he has a longer cap to help the habs and a C to replace Dubois and add in another b prospect and I'd say that's about right
28 mars 2023 à 18 h 28
#6
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: janv. 2022
Messages: 4,070
Mentions "j'aime": 1,457
Quoting: danielcoe
I WISH THAT WE COULD GIVE SO LITTLE probably no hoffman and add one of our young def but i would make that trade.. of course winnipeg fans think they are getting much more but winnipeg doesnt have any leverAGE.. tHEY CAN KEEP HIM ONE MORE YEar BUT THEN THEY RISK LOSING HIM FOR NOTHING and if they trade him at the deadline they will get a ist pick and not much more.... so winnipeg need to trade him at the draft and try to get a top pick and an nhl ready young player or two..... The prospects will hurt but it wont be hutson or farrell.. i think they will want to keep those guys but it could be harris or xjerex or barron who have to go...... So maybe the florida pick and harris and maybe they might want a center like dvorak and maybe even another pick


Jets don't need LHD not lhd prospects not lhd nhls not even Harris who can play both sides just not a need whatsoever
28 mars 2023 à 18 h 36
#7
I Love J Boqvist
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: janv. 2023
Messages: 12,579
Mentions "j'aime": 3,353
If he hits UFA his price shoots up. Dubois plan for years has been to hit UFA and maximize his earnings. Think 9 mill+ if he has another great season next year
Windjammer a aimé ceci.
28 mars 2023 à 18 h 36
#8
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: juin 2018
Messages: 1,258
Mentions "j'aime": 283
Quoting: Howie
Jets don't need LHD not lhd prospects not lhd nhls not even Harris who can play both sides just not a need whatsoever



so you could give them Barron he has all the pedigree but that and a first and maybe either kidney or dvorak but certainly not more than that... Anyone else you trade him to knows that it is for one year only so that limits what they will pay and mtl knows this. winnipeg fans will be disappointed just like blackhawks fans with the kane return.... A superstar and they didnt even get a first round pick... just understand if winnipeg goes into the season with him he will get less and you missed getting draft picks in a really good draft.... I dont think that is smart... they should move him at the draft.... Remember thaT FLO PICK COULD BE TOP 15 and that gets you a star player
28 mars 2023 à 18 h 50
#9
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: janv. 2022
Messages: 4,070
Mentions "j'aime": 1,457
Quoting: danielcoe
so you could give them Barron he has all the pedigree but that and a first and maybe either kidney or dvorak but certainly not more than that... Anyone else you trade him to knows that it is for one year only so that limits what they will pay and mtl knows this. winnipeg fans will be disappointed just like blackhawks fans with the kane return.... A superstar and they didnt even get a first round pick... just understand if winnipeg goes into the season with him he will get less and you missed getting draft picks in a really good draft.... I dont think that is smart... they should move him at the draft.... Remember thaT FLO PICK COULD BE TOP 15 and that gets you a star player


Yeah so Florida 1st kidney Mailloux and Dvorak is a deal that both can work with leaves barron for the Habs and jets get a little bit of everything
28 mars 2023 à 19 h 23
#10
Démarrer sujet
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: juill. 2022
Messages: 49
Mentions "j'aime": 15
Quoting: Windjammer
No from Winnipeg. They're not taking back a bad contract and less than they can get for PLD as a rental.

The QO doesn't affect his value at all. You'll need to beat a standard TDL offer and deal with your cap issues on your own.

There's no logical or rational reason for the Jets to take less than they would get for Dubois as a rental.


What do you think Dubois is worth as a rental? Because quite honestly I think you overvalue the player a little bit. And you have to remember Winnipeg is kinda lacking in the leverage department in this situation
28 mars 2023 à 19 h 24
#11
Démarrer sujet
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: juill. 2022
Messages: 49
Mentions "j'aime": 15
Quoting: Boltsradynasty
7 not 8 as a UFA. Even if he was your UFA if he officially becomes a UFA you can no longer offer 8.
Example Steven Stamkos that year they had the 4 day period prior to FA players and teams could meet . As Stamkos said after his meeting with Toronto on that Tuesday He walked into Yzerman's office Wednesday morning and told him to get him the most he could include the NMC and make it by our proof for 8 years. Which he had to sign before that Friday or only 7 would be able to get done.


Oh right lol I forgot UFA's get 7 years max lol. That's my bad
28 mars 2023 à 19 h 27
#12
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: juill. 2020
Messages: 16,176
Mentions "j'aime": 7,201
Quoting: notphilly4383
What do you think Dubois is worth as a rental? Because quite honestly I think you overvalue the player a little bit. And you have to remember Winnipeg is kinda lacking in the leverage department in this situation


As a pure rental he gets a 1st and a good prospect minimum. Probably a little more.

How do the Jets lack in the leverage department? Dubois is an RFA with no trade protection. No one can force the Jets to trade Dubois anywhere they don't want to.

The Horvat return is an almost prefect comparable.
28 mars 2023 à 19 h 27
#13
Démarrer sujet
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: juill. 2022
Messages: 49
Mentions "j'aime": 15
Quoting: Jetman
Mike Hoffman isnt as good as Beaulievier (SIC)

Take off your rose coloured glasses


I never once said Hoffman was better, or just as good as beauvillier. In fact I think Hoffman is easily the worse of the two. But you also have to consider that vancouver took on Beauv WITH TERM LEFT and were already and will be in cap hell and beauv contributes to that too. Hoffman doesn't impact the jets cap situation nearly as much
Andy_Dick a aimé ceci.
28 mars 2023 à 19 h 30
#14
Démarrer sujet
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: juill. 2022
Messages: 49
Mentions "j'aime": 15
Quoting: Howie
Maybe switch Hoffman to Dvorak as he has a longer cap to help the habs and a C to replace Dubois and add in another b prospect and I'd say that's about right


I think the Dvorak injury kinda messes up this idea, but if Winnipeg would be willing to take on an injured Dvorak I'd be all for that if it meant adding another prospect. I just can't see that prospect being Roy.
28 mars 2023 à 19 h 32
#15
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: janv. 2022
Messages: 4,070
Mentions "j'aime": 1,457
Quoting: notphilly4383
I think the Dvorak injury kinda messes up this idea, but if Winnipeg would be willing to take on an injured Dvorak I'd be all for that if it meant adding another prospect. I just can't see that prospect being Roy.


I'd 100% be on board for a Florida 2023 first kidney Mailloux and Dvorak
28 mars 2023 à 19 h 34
#16
Démarrer sujet
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: juill. 2022
Messages: 49
Mentions "j'aime": 15
Quoting: Windjammer
As a pure rental he gets a 1st and a good prospect minimum. Probably a little more.

How do the Jets lack in the leverage department? Dubois is an RFA with no trade protection. No one can force the Jets to trade Dubois anywhere they don't want to.

The Horvat return is an almost prefect comparable.


Jets lack leverage cause at the end of the day, Montreal is where Dubois wants to be, and Montreal wants Dubois. I can't see him agreeing to a contract with Winnipeg that has more than 1 year on it. And I get my trade isnt exactly like the Horvat trade but beauv>hoffman, Florida 1st > Isles 1st, and raty>kidney but Montreal has almost no reason to pay more than rental-like amount for dubois.
28 mars 2023 à 19 h 36
#17
Démarrer sujet
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: juill. 2022
Messages: 49
Mentions "j'aime": 15
Quoting: Howie
I'd 100% be on board for a Florida 2023 first kidney Mailloux and Dvorak


I'd be equally fine with that, but I think mailloux is not for trade due to the scandal around him.
28 mars 2023 à 19 h 40
#18
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: janv. 2022
Messages: 4,070
Mentions "j'aime": 1,457
Quoting: notphilly4383
I'd be equally fine with that, but I think mailloux is not for trade due to the scandal around him.


Yeah maybe but I still think that it makes sense organizationally maybe Kapanen or someone similar instead but I feel in the long run if he's cleared he would be more likely to find a spot in the future than a forward
28 mars 2023 à 19 h 52
#19
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: juill. 2020
Messages: 16,176
Mentions "j'aime": 7,201
Quoting: notphilly4383
Jets lack leverage cause at the end of the day, Montreal is where Dubois wants to be, and Montreal wants Dubois. I can't see him agreeing to a contract with Winnipeg that has more than 1 year on it. And I get my trade isnt exactly like the Horvat trade but beauv>hoffman, Florida 1st > Isles 1st, and raty>kidney but Montreal has almost no reason to pay more than rental-like amount for dubois.


I don't see how the Jets lack leverage, when no one can force them to do anything. So, they actually do have leverage.

It's true that Montreal doesn't have to pay more, but it's also true that the Jets don't have to trade PLD to Montreal. So, the Jets just trade PLD elsewhere for a similar Horvat return and Montreal has to hope that PLD doesn't sign long term there or that they can outbid other teams if he gets to UFA.

Either way, Montreal has no impact on Winnipeg's decision.
28 mars 2023 à 20 h 3
#20
Banni
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: févr. 2022
Messages: 5,094
Mentions "j'aime": 2,375
Quoting: danielcoe
I WISH THAT WE COULD GIVE SO LITTLE probably no hoffman and add one of our young def but i would make that trade.. of course winnipeg fans think they are getting much more but winnipeg doesnt have any leverAGE.. tHEY CAN KEEP HIM ONE MORE YEar BUT THEN THEY RISK LOSING HIM FOR NOTHING and if they trade him at the deadline they will get a ist pick and not much more.... so winnipeg need to trade him at the draft and try to get a top pick and an nhl ready young player or two..... The prospects will hurt but it wont be hutson or farrell.. i think they will want to keep those guys but it could be harris or xjerex or barron who have to go...... So maybe the florida pick and harris and maybe they might want a center like dvorak and maybe even another pick


If they are giving the Florida pick then it won’t be much more. Definitely.
28 mars 2023 à 20 h 5
#21
Go Habs Go
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: mars 2017
Messages: 10,667
Mentions "j'aime": 4,092
The reasonable price, with the oft quoted Horvat comparable, is the Florida 1st, ONE of our top prospects outside the NHL, and a roster player of dubious quality (no pun intended).

The closest roster player comparables we have are Dvorak and Gurianov.

Beauvillier was not significant value, he was included for cap purposes. His production after the trade may raise his value after the fact.
Raty was one of their top prospects so that checks out.
The Islanders and Florida's 1sts are fairly close, but as of today the Florida pick is better.

You can swap Kidney and/or Hoffman to Winnipeg's preference, but the value is perfectly fine.
Definitely not adding our only (non-tradeable for non-hockey reasons) RHD in Mailloux, nor any other top 10 organizational prospect.
If that means we don't complete a trade for Dubois, great. We don't even know if we need him yet, and can make a more informed decision later.
Andy_Dick a aimé ceci.
28 mars 2023 à 20 h 5
#22
Banni
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: févr. 2022
Messages: 5,094
Mentions "j'aime": 2,375
Quoting: notphilly4383
What do you think Dubois is worth as a rental? Because quite honestly I think you overvalue the player a little bit. And you have to remember Winnipeg is kinda lacking in the leverage department in this situation



What he doesn’t understand is that NOT ALL 1st round picks are created equal. No, the Jets aren’t getting a top15 pick from a contender with PLD as a rental.

It’s single math. As a rental only contenders are buying which puts the pick outside the top20.

You’d think he’d understand such a simple subject but even for him this is dumb.
28 mars 2023 à 22 h 44
#23
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: juin 2018
Messages: 1,258
Mentions "j'aime": 283
Quoting: Howie
Yeah so Florida 1st kidney Mailloux and Dvorak is a deal that both can work with leaves barron for the Habs and jets get a little bit of everything


they will be lucky to get that much you know honestly the habs should just wait a year.
Andy_Dick a aimé ceci.
28 mars 2023 à 22 h 47
#24
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: juin 2018
Messages: 1,258
Mentions "j'aime": 283
Quoting: dgibb10
If he hits UFA his price shoots up. Dubois plan for years has been to hit UFA and maximize his earnings. Think 9 mill+ if he has another great season next year


true but of course then we just dont sign him as we have 4 good centers now and might get another in the draft... not a position of weakness any more..I like Dach so much i a unsure i would like dubois more
28 mars 2023 à 22 h 49
#25
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: juin 2018
Messages: 1,258
Mentions "j'aime": 283
Quoting: Koskinen_The_Great
What he doesn’t understand is that NOT ALL 1st round picks are created equal. No, the Jets aren’t getting a top15 pick from a contender with PLD as a rental.

It’s single math. As a rental only contenders are buying which puts the pick outside the top20.

You’d think he’d understand such a simple subject but even for him this is dumb.


That is it exactly at the deadline it is a 25-32 pick and our florida is sitting at 14 or 15 right now. That is a solid asset.....
 
Répondre
To create a post please Login or S'inscrire
Question:
Options:
Ajouter une option
Soumettre le sondage