If I was trolling, we’d be having a lot more fun.

Nelson has a career high of 59 pts. He’s having an awesome season this year, one where he almost certainly will crush his career highs. You can argue that he’s having a 1C caliber season. But on pretty much every team in the NHL (aside from the ones in the basement), he’s not going to be getting 1C minutes. Based on his entire career, he’s never been a 1C. 1Cs in the NHL are more productive. You can argue that he’s been subject to the era of the islanders that weren’t super offensively prolific and that suppressed his numbers and that’s a noteworthy conversation. But Barzal was above him on the depth chart during that era.

Would you like to comment on any of the other facts that are actually relevant to the trade being good or bad for either team or just keep on with the 'Nelson is a 1C' thing? Regardless of whether he is or isn't it's a BAD trade idea for Colorado for various reasons, none of which you've addressed, and in your fellow fanatic's case have completely ignored. Including ignoring the FACTS that you both like to keep talking about. Shouting repeatedly to the heavens 'he's a 1C' doesn't make the trade any more palatable for those reasons. I mean I can resort to the 'lies, damn lies, and then there's statistics' argument but it's kinda boring now. Nobody has said we think he sucks or anything, just that we don't consider him a 1C, and I don't need stats to do that. He's a good 2C. His stats back up that he's a decent player. Nobody has argued he isn't. Your opinion is he is a 1C. Mine and many others opinion is that he is not.

I think everyone's getting hung up on the extremely arbitrary "1C vs. 2C" argument here, so let's lay out some basic stuff:

Over his past 3 seasons (from 2019-20 through last year), Brock Nelson had 81 goals and 146 points in 196 GP, which averages out to about a 33-28-61 pace over 82 games. This season he's a hair under a PPG (57 points in 60 GP) while scoring goals at a 35 goal pace (26 scored to date).

Regardless of where you put him on your depth chart - he's scored at a 30-35 goal pace over the past 4 seasons, and in this ACGM Colorado would be getting him for 2 years at a $5M AAV. For some context, here are some centers currently on $5-6M AAV contracts

Mikael Granlund
JG Pageau
Ryan Strome
Charlie Coyle
Joel Eriksson Ek
Philip Danualt
Andrew Copp
Vincent Trocheck
William Karlsson

The only guy I think you could argue is providing better value on their deal is Eriksson Ek - and this is his first run where he's scored at more than a 45-50 point pace in his career. Bo Horvat just signed an $8.5M AAV extension based on a career very similar to Nelson's; hell, one of the reasons Colorado is looking for a 2C is because Nazem Kadri just signed for a $7M AAV after basically putting up Brock Nelson-style numbers with an extra helping of secondary assists goosing him up (even with what looks like an outlier season, Kadri's 3 year window from 2019-20 through last year averaged out to a 27-44-71 season in Colorado.)

Point is, getting a guy like Nelson at $5M would be a bargain. I don't think the Islanders would be trading him for a guy like Sam Girard if they moved him - nothing against Girard, but I don't think it's a stretch saying Nelson at $5M is more valuable than Girard at the same cost.

Agreed with you that the trade probably gets declined by the Islanders. Given his age, Nelson isn’t without risk. But generally agree with you. The 2C conversation is way more fun though.

To your point though: Kadri just signed a big contract. He’s a 2C. Eriksson Ek is playing top line minutes for Minnesota. He’s also not a 1C.

I agree with what youre saying but that also isnt considering that Girard has 5 more years or the third round pick too

Once again the only people really getting hung up on the idea of whether Nelson is or isn't a 1C are Isles fans. Personally I don't care all that much. Much as I don't really care about the Isles. I'm sat here chuckling. Even if he is a 1C it's still a bad trade for the Avs. As I said the trade may be bad for the Isles, it's also bad for the Avs and value isn't always the issue (as I have pointed out but that's been ignored because it isn't a statistic and I don't have a fancy graph to 'prove it'). The Avs have injuries to their back end and have had all season. Moving Sammy at this point for Nelson when there are other options to pursue would make this a BAD TRADE FOR THE AVS!

So you base the entire argument around Nelson being behind Barzal in the depth chart? He’s averaging more minutes than Barzal btw and by that logic there cannot be two 1C on one team at the same time lol. Then Malkin has always been a ”solid 2C” 😂

At the end of the day I agree with this - neither side would make this particular version of the deal. Both sides are plugging a not quite gaping hole (Colorado's need for a 2C, Isles need for a puck-moving LHD) by making a much larger hole somewhere else - the Isles' 2C if Nelson leave is uhhh...JG Pageau? And if Girard leaves, the Avs fill that depth chart spot with who, Andreas Englund? Brad Hunt? Yuck.

Yeah of course we are because you have stated multiple times in this thread that he IS a 2C, not a 1C and completely ignored all the FACTS, not opinions presented to you, that you’re wrong in thinking he’s only a 2C.

I don’t care for one second about the trade, just the weird opinions stating Nelson isn’t a 1C and refusing to acknowledge the facts about him being one.

Talk about cherry picking and a confirmation bias!

Wouldn’t you try to prove Isles fans wrong if we stated that Toews only was a 2nd-pair defenseman?

Well yes, and I'd argue it's worse for the Avs. At least you eventually get Barzal back and could run Barzal and Horvat at C. Pageau at 3C. It's only a temporary effect. The Avs are going to be scrambling with guys on minimum contracts as is. Next year will be likely be worse whatever way we look at it. How much for Hutton? The Avs seem to be good at taking former college Dmen from the Isles and making something of them!

You can prorate everything you want it doesn’t change the fact he is a .6ppg career scorer and isn’t a 1C. That’s not a knock him but there’s at least 32 centers in the league better than him. Again disingenuous with “they don’t care what position he plays” talking about Horvat, you don’t trade that package for winger or at least not for winger that’s considered a top 25 player in the league. Take heart we are disagreeing on semantics, we both think he is a good player you just think he’s something I don’t.

Not really I'd laugh at you as I am now.

The past 3 seasons Nelson has been a 1C. There is no arguing that , it’s a fact. Are you implying 37 goals isn’t 1C production?

The numbers don’t agree with your statement

Just curious how much money do you make per year?

The thing I just don’t get is, why you even bothered to argue as much as you have in this particular thread about him, just being a 2C, if you don’t care at all, that’s just troll-behaviour imo.

Well.....you're still arguing that it's a fact.

Nelson did score 37 goals last season, is that false?

Lmao what? Brock is that you?

37 goals for one of the worst, lowscoring teams in the league under Trotz and his no-offense system (playing with no star either).

The reason I continued was to see if either of you or Db1899 would address anything else like the actual trade and why it was bad for the Avs as well as the Isles but you chose to ignore all of that and just keep shouting 'Nelson is a 1C'.

Quote: 'I don’t care for one second about the trade'. So you came here not to post about a trade, not caring about the trade, or willing to address what was wrong with the trade. Just to argue Nelson was a 1C.

You just told me everything I need to know lol

What relevance has my income to the conversation? Besides the fact it's none of your Goddamned business.