Nope. Why do people think Matty is worth so much more than Kyrou? The Blues can't afford this anyway.

Probably because he's a significantly more impactful player

And this team is back to fringe playoff team again. Never making any noise if they make the playoffs, but not bad enough to get a top pick.

Hence the name “Lames”… to subtle I guess. But in Sutter we trust right.

Blues don't even entertain this offer. Kyrou is making 2.8 this year and fits so much better into our our cap structure than Tkatchuk at 9 million. Send him somewhere else because the blues won't trade for him. Why would we trade all those assets for Tkatchuk when we could have the chance to sign him the year after

Is he though? That much? He's also further along his development curve. Folks are trippin'.

They were drafted in the same year. As you said, chuky is further in his development curve. There's never a guarantee that Kyrou will get to where chuky already is.

They were drafted the same year, but Matty had a full NHL season before Kyrou even turned pro. And he had played like 275 NHL games before Kyrou was made into a regular. That's why he's ahead on the curve. But however one slices it (how they are not, how they will fare in the future), I'd love to hear an explanation for how Tkachuk is two 1st round picks more valuable than Kyrou. That's just silliness even before we get to the probability Matty tries UFA *next summer*.

They are from the same draft? How is he further along in development?

And yes he is significantly more impactful. Great on Kyrou for producing above expectation this year it's going to get him a nice pay raise next summer. But him and Tkachuk arent remotely on the same level.
Refer to here and the following graph

Let me just stop you right there. Using EV RAPM to explain a player's total impact is a lot like using MPG to explain a car's full value. The list of things it leaves out or offers without any context at all is longer than the day. This isn't proof of anything, my friend.

Lmao right so you completely ignore the link which provides a side by side comparison of a magnitude of things, that makes sense. What exactly is being left put in your opinion, what context is not being provided?

How about GAR? Tkachuk had a +23.8 ranking him 7th in the league and Kyrou had a +14.3 to rank him 58th league wide

A magnitude of things? Hahahaha what? That literally measures five on ice analytic stats. That's it. So not only is it woefully incomplete, exactly none of it is individual. And it ignores special teams entirely. So forget Kyrou being near the top of the league in zone entries. Or rush chances. No factoring in Matty's exorbitant number of giveaways. Etc etc etc.

So, no I don't think much at all of EV RAPM. Hell, I'd go to Dom's faulty model long before I went to RAPM. It's literally the last measure I'd ever use.

But you dont use any model or provide any proof of your own, thats the problem. If you did you would know things like Tkachuk is one of the best zone exit player in the league. You are like a flat earther arguing against scientific proof.

Oh stop. It's not even remotely like that. And I gave a detailed, reasonable explanation for why I don't pay attention to EV RAPM. Besides, I'm not the one suggesting that Matty is worth two 1st more than Kyrou. I'm not saddled with the burden proof for disagreeing with his claim or your claims made in answering my question. Believe what you want about the relative value, but let's not pretend you just round-earthed me.

I never said he was worth 2 1st more, this is not my thread. I stated he is worth a lot more because he is a significantly better player. Their paychecks in the next 2 years will emphasize that. In reality Kyrou is a similar caliber player to Mangiapane

Just because you don't like RAPM does not make it incorrect, just because you dont like GAR/WAR does not make it incorrect. You mentioned things like giveaways, Draisaitl and Huberdeau were also top of the league in that department. It's because they always have the puck. It's like +/- a pretty subpar stat

I didn't say EV RAPM was incorrect. I said it was woefully incomplete, rudimentary and vague from an individualstandpoint. Which it quite obviously is.

And their paychecks mostly emphasize that Matty has a much longer tenure. The issue isn't whether Matt was more valuable from ages 19-22. And frankly, their very different salaries and signing status also closes the value gap quite a bit. RAPM can't cover that. But then, there's worlds of stuff it doesn't cover.

Im not talking about their current contracts, im talking about next summer when Kyrou's current deal expires and he gets paid accordingly to what he provides. It will probably be in the 5M range. That is a reflection of his caliber.

Current contract status has an effect on trade value, no?

Not the point

Heh. Current trade value is definitely the point of this discussion. Or did you forget?

You are missing my point. I was saying that both of their next deals will reflect theor value and impact as a player.

Only to a degree. Still other factors at play.