i don't think the canes are trading necas

I'm not a Carolina fan but even I know there's a lot wrong with that trade. Pesce is so valuable, especially at that cap hit.

his value has decreased, the bigger asset to give up here is Necas.

Oh shoot, whats happened to Pesce. Thought he was a legit and responsible top-4 minute dman. I definitely thought Pesce's value would be higher than Necas'

2 controlled players and a 2nd for 1 year of Miller? Pass. Canes wouldnt give him close to the money he is asking either.

What I meant was he is not playing at the same level as he was a few years ago. He is also 27+ meanwhile Necas is only 23. I've always really loved Necas and wish NYR drafted him over Lias Andersson. Maybe I'm slightly biased but he has the potential to be a really dangerous player.

He's been a great top 4 dman for like 5 years. Does he have a nagging injury or something? What happened?

I mean its 1 year (possible extension) of a point-per-game, 1st line Centre/Winger, PP QB, and Pker for just over 2.5m. Loads of cap flexibility for CAR to load up

Im not saying Miller isnt good. I wanted the Canes to get him at the trade deadline. The Canes arent going to pay him anywhere close to the rumored money he is asking. Just like they wouldnt do it for Hamilton and soon to be Trocheck as well. Our only contracted RHD and Necas arent worth it for 1 year of Miller.

I didn't say he isn't good. I'm saying his value just isn't what it was a few years ago. Basically his performance has plateaued while his age has increased. Potential & age has a large impact on trade value.

Alright, I’ll bite. With the trade being proposed being Pesce Necas 1st for Miller half retained, it is already pretty unbalanced. Pesce is a legitimate top 4 minute eating RHD. Pesce is an excellent PK guy, is on an absolute steal of a deal, is RHD, can quarterback a PP unit if the need arises, and has term. Defensively he is amazing, and his offensive game isn’t bad either. Necas is a young speedy winger, while taking a step back offensively this year, has taken steps forward defensively. Very good on special teams, and is a great glue guy, and he still has room to improve.

Now moving onto the Vancouver side of the trade. Miller, who after this season will be under contract for 1 year, is having a career year with highs in everything. Very good on special teams, and with half retention, would be under contract for 1x about 2.6. At that cap hit, it is a bit of a steal. Miller, however, has only ever been above a PPG once before this season, in his first season with Vancouver, when it was a Covid shortened season. This year is the first year in his career that he has had production like this. Plus, this year Miller has been a top 10 player in the league in terms of offensive production.

That being said, the problem with Miller is that there is no guarantee that he will put up those same numbers in Carolina. He wants a very expensive contract at about 8.5mil on I believe an 8 year deal, but correct me if I am wrong. His inconsistencies throughout his career are a big red flag, and let’s just say that the Canes were to somehow have the cap space to give Miller the contract he wants. Almost certainly by year 3 or 4 the Canes will be regretting that extension. Much like the Gallagher and Kreider contract situations, a Miller contract like the one he wants would be unmovable when he starts to regress, because nobody wants a question mark to play for them.

1 year of Miller, since the Canes won’t be able to resign him, for multiple years of Pesce and potentially the rest of Necas’ career and a first round pick, makes zero sense for the Canes. If Miller was a top 10 player in the league throughout his career, Canes would be more likely to consider that, but since he was not, it would be extremely bad asset management to make this trade.

Not criticizing you for rejecting the trade, but maybe you could at least accept that Miller is a late bloomer and that he's now a capable 70-80 point player going into his thirties. No question that Miller would start on Carolina's second line if he joined the team, but who knows, maybe he manages to play his way onto the first line if he maintains his level of play

Interesting, I never considered that

No shot Carolina dose that

Miller isn’t exactly a late bloomer per se. It has just taken him until he was 29/30 to use his full potential. I would say there is a very big difference between the 2. Assuming he now becomes a perennial 70-80 point guy, Canes still can’t afford to give him the contract he wants. An extension to that thought, how long will it be before he starts regressing. I think he has peaked this year, but hypothetically, he gets this 8x8.5 contract, I think his regression starts year 1, but i don’t think the regression would have that big an impact until year 3 or 4. It’s all about risk vs. reward for the Canes, and that kind of contract taking Miller’s age and his point production over the course of his career, is a very high risk bringing quite a reward, but the question remains. How long before that reward turns into an anchor? This is precisely the reason why Hamilton is playing with the Devils right now. While the reward was high, the risk was higher, so the Canes didn’t sign him.

I can see the Canes trading for a year of Miller, but as I have said before, it won’t be that big a package, as Miller wouldn’t be resigned.

Yeah, that's fair, probably more reasonable to assume that a player is going to start to regress when he gets into his 30's. That's part of why guys such as Crosby, Ovechkin, and Pavelski are so special. It's going to be interesting how the market is for a guy like John Klingberg

There are always going to be those players who defy the laws of time. Crosby, Ovi, Pavelski, hell, Jagr is still playing and he is 50 or so. But those guys are so few and far between that unless you are one of those world beating talents like McDavid, it is very unlikely that a player doesn’t regress.

For Klingberg, he is a good offensive player, but the deal he is wanting, no contender will be giving to him. An 8 year deal would take him to age 38, and Klingberg isn’t that world beating talent since he has already started his regression. Add in that fact that he is a defensive liability, every team is already wary of him, but I don’t think he gets the deal he wants. Especially from a contender. I think if Klingberg wants to go to a contender he would have to drop either the term or the money, cause he won’t get both.

100%, I can't wait to see the headlines of how disappointed or frustrated Klingberg is with his market value