Horrible Buffalo trade

I love your first two (actual) trades. But I've said that before.

I like the Toronto and Rangers trades, too.

I thought not bad for Buffalo, although Kemper was good and bad in world championships. I take the trade.

Thoughts on the Pitt one? I think if they can get those top 2 deals done it’s an A+ off-season in my mind. I like the looks of the NYR trade I just don’t think it’ll happen and maybe it’s better to hold onto Crouse after a down (and very unlucky) year anyway

The duality of a fan base lol. Keumper would be a solid add if you guys want to be somewhat competitive next season. He’s a top 10 goalie when healthy

I think Minnesota ask for more
Also after a year in which Minnesota struggled badly in face-offs finishing like 29th place in face-offs , not sure I want nick for wild

Lol, I just think Risto has more value, alot of ppl agree with me and Kuemper is a rental for us he would leave after the first year

I don't know enough about Hayden, but it doesn't seem like enough in light of what Pittsburgh paid for Zucker (although admittedly that was another GM). That's why I specifically didn't comment on the trade in my earlier reply.

I think if Risto had more value he should have been traded already but here we are. Im fine with getting rid of Risto for pretty much anything.

That’s fair and probably true. Risto is so hard to gauge value for on here cause half the fans think he’s a decent defender and the other half want him fired into the sun. To be honest I haven’t seen him play all that much. Keumper is probably a better fit for a playoff type team though

I think if Minnesota’s options are to lose Dumba for nothing in expansion or to deal him for a guy that instantly goes in between Kaprizov and Zucc on your top line (as your roster is currently constructed) they have to take option B. I’ve heard mixed feelings about going 4-4 on protection and losing Greenway/Foligno but you guys also have Mennel and Addison coming up on RD so you’re dealing from a position of strength

That's a low awareness of how the world of hockey works post right there. Or how the sabres organization works.

Precisely the thinking of most of the Wild guys I've had similar discussions with on this subject. Not to be overlooked is one major side-effect of trading Dumba: now Minnesota goes 7-3-1 and gets to protect Greenway, Foligno and Hartman/Sturm.

Hayden is an in and out of the lineup 13th forward type. Nothing special. Like I said in the description I saw it on another AGM post, I think realistically it takes a bit more. I’d be willing to scrap the Crouse trade and include him instead of Hayden

I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again, this deal makes way too much sense for both teams for it to not happen in some way shape or form

Low awareness? Are you kidding me? The guy has been pretty abysmal his entire NHL career. His fancy stats are god awful. Any smart gm wouldnt touch him. The entire time he's been in a Sabres uniform the Sabres have been terrible. Yes, it's not all on him but he's part of the problem. Stop overvaluing him...like the Sabres organization.

this really is the thing here. Do they just want to move on. Zucker was on pace for 20 last season. 20 goal scorers have value. I don't know how else to put what they will do with him. Keep him, move him for something, or just let it go and use the cap elsewhere. Hard to say at this point. I think of anyone in the top 6, he's the most on the line.

I wasn't speaking about him having value but that the sabres overvalue him thats why he isn't traded yet, I think he's got more value than above.

Love Kuemper
But the Sabres are about to blow it up & rebuild again
So acquiring him doesn’t make much sense right now for us

It is really hard to predict what they will do with Zucker, but my guess is that they may roll the dice and leave him exposed and see what happens after the expansion draft. If he is taken, then Hextall is looking to move a $4M+ D man. If he is not taken then they will likely move him for whatever they can get for cap space. The only other forward options to be moved are Jake (not likely), Rust (not likely), McCann (too soon), Kappanen (would be really dumb), Tanev (also a dumb move)...it pretty much has to be Zucker going.

I think between McCann and Zucker, they are moving McCann every time. There is a lot more faith that Zucker will show up when games count than McCann, see the playoffs two years in a row. One guy has 4 goals the other 0. That disappearing act in McCann is the reality of why they would easily keep one over the other. I'm not saying they keep both, But I do think if Zucker is gone, McCann is surely gone.

Well...I can't agree with you on this for a couple of reasons. 1) The Cap is a thing and Zucker is about $3M more per than McCann. 2) The Pens like flexibility and a C/LW is more flexible than a LW/RW. 3) McCann has shown to have chemistry with Carter (Carter has another year, so he will be back) and Gaudreau, and with Geno. 4) Zucker has shown to have no chemistry with Sid or Geno. 5) Jake is stapled to Sid, so Sully will only play Zucker with Geno or on the third line. 6) We moved out a $5M+ 3rd liner last year, no need to keep another one this year.

I agree that Zucker should work and should be a great top 6 winger, but he has not worked with Sid (barely given a chance) or Geno (even when forced) and the Pens don't have the cap space for him.

See I think we view this differently.
As far as McCann, he's a no show. We can't say he has "great chemistry" and yet doesn't produce. Those are incompatible statements. He is a disappearing act on the ice, again you are looking at two years in the playoffs where he's no where to be found, and has prolonged stretches of nothing..
They are also very deep at center. You are outlining why here. Carter, Gaudreau, Blueger, Caulfield. all at C. I will mention Caulfield here because I think he makes his way over to the penguins sooner rather than later because he is the size and physicality they need and he's a really good player who was one of those unsung players on ND this year where other high pick OTT players got a lot of credit and he quietly got it done. Truth is, if they want to add size and speed, they know they can't find it around the league, but they are sitting on a few prospects who bring it. They need to trust their scouts and their youth.
They also have guys in angelo and lafferty. But there is really no need to go that deep. There are a lot of C on this team. They don't need to worry about the flexibility of this and I think they know that. As it stands if they bring back Gaudreau, this team is very solid down the middle. The fact that McCann isn't exactly strong on the dot, doesn't really help his care either.

I agree with your assessment there on Zucker. But he was on pace for 20 goals this year. Which I think people don't recognize. Given the injuries etc.. that's not bad.
But the largest issue between these two players and I think is the deciding factor is which one shows up when it's needed. We can say McCann is cheaper, plays center, and has decent production. But at the end of the day, in those games that are hard to win, he's never found. So when you ask yourself, how do we win, that becomes the easier choice.

My guess is they are both gone. I have made ACGM showing that. Zucker, McCann and the 3RW positions on this team are the clear needs for upgrade.
I think if you remove both Zucker and McCann you are opening up 8 million in cap. That the team can either do better with that 8 million in total cap, or let the youth play. As I am a big believer that holding Poulin back does not help the team. There is no sense in waiting till Malkin is 40 to play him. Especially if you have a 4th line, like the penguins do, that can much those hard minutes and help him grow on the 3rd line with less pressure and hopefully guys like Tanev and ZAR help him learn how to throw his size around. You add in that his cap hit is far less, than either. It makes sense.
I am a believe of two things on this team. Getting younger, and bigger. With 2 prospects capable of coming in, and playing, I think this team needs to really consider what it's doing and how it's doing it.
I'm ok with moving both Zucker and McCann and bringing in a really good player with that cap to play on the 2LW. I'm also ok with bringing in Caulfield and Poulin to play bottom 6 roles to be the size they need with speed.
Our 3rd line doesn't have to hold up the whole world. The 4th line can munch minutes, help those guys grow in their first year, and they have the size and strength to play. If you add a very good player to the top 6 and let the top 2 lines do their thing, the 4th line do it, and keep the defense solid while maybe adding a little size, I think you build a team capable come playoffs to stomp around in the mud a little.

That's a lot more words than you needed to put on paper. You seem to think Zucker is a playoff performer...unfortunately the Pens have not gone deep enough to prove that he is or isn't. But we have some regular season numbers to go off of and they are very telling. I am only going off of this year because...recent bias...but mainly cause I'm lazy

McCann - 0.325 g/gm, 0.419 a/gm, 0.744 pts/gm and a +17
Zucker - 0.237 g/gm, 0.237 a/gm, 0.474 pts/gm and a -8

So only looking at offensive stats McCann is the better choice. But let's not forget that this is a Cap league and money matters.

Zucker costs $305556/pt
McCann costs $91875/pt

So yeah, McCann has not produced in the playoffs but unlike Zucker McCann played on the 3rd line with Marleau and Horny (not a good mix at all) and then on the 3rd line with Carter and Gaudreau (he should have got a few, but if given more than 6 games, might have)

Whereas Zucker has basically been stapled to Geno.

It's not too hard to figure out where the most value for the money is.

It's really easy to try to break it down in some regular season numbers, but the regular season doesn't really mean much. You could take the same numbers, and break the money down per point/goal in the playoffs. And you would get the exact opposite effect. Which is why such math doesn't mean anything.

Lets be clear on this. I'm not advocating for either. In my own opinion they should both go.
But this idea that Zucker is the one out the door while McCann is more productive is just half baked. One is noticeable on the ice. The other is not.
I will also note that Horny toad isn't a "bad" linemate as it was not stated but suggest here. You could make the argument that is underperformance here was partly the result of a disappearing act of any help of his linemates. That is only a chicken before the egg argument being proposed to suggest McCann's play was due to Horny.
What we can say, is two years in a row, when games matter, he's not to be found. The long stretches of inconsistency as a player are very troubling. We can say whatever about Zucker but he's not going to pull a Houdini on the team.