mantha is below average top 6 wing who needed 4 years of development to get a reasonable level to play in nhl. sadly he would still be 2nd best on sabers RW depth chart.

i get detroit fans want something to cheer for (been a sabers fan for years i know the pain) and you are happy to see him finally up and playing for the team. but he really just is not a top tier player in the league and wont be. this is a depth move that helps out both teams. the only reason i have mantha on 1st line is sabers GM said he wants to give reinhart his own line to drive play from the wing.

i think you are lost in past +- is a joke stat now, 5m$ is 2nd unit money. tho a 24 year old d man just starting in the nhl is still pretty common but you would be hard pressed to find a young d in league known for being stud defensively you get that with time. tho really risto would still be best D man on wings roster. as new GM steve y noticed D depth sucks and had to take a huge jump in draft to get a guy who is strikingly similar to risto so may want to think a bit more about it.

And Risto is a top tier player?

If you need different numbers, how about a 47.8% Corsi on a just shy of 47% ozone start, with a -3 relative Corsi. His best year was last year with a 1 relative Corsi on slightly shelter minutes (53% ozone start). He was on the ice for over HALF of all the goals scored on BUF last year, playing with 3 different sets of partners (since the partners changed, but the results remained the same, the constant is the problem).

If he was really that good, BUF wouldn’t be trying to pawn him off, and if he was really that good, teams would be jumping at him. Since BUF Is trying to move him, and can’t find takers, that should tell BUF fans that he isn’t worth much.

Also, Hronek > Risto, all day and twice on Sunday. He’d kill anyone for Hronek’s half season numbers.

53% is not sheltered by any stretch buddy. the reason he is being shopped is he supposedly requested it. but you all obviously dont watch the sabers if you think he is liability. the defensive systems have been **** for years now and he has been encouraged to join the rush and play physical because he is a beast of a person. in the end i am happy if they keep him too but if he goes it better be for a top 6 RW or 2nd line C.
corsia has him at 33rd best RD btw
tho i was shocked to see how high Mantha was ranked as i only looked at his career stats before this. seems he played really well down the stretch for DET. still only a top 6 guy in my mind but if he tops 65 points next couple seasons i will change my mind.

Then why do you want to trade him, keep him if he is so valuable

He’s put up back to back 25 goal seasons on a terrible Red Wings team. He’s a legit top 6 winger.

No, he doesnt

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php?pid=136790

I mean, thanks for providing a link proving you are wrong

24 goals is literally one away from 25. You are just salty because you don’t think Mantha is anything special, when he is special. At the very least he has more value than Ristolainen at the moment, plus he’d very easily be a top 6 Forward on your overrated Sabres team. He’s miles better than Sheary.

No one thinks buffalo is overrated. We know we suck until proven otherwise.

You were still wrong

Rasmus Ristolainen is Justin Schultz level bad from when he was in Edmonton.

I agree that Yzerman will not trade Mantha for Ristolainen.
But the notion that Ristolainen is Alzner on steroids is unjustified.
These are the defensemen who have more pts than Ristolainen over the last 4 years and the age that they first reached 40 pts:
Brent Burns 23
Erik Karlsson 21
Victor Hedman 24
Roman Josi 25
John Klingberg 23
John Carlson 25
Kristopher Letang 24
Mark Giordano 28
Torey Krug 23
Keith Yandle 24
Tyson Barrie 24
Drew Doughty 21
Ryan Suter 24
Shayne Gostisbehere 25
Morgan Rielly 24
Dustin Byfuglien 26
P.K. Subban 25
Oliver Ekman-Larsson 23
Alex Pietrangelo 21
Dougie Hamilton 23
Seth Jones 24
Here are 2 more recent 40 pt defensemen and their age when they reached 40:
Erik Gustafsson 27
John Carlson 25
Ristolainen is 24 year old and already has four 40 pt seasons, the first before any of the players above, he was pushed into playing 24 minutes a night hoping he would figure out how to play defense on a very bad team with very bad on ice leadership.
I hope he is not traded, the team will be better with him. I hope his role is reduced, with Montour and Miller he should be limited to 20 minutes a game, 3 or more on the PP and none on the PK. IMO his +/- will be reduced and his pts will go up.
Last year only McCabe had fewer OZ starts than Ristolainen, for the first 3 years as a Sabre, he was the ONLY NHL quality defensemen, so obviously his stats would look bad.
So let's agree, DET and BUF do not make a trade.








You know the Wings better than I, I seem to remember Bowman would play Fedorov on defense, so maybe AA would be a good idea.

LOL, the Wings defense is that bad?

I mean Detroit is my 2nd team and imo yes. Cholowski Hronek Seider and Kaski look good for the future though. First two should be full-time NHL