When getting called up is a negative lol

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Créé par: Blazingbat11

Équipe: 2023-24 Canadiens de Montréal

Date de création initiale: 9 avr. 2024

Publié: 9 avr. 2024

Mode - plafond salarial: Basique

Description

I was always hesitant to believe Barron was actually on the market. Us Habs fans can speculate with the depth chart who is over who, where Barron fits in the prospect pool, etc. But his most recent call-up really convinced me that Barron is all but gone this offseason.

But usually getting called up is a positive, right? Not in this case. A priority at the moment for the Habs organization is to get the AHL Laval Rocket into the playoffs, so their prospects can play meaningful games. It's the reason MTL opted to send back Gignac to Laval and waiver claim Colin White (Gignac is way better than White). Gignac is the leading scorer for Laval and is needed in the AHL far more than with the playoff eliminated Habs.
Now, because of injuries to Guhle and Xhekaj, Habs need to make a call-up. If they were to go off of merit, there's really no debate that Mailloux has earned a chance in the NHL, kid has been great in his 1st pro season. You can even argue Reinbacher, in his limited number of games with Laval, has earned a call-up since he's already proven to be the most defensively reliable Dman on that team.

But no, it's Barron who's called up... why? Because he's the one who would hurt Laval THE LEAST in trying to make the playoffs!.... ouff that one stings lol MTL could've even called up Trudeau instead if they believed Barron could better help Laval over him, but nope!

Some people have said that this is another shot (or his last chance) to prove himself in the NHL to Habs management, and that he belongs. I disagree. Hughes and Gorton don't need a handful of meaningless NHL games at the end of the season to know if they want to keep Barron or not. That decision has been made by now. If they were fully committed to Barron's development, he would've stayed in Laval (see Mailloux as the perfect example, fully deserving of a call-up but is better served with Laval for his development).

So with the high chance of Barron being moved this offseason, what's the best- and worst-case scenarios for a return? Best case is a Nils Lundkvist type trade, Where NYR essentially got back their draft capital in a late 1st rd pick for him. Or MTL is able to package Barron with other picks and prospect and try to land a big fish on the trade market. Worst case is there's no market for Barron (highly unlikely) and MTL sell him for pennies on the dollar.
I don't see MTL keeping him if he's truly on the market, because if they don't see him making their NHL roster next season over other guys they currently have (or might add in the offseason), Barron is almost guaranteed to be claimed on waivers.

Transactions

MTL

Choix de 1e ronde en 2024 (DAL)

DAL

Barron, Justin

Détails additionnels:

Best case scenario.

Doesn't have to be DAL, just using the Nils Lundkvist example of a late 1st rd pick.

Rachats de contrats

Karl Alzner: 833 333 $

Transactions impliquant une retenue de salaire

Joel Edmundson: 1 750 000 $ (50%)
Jeff Petry: 2 343 750 $ (50%)
Jake Allen: 1 925 000 $ (50%)

Repêchage	1e ronde	2e ronde	3e ronde	4e ronde	5e ronde	6e ronde	7e ronde
2024
2025
2026

FORMATION

VUE À LONG TERME

INTÉGRÉ

TEXTE INTÉGRÉ

TAILLE DE LA FORMATION	PLAFOND SALARIAL	CAP HIT	EXCÉDENTS	BONIS	ESPACE SOUS LE PLAFOND SALARIAL
22	83 500 000 $	74 975 416 $	1 170 000 $	3 977 500 $	8 524 584 $

Ailier gauche	Centre	Ailier droit
Caufield, Cole 7 850 000 $7 850 000 $ AG, AD UFA - 8	Suzuki, Nick 7 875 000 $7 875 000 $ C UFA - 7	Slafkovsky, Juraj 950 000 $950 000 $ (3 500 000 $$4M) AD, AG RFA - 2
Gallagher, Brendan 6 500 000 $6 500 000 $ AD, AG M-NTC, NMC UFA - 4	Newhook, Alex 2 900 000 $2 900 000 $ C, AG RFA - 4	Armia, Joel 3 400 000 $3 400 000 $ AD, AG UFA - 2
Harvey-Pinard, Rafaël 1 100 000 $1 100 000 $ AG, AD RFA - 2	Evans, Jake 1 700 000 $1 700 000 $ C UFA - 2	Anderson, Josh 5 500 000 $5 500 000 $ AD, AG M-NTC UFA - 4
Pezzetta, Michael 812 500 $812 500 $ AG, AD UFA - 2	Dvorak, Christian 4 450 000 $4 450 000 $ C M-NTC UFA - 2	Ylönen, Jesse 775 000 $775 000 $ AD, AG RFA - 1

Défenseur gaucher	Défenseur droitier	Gardien de but
Matheson, Michael 4 875 000 $4 875 000 $ DG M-NTC UFA - 3	Guhle, Kaiden 863 333 $863 333 $ (420 000 $$420K) DG/DD RFA - 2	Montembeault, Samuel 1 000 000 $1 000 000 $ G UFA - 1
Struble, Jayden 867 500 $867 500 $ (57 500 $$58K) DG RFA - 2	Savard, David 3 500 000 $3 500 000 $ DD UFA - 2	Primeau, Cayden 890 000 $890 000 $ G RFA - 2
Harris, Jordan 1 400 000 $1 400 000 $ DG/DD RFA - 2	Kovacevic, Johnathan 766 667 $766 667 $ DD UFA - 2

Laissés de côté	Liste des blessés (IR)	Liste des blessés à long terme (LTIR)
Pearson, Tanner 3 250 000 $3 250 000 $ AG UFA - 1	Dach, Kirby 3 362 500 $3 362 500 $ C, AD RFA - 3	Price, Carey 10 500 000 $10 500 000 $ G NMC UFA - 3
White, Colin 775 000 $775 000 $ C, AD UFA - 1	Xhekaj, Arber 828 333 $828 333 $ DG/DD RFA - 1
	Wideman, Chris 762 500 $762 500 $ DD UFA - 1

9 avr. à 13 h 42

Blasphem_Guy

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Rejoint: juill. 2019

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I think your assesment of the situation is spot-on. With the emergence of Struble, I thought Harris was also maybe on his way out.
I doubt any team will trade a 1st for Barron, so I would much prefer a 1v1 trade for a similar developped forward rather than a 2nd + something.

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9 avr. à 14 h 20

Blazingbat11

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Quoting: Blasphem_Guy

I think the Nils Lundkvist comparison is a good example though. It just takes one team to believe in Barron's offensive potential (which is clearly a top4 offensive Dman). And with Barron playing a valuable position in RD, I don't think it's unrealistic that someone could bite.

9 avr. à 15 h 8

GiggywithGibby

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Rejoint: juin 2022

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Quoting: Blazingbat11

Nils lundavist was traded at 21, Barron is coming up on 23 and hasn't cemented a spot on an NHL roster, he is what he will be, any remaining upside is minimal.

9 avr. à 15 h 9

Ledge_And_Dairy

Rejoint: juin 2019

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Quoting: Blazingbat11

Lundkvist was still waiver exempt his first season in Dallas. Barron looses exemption at the end of this season. I highly doubt anyone gives up anywhere close to that much for him when he's this close to being free

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9 avr. à 15 h 41

Blazingbat11

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Quoting: Ledge_And_Dairy

That's a good point that would definitely impact his value. But 100% MTL won't let it get to the point where they lose him via waivers, so he won't be free.

Habs just went 3/4 of this season with 3 goalies because they refused to risk losing Primeau via waivers. If push comes to shove, MTL would keep Barron as an 8th Dman on the roster. Kent Hughes has pretty much established his reputation with regards to trades: He sets a price, and will wait for as long as needed until he gets it (See Jake Allen miraculously getting a conditional 3rd that can become a 2nd)

Now what price tag Hughes will put on Barron is definitely up for debate.

9 avr. à 15 h 48

Ledge_And_Dairy

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Quoting: Blazingbat11

There is a massive difference between loosing your future starter to waivers and loosing a 3rd pair defenseman to waivers. There is no world where they will value Barron as high as they did Primeau

9 avr. à 16 h 6

Blazingbat11

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Quoting: Ledge_And_Dairy

There is a massive difference between loosing your future starter to waivers and loosing a 3rd pair defenseman to waivers. There is no world where they will value Barron as high as they did Primeau

....... Not sure if you're just being ridiculous to not deviate from your argument, or just ignorant to Habs players (probably the latter). But I don't think anyone, including Habs management, see Primeau as a future starter. Heck, most don't even see him being more than just decent backup.

As for Barron, I've said this before, just because Reinbacher and Mailloux have surpassed him, doesn't mean he has magically become worthless. It's not MTL's fault they have one of the deepest defense prospect pools in the NHL. Put Barron in the Islanders, Bruins, Lightning, Penguins, etc. prospect pools, and he's easily their best or 2nd best prospect...
Barron has proven offensively he is a top 4 NHL dman, but definitely still has defensive issues, which is where the Nils Lundkvist comparisons come in. But, as you mentioned, Barron losing his waivers exemption (where Lundkvist still had 1 year left) will have an impact on his value.

9 avr. à 16 h 32

Ledge_And_Dairy

Rejoint: juin 2019

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Quoting: Blazingbat11

....... Not sure if you're just being ridiculous to not deviate from your argument, or just ignorant to Habs players (probably the latter). But I don't think anyone, including Habs management, see Primeau as a future starter. Heck, most don't even see him being more than just decent backup. If you are thinking about guys like Dobes or Volokhin you are thinking way too far I to the future. I doubt Montreal is waiting until 2028 to start competing

As for Barron, I've said this before, just because Reinbacher and Mailloux have surpassed him, doesn't mean he has magically become worthless. It's not MTL's fault they have one of the deepest defense prospect pools in the NHL. Put Barron in the Islanders, Bruins, Lightning, Penguins, etc. prospect pools, and he's easily their best or 2nd best prospect...
Barron has proven offensively he is a top 4 NHL dman, but definitely still has defensive issues, which is where the Nils Lundkvist comparisons come in. But, as you mentioned, Barron losing his waivers exemption (where Lundkvist still had 1 year left) will have an impact on his value.

Montreal felt that their tandem moving forward after this season would be Monty and Primeau. That's why neither was placed on waivers. Primeau will either win the starter role or they will run them as a 1A and 1B. Regardless they valued keeping him highly.

As for Barron. It's not that the other defensemen have made him redundant it's that he is struggling to make the NHL and is no longer waiver exempt. It's a significant loss in trade value once you loose exemption. Whether he would be a good prospect elsewhere is irrelevant because those teams can't place him in the minors to develop either.

There are countless examples of good potential prospects being lost to waivers, off the top of my head Tolvanen, Valimaki, and Bjornfot come to mind. All with various levels of post waiver success

9 avr. à 17 h 50

Blazingbat11

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Quoting: Ledge_And_Dairy

You're saying these things thinking their true like you follow the Habs, but you couldn't be further from the truth. It just looks like you're trying to guess and deduce the Habs motives based on the moves they're doing, and coming up with the wrong answer lol

MTL wanted to send Primeau to Laval because they were comfortable with Montembeault and Allen as there tandem (which is why they only had Dobes as their only signed AHL/NHL goalie and had to recall ECHL G Mann. It wasn't until Montembeault's extension and the Habs intentions to trade Allen that Laval went out and signed Kaskisuo) ... They kept Primeau because management were sure he'd be claimed through waivers and didn't want to lose him for nothing. They moved Allen because he had the most value over Primeau... I think it really didn't bother them who was backing up Montembeault at the end of the day.

Barron would have been in the Habs lineup pretty much all season if it weren't for his current waiver's exemption. Habs have plenty of players with various struggles playing on the team, so it isn't "just' because Barron was struggling defensively that he was sent down. He was preferred over guys like Harris and Kovacevic (but they would've required waivers) and Xhekaj and Struble proved to be more defensively consistent. So he ended up being the odd man out due to the logjam and others not being waivers exempt...
I think MTL would've been completely fine with Barron learning on the spot with the Habs, but Hughes is very much an asset management guy and didn't want to lose a Kovacevic or Harris for nothing either. And many Habs fans would approve of this. The "unfortunate" situation is Barron is eclipsed by better prospects in Laval now (which is actually a good thing for MTL, if both Mailloux and Reinbacher hit, it'll be to the benefit of MTL). So, this is definitely a case of him being a redundant prospect... you have no clue what you're talking about.

9 avr. à 18 h 14

#10

Ledge_And_Dairy

Rejoint: juin 2019

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Quoting: Blazingbat11

Let me clarify. While it may be true that Montreal initially intended to send Primeau down but were afraid to lose him on waivers, I think that view changed as the season went on. Primeau was given quite a few chances and proved he was worth at least keeping around. Then there was the high demand in goalies + the Monty extension making it clear Allen was probably not part of the future in Montreal.

I disagree on your take on Barron vs Kovacevich. Barron is a defenseman that due to his size pretty much needs to pan out as a top 4 guy to succeed Kovacevich being a big bodied defender is someone much more suited for a 3rd pairing role. Right now with post call-up Kovacevich is listed as 2nd pair and Barron on the 3rd. We will see how the ice time pans out for them over the next few games

9 avr. à 18 h 22

#11

Blazingbat11

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Quoting: Ledge_And_Dairy

*facepalm* ok now, the gig is up. Barron is 6”2 200lbs… “due to his size pretty much needs to pan out as a top 4 guy to succeed “… really!? Barron has every capability to be a physical dman, that’s just not his game, he’s an offensive dman.

Just stop.

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