engvall is more likely to be yeeted into the void than holl if robertson is nhl ready

Something about Muzzin on the first pair and Malgin on the second line doesn't exactly scream "Contender" to me.

That cup contending lineup is over the cap, and is virtually the same as the last cup contending lineup that couldn’t get out of the first….except with much worse goaltending.

Not the year for me tbh - maybe when JT contract is up

yeah, it's not like the leafs had sub 800 goaltending for the back half of the season and then again in the playoffs against the back to back champs that they took to 7 games. my stars!

No contender has Malgin in their top 6

What was the excuse the year before? Or the year before that? Or the year before that? Or the year before that?

nah, they've had lots of different excuses, but we were talking about last year so that's the one i was talking about. I figured since you were talking about last season, and how apparently the leafs are the same team but with worse goaltending, we'd discuss that. But i guess the entire point was for you to take lazy shots at the leafs without having to put thought into it, right?

Do you legitimately think that Murray is better than Campbell, or Andersen?

do you legitimately believe that the leafs goaltending is 'so much worse' that they are gonna go half a season with 800 goaltending again?

I think their goaltending is worse.
Campbell was a .914 goalie last year
He was a .921 goalie the year prior

Murray, when he can stay healthy which is rare was a .906 last year, a .893 the year prior, and a .899 the year before that.

And just watch the two. It’s worse.

campbell was a 914 goalie on average because he had a great start, then he was one of the worst goalies in the league the 2nd half and Mrazek was mrazek. The leafs still went 26-11-6 over that back half despite having a shooter tutor in net. The entire point is that the leafs can probably replicate a mid average of that easily as long as their goalies stay healthy. You're also ignoring that Samsonov, even if he's what he was last year, is a massive upgrade over what mrazek brought.
also, for funsies, High danger save percentage, which takes the team defence out of the equation even more had Murray at a 712, campbell at a 687 (same as Samsonov) and Mrazek at 595
and the goals saved above expected campbell at a -2.3 and Murray at a 3.2.
Murray probably isnt going to be great, but he has a pretty darn good shot of providing the leafs with similar goaltending over the whole season that campbell gave them if he can stay healthy

Right, i think its reasonable to think the leafs will be roughly the same thing they’ve been the past 3 years or so.

Same result likely.

yeah, a one goal game 7 against the defending cup champs and top 2 team in the league is a terrible place to be

Again, if that’s a one-off, sure.
But what was the excuse against columbus and montreal?

columbus? they blew it in a weird covid mutant season play in. Montreal their best goal scorer had his wrist at 10% strength, Tavares got knocked out 20 seconds into game 1 and mitch marner forgot how to play hockey while Danault showed why he deserved that Kings contract and Price went ballistic (the Leafs absolutely decimated the habs in every single offensive and defensive metric) and both Dermott and Galchenyuk fed the habs gimmies.

This is fun. What about the year before that? Was that boston? Year before was boston too right? Then Washington i want to say. What were the excuses for those three series?

the years before that they were just out of a rebuild facing one of the best teams in the league, i dont think losing to them in 6 and 7 games requires excuses. But hey, there ya go.

So just to be clear, you see six consecutive first round exits, no improvements (probable downgrade in net), and your take away is - they’re fun, just bad luck in the past?

no, i see 6 first round exits that all happened for various reasons and dont load up the current team with the burden of something that happened years before simply because someone online likes to use the X years lol leafs chirp.
The entire point of my argument here was real simple, that your insinuation that the goaltending this year is unquestionably worse than last years by default, is incorrect and ive proven that. Then you started talking about other first rounds and whatever.
So, if you want my opinion on the leafs chances this year as a whole, just ask for it it dont try to package this with the point you got corrected on so you can try and eek out a win or whatever.
SO, here it is, do the leafs, a 115 point team that didnt really get better or worse have a better shot at making it out of the 1st round this year? Yeah, they do because everyone else in the conversation got worse too, their offence is still lethal as anyones and their defence is still quite good. Goaltending could let them down but they battled through that pretty good last year and if Murray is healthy it gives them as good a shot as anything that was available to them on the market does

Remind me how you’ve proven the goaltending isn’t worse?

Also tell me how you can prove something subjective. That should be fun.

did you not read the whole bunch of information i provided you where it shows that Murray and Samsonov had better numbers than the leafs previous tandem or did you get stuck on raw save %?

Right, how is that proof?
I could give you save percentage.
There’s the whole thing of Ottawa happily dumping him, and paying to do so while still retaining salary….while Campbell was sought after in the UFA market and signed a pretty big deal. So apparently NHL GMs disagree with your assertion.

So why is what you said proof and what i said wasn’t?

well ill tell you what, you give me 100% proof that its worse and ill give you 100% proof that it's better. the numbers i provided show that the leafs should expect, at least similar goaltending to what they achieved last season and probably better if Murray can stay healthy.
I love the appeal to athourity here to try and dodge the stats though, nice try. I mean, Ottawa of all teams totally knows how to win, and Edmonton has absolutly nailed their goaltending choices the past 20 years eh?

So do you wanna actually discuss this or are you trying to piss up a wall and see if you can get higher than me?

Bahahaha this is really funny.

I never said i could prove anything. I actually said the exact opposite, because…duh.
You’re telling me I’m ignoring stats when you’re saying a guy that’s been sub .900 over the last three years is an upgrade?

One thing is very clear though - you are very good at lying to yourself.