pinto and a 2nd for the avs

Tkachuk doesn't work and neither does that Avs trade. Try Pinto and a 2nd

I know some of my fellow ACGM's will disagree but that seems like a pretty fair trade for Girard, tbh.

That's also good but I do like the idea of getting back more young D prospects to replace what was lost last season in trades.

For a top-4 defenseman signed to a team-friendly deal for the next five years, I want more than just a half-decent prospect, a 2nd, and Joseph. To deal Girard, it's going to take a trade like Pinto and a 2nd to get it done. Plus, we still have Behrens in the pipeline and our D core is locked up for the next few years.

Why do you even want Pinto? The whole point of trading Girard is to sign Kadri long term, and you already have Newhook as well. Could probably swap out JBD for Jarventie if you really want another forward.

Quality over quantity. Newhook has given us glimpses of top-6 potential, but needs to show consistency. Pinto would give us another cost-controlled young player capable of playing in the middle-six and jumping into the top-6 if injuries warrant it, which as we saw in the playoffs, is invaluable.

girard has nothing to do with kadri. moving girard doesnt make kadri affordable

Girard has everything to do with Kadri. The Avs are 3.9mil from the cap right now with a 21-man roster (one forward short though). They’ve got more than enough room to sign 2 forwards (a #12/#13). The only reason to move Girard would be to bring back Kadri at like 6-7mil for that 2C job (and then still have ~1.9mil for 2 more spares to run a 23-man roster if it’s 7mil).
I mean it’s mostly a moot point because Pinto’s not on the table regardless, but with Kadri, Compher, and Newhook plus excellent strength on the wings, I really don’t think the Avs would be struggling if they had an injury up the middle. Or even two injuries lol. Like, they’re better set up than literally every other team already lol, getting Pinto would just be overkill, and you’d only stall his or Newhook’s development in all likelihood, which doesn’t seem like great asset management.

Kadri's no guarantee this year and who knows if Compher sticks around next year? Never a bad thing to have center depth. Moreover, Newhook played wing several times with Compher at the C, so I don't think it'd hurt his development all that much. If I'm MacFarland, I'm not going to trade Girard for anything less than a sure thing as far as futures go or I'm looking for a hockey trade (1 for 1). A guy like Lindholm from Calgary would make all the sense in the world IMO

Girard’s value is not close to Lindholm’s, come on now

now do the next seasons roster and you'll see why it doesnt work. moving girard only make it work for 1 year then the avs are too deep in call hell. kadri doesnt work

Lol. I love hearing this. A guy whose had a couple of highly productive seasons who sits primarily down near 50 points a season for a top-4 norris caliber defenseman signed to a team-friendly deal for five years. Should I point you to the Ryan Johansen deal, or the Taylor Hall deal?

Doesn’t mean that’s not the plan lol. Next year’s cap situation is next year’s problem, but all the rumours are saying that they’re trying to bring back Kadri. If the plan was just to trade Girard for cap room in 23-24 and beyond, why would the Avs trade him right now? It would be much better to run the best defense corps in the league with Girard on the 3rd pair if necessary for this year and then trade him next summer if the plan isn’t to immediately use the cap space created.

avs could trade him now just because the return is too good to pass up. girard is not a need but a luxury. why couldn't the avs use the cap on short term players?

…are you insane? Lindholm was a 40-50 point guy when he broke into the league as a 3rd line winger in Carolina. Since coming to Calgary he’s been a 1st liner who can at minimum be around the 30 goal and 70 point mark, and is coming off of a 40-goal, point per game, Selke-calibre 1C season, now that he’s in his prime. Girard’s not even in the fringe Norris conversation, he’s barely in the conversation for 3rd best defenseman on his team (Byram seems to have stepped up big time), and would likely be the 3rd best defenseman on Ottawa within a couple years too (as Sanderson establishes himself). He regressed hard last season. He’s a solid 2-way, offensively inclined #3 D. And if you’re talking about contracts, Lindholm’s is arguably the best deal in the league at this point. According to Dom’s model he outperformed it by 7.7mil last year lmao. I don’t know why your opinion on Lindholm is stuck 4-5 years in the past and your opinion on Girard is focussed solely on the only year of his career where he was even on pace to crack 40 points but you should knock that off, it’s 2022 now and it’s past time you reevaluated these players.

Because there’s nobody left on the market except Kadri and Klingberg and a handful of bottom six guys. And nobody good ever takes a 1-year deal in UFA if they can help it except (inexplicably) Taylor Hall.

they dont need a super star. stastny plus some depth scoring would be great for the avs

I mean they can get the depth scoring with the 3.9mil they currently have. Should be enough for Milano+Rodrigues or something. If you’re trading Girard to have the cap to sign a guy to a 1-year deal, that guy should probably be better than Girard in a depth role. I would rather have Girard at 3LD than Stastny for this season personally.

One could say you're doing the same thing with Lindholm's season this year. He's had two seasons north of 55 points. As for making the argument that Girard is the #3D on his own team? Yeah, that's what happens when you have two of the best defensemen in the league on your team. He'd be top-2 on a majority of teams in the league. And as for contracts, I never said that Lindholm's wasn't absurdly valuable, but arguing that Girard (who makes $1m more than Gudbranson now) isn't also among the best contracts in the league is hog wash.

Are they equal in value? How the hell am I supposed to know? That's in the eyes of the GMs, not us plebs sitting on a couch in the basement. We've seen weirder trades and top-4 defenseman are valued higher than forwards. That's just a fact.

depends on the return. id rather have pinto + 1st , 2nd and sign stastny and rodrigues than have girard. besides the avs have 3m not 4m with a full rosters

2nd pair defensemen that are small and shoot left are not valued higher than first line centres that are elite at both ends of the ice. Using rate stats is dumb at the best of times, but especially when 2 seasons were shortened by covid. I could say Girard’s career high is 34 points. What I’ll say instead is that over the past four seasons, Lindholm averages 33 goals and 74 points per 82 games, on top of his elite defensive play, so last season, while it was his career best, is not really much of an anomaly because he’s been good for years and is now in his prime. And I never said Girard’s contract wasn’t good, but it’s not a massive steal. He outperformed it by 700k last year, so he was good but not great. Lindholm’s, as I pointed out, is one of the best value contracts in the league.

I was considering the 3.9mil to sign 2 forwards (i.e. Milano+ERod but that’s just an example) to bring them to a 23-man roster with 13 forwards and 8 D. But yeah Pinto won’t be on the table at all because Ottawa isn’t trading him, and while I like him a lot, I don’t think Girard is worth Pinto + 2nd even objectively.

Fair enough. Again, not arguing that Lindholm isn't a great player here, just saying that he's the type of player I'd be targeting in a Girard trade. If it's futures, then it better be some solid pieces. In my own opinion, I think that Girard is consistently underrated among defensemen, yet everyone seems to want him for peanuts. Hopefully that helps you understand where myself and other Avs fans are coming from.

Yeah I’d agree that he’s underrated, but I think that’s because Byram seems to be better than him now, so people see Girard get pushed down to the 3rd pair and value him as a 3rd pair guy, which isn’t fair. I’m not sold that he’s a true first pair guy either though, despite an amazing 20-21, because he regressed significantly this year (especially defensively, but he also put up fewer points in 67 games last year than he did the year before in 48 games). I do understand that some of that was playing with Jack Johnson though, so I think calling him a good #3 on a solid contract is fair.