Lol no toews is definitely a #1. Even with girard and makar in the lineup toews still leads in ice time.

Can you explain why they’re trash? Your lack of comprehension doesn’t invalidate their importance

Is Jonas Brodin a better national hockey league defensemen than Victor Hedman?

This season Jonas Brodin contributes more to his team winning hockey games than hedman

And there you go. The analytics have failed. There is no reasonable human being on the planet that could watch brodin, Tanev, and Hedman, and say anything other than, “uhhh Hedman is the best of those three by so much we shouldn’t even talk about it.”

Analytics fail at evaluating d men. Always.

Can you prove how hedman has had a better impact than brodin In the 20-21 season?

No. Of course not. Can you prove he hasn’t? No. Of course not. The game is subjective. This isn’t baseball where a home run is a home run, and a single is a single. That’s why i kinda chuckle at everyone that just relies on the analytics. You’re literally missing the point of the sport. Watch. Have fun with it. Have opinions. Opinions are fun.

Btw was John Marino a top 10 NHL defensemen last year?

It’s not a coincidence that the most successful teams in the league are heavily invested in analytics. Almost everyone who uses analytics also use the eye test, but defensive impact is the hardest part of the game to evaluate with the eye test, which is why analytics are valuable. Most casual fans do not know what to look for when evaluating a defenseman.

Maybe it's just coincidence or timing but both Victor Hedman and Erik Karlsson looked putrid the handful of games I've watched. I get that even the greats have off nights but these last two have been disasters, and if you watch the tape you'll see I'm not exaggerating.

— The Draft Analyst (@TheDraftAnalyst) April 15, 2021

It does have some merit for forwards. Not a ton, but there’s something there. For d men it’s zero.

Teams have invested in analytics, i think mostly for amateur scouting. What they don’t do is depend exclusively on them like you seem to. It’s a small part of the equation. No person that works in the NHL would look at a chart that says brodin is better than Hedman and believe it. You believed it. There’s the difference.

But by all means, keep showing pictures of other peoples twitter, and do everything you possibly can to avoid the strenuous mental labor of forming your own opinion on something.

I understand them. They are so wildly incomplete that they cannot possibly tell the picture. You’re calling others mental midgets? You refuse to have an opinion on anything. You’re not a poster, you’re a website. Anything you say i can find on evolving whatever.

Metrics for dmen are pretty flawed. xGA and xGF with other metrics taking very little into account the quality of opponent. A 3rd pairing defender playing against fourth liners with a ton of O zone time will have a better rating than a 1st or 2nd liner who plays the hardest minutes on the team defensively with limited O zone opportunity.

Take Gardiner and Skjei for example. Gardiner's GSVA is higher than Skjei's. Gardiner's xGA per 60 is better than Skjei's. Is he a better defender than Gardiner, heck no but still there it is. Gardiner gets much easier minutes to play than Skjei but it isnt accounted.

When you see it

Pardon?

Let me help you out

Those are not mutually exclusive concepts. I chose my words carefully.

Lol you sure about that? If your second comment is true, then you shouldn't need to lash out at @Isles777 for his opinion on those three defencemen

😂

do you like barstool sports?

There was one qualifying word you must have missed. So yes, lol, i am, lol, sure about that, lol.

Kinda hate barstool, like a couple of their podcasts.

Don’t worry, we already watch the game while making these opinion.

Oh and for the record, you misinterpreted that chart. That was a list of defencemen who have the most positive impact to their INDIVIDUAL team. The fact Jonas Brodin has boosted the Wild more than Victor Hedman has boosted the Lightning does not say who the better player is. That’s why I don’t like using WAR to rank players unless it’s a discussion for the Hart Trophy.

By definition, you can have weaker defencemen abover stronger ones if the weaker defencemen is “carrying” his team more substantially. That’s why Isles didn’t affirm to your question on whether Brodin is having a better season than Hedman, if you read closely.

nurse, barrie, petry, leddy, toews, hughes, pionk, reilly, ellis, ekholm, sergachev, ekblad, pesce, martinez, and provorov all deserve consideration. ekblad, nurse, and petry especially.

Every guy you mentioned is good but I can’t put every good dman in the top 10 lol

So Whats your metric? I don’t understand what you’re saying now has anything to do with the two concepts not being mutually exclusive.