My goodness, based on the prices for players with term, MB should be fired if he's not thinking of moving Tatar AND Petry this year.

I would definitely be trying to move Tatar, he seems more easily replaceable. If the habs move Petry they have no chance next year, so I'd probably wait and see with Petry, can always move him at the deadline next year if the habs are out of the playoffs again.

Based on what we know, how confident are you the Habs can make the playoffs next year? (Excluding the Habs getting lucky with Laf this year haha)

IMHO, enough is enough. Either its injuries that get us or its Price not playing well or its our top scorers not going or its EXCUSE AFTER EXCUSE AFTER EXCUSE.....How about the most obvious explanation? The team is simply not good enough? If that is the case how do we get the high end good players? Through the draft. How do you get the high end draft picks? By trading your good assets!

Petry will be 33 by this time next year...... he's having a career year. Habs are not winning the cup next year either and resigning Petry when he is 35 is the dumbet thing I can think of. NOW is the best time to move an asset like that who you used wisely these past years and only paid a 2nd and a 5th for in the first place.

I'm so sick of mediocrity @Captainflynnt, I'm so tired of seeing guys like Kovalchuk be talked about as our savior for next year......... Can't we just be lucky that we took a chance on a guy for free and turned him into a free asset? Why do we have to go another step and resign the 37 year old... Like he's the missing piece that will get us in the playoffs.... This team is simply not good enough.

What are we afraid of exactly with trading Petry this year? That the Habs will suck next year because they don't have someone to replace him? NEWSFLASH: The Habs have been sucky regardless. Whats another few spots worse? Especially when we could get a massive haul for Petry now?.

Ok /endrant.

If the habs trade Petry, then you have to tear it down... I doubt Weber and Price will be sticking around if the habs aren't trying to make the playoffs. If they go, what about Gallagher and Armia the next year when they are UFA's? All of a sudden this becomes a long rebuild, I don't think anyone wants that (no playoffs 3 years in a row is already enough).

I think MTL needs to be careful when they decide which players they plan on selling. I don't see any downside to keeping Petry for next season.

If they trade Petry they would have to be getting a potential replacement top 4 RHD that could be ready next year. Like the Jets did with Trouba for Poink.

Edit:
They will turn Kovalchuk into an asset. Should have kept him on the 1st line with Danault, his trade value has been dropping since they were broken up. Kovalchuk's size and creativity was a good compliment to the Danault line. I actually think they were more effective when Gallagher was hurt, Danault specifically seemed to be playing his best hockey of the season, he and Kovalchuk had instant chemistry.

Edit ×2:
To be specific, Kovalchuk had 8 pts in 8 games while gallagher was out of the lineup. With gallagher in the lineup, Kovalchuk has 4 pts in 10 games. Gallagher had 5 pts in the 10 games he played on the top line over Kovalchuk.

In summary, Kovy had 8 pts in 8 games when playing with Danault, vs. Kovy and Gallagher combining for only 9 pts in 20 games after screwing up that line.

Then it can't be any more clear: this team needs to tear it down. If you aren't a team capable of winning with these players in your lineup, then this idea that is being spun that "this will be the year!" is half hearted. You can't have your cake and eat it too as they say. You can't both be a team that isn't proving it can make the playoffs AND a team that is constantly going for the playoffs. At a certain point, gotta look in the mirror.

MTL needs to stop worrying about what Price and Weber, etc think. They aren't a cup contender with them in the lineup anyway and the contracts they have are virtually untradeable. They signed their own destiny. If they don't like it, they can null their contracts. Armia, Gallagher, etc who cares? Trade them! We're so afraid to lose our players that we forget that we GET GOOD PLAYERS IN RETURN also! I'm not sure guys like Price and Weber and Gallagher are any more happy with the current situation that this hypothetical one anyhow. Either scenario, the Habs aren't making the playoffs. Except one scenario is accepting of it and the other is being hard headed about it.

I'm ok with that Petry trade scenario however (Trouba comparison). Trading Both Tatar and Petry doesn't have to be JUST picks and prospects. It can be young players who are capable of playing right now too a la Pionk. If the mandate is to make it look like were still trying to win next year, than by all means add players that can help immediately also. Would be nice if the Habs could use some of that free agent money to fill that void instead though from the start....

Management is trying to fit a round peg in a square hole. "Hey maybe this year will be the year!". No its isn't and the more you try to convince people of it, the more time is wasted rebuilding the team the correct way...

I feel like if they were able to pull of the trades made here and have as many picks as they do while already having the 2nd best prospect pool (based on wheeler's latest rankings for the Athletic), there isn't any need to trade Petry.

Unless a team seriously overpays (1st round pick, A prospect, ++) the habs are better off keeping Petry and deciding next year which direction to go. Next year the habs will also have a better idea where Brook and Fluery are, or even Juulsen if he is healthy. Maybe Petry can be replaced internally by next year.

The team could also suprise next year, there were stretches this year where they looked good and they are one of the best possession teams in the NHL. I think management were hoping for better seasons from Domi, KK, etc. They aren't far off from being contenders (that's the reality of the NHL now). How many one goal games have they lost this year? Despite being one of the best possession teams in the NHL, they're somehow only 25th for penalties drawn (refs don't like Julien).

Full rebuilds is definitely not the way to go anymore, detroit only has like 18% chance to get Lafreniere.

I don't understand why the Habs should trade Petry now when they have no replacement and they could just trade him next year.

The point is that you have two assets at their peak value, peak interest and the team is almost guaranteed to be just as bad as the median 5 years prior. Notice how every year, its another excuse? Every team has players having down years. Every team has injuries. Every team has the refs hating them. These aren't good excuses anymore and it breeds mediocrity as the norm.

The worst part is what if Petry has a down year next year and gets injured? That is a fair possibility. You just lost the chance to cash in on a fast reset this season. Teams don't need to rebuild anymore i get that but they definitely cannot keep pushing the same narrative when it hasn't proven to be effective.

Like i said previously, what is the fear here? That the Habs are a crappy team next year that misses the playoffs? Whats new? The team that's trying to win has been doing this just as effectively. If that's the case, doesn't it make more sense to improve your draft odds and picks in the process? i think so.

MB (And maybe its Molson whose pushing it also) are too neutral. not trying to win but not trying to lose either. Strong management is not about just rebuilding any year and just throwing away assets in order to be purposefully bad. That is a rebuild. I want the Habs to realize that this year is a very pivotal year for any team looking to quickly retool. A couple smart trades this year and the team could have done what many other team tried to do by rebuilding, within a single year span.

Also just as side note, i don't understand the willingness to just trade our leading point scorer this year and for the combined past two years, Tomas Tatar but not for Petry. Is trading Tatar this year and replacing him internally supposed to make the team better? This should apply to Petry also yet it doesn't. That's how you know this plan is half in half out one. Replacing Tatar's production is equally tough and should mean the Habs should be retaining him.

That's why its a bad plan. Because even if they kept Tatar and Petry and resigned Kovy, are they going to be that much closer to making the playoffs next year? Maybe, it'll come down once again to everyone staying healthy and playing up to their contracts. Talk about wishful thinking. We had a team last year that had almost everyone have career years and still missed the playoffs. Price cost us the playoffs last year. Whats going to be the scenario next year? Price stands on his head but Weber has his annual injury and the only player to produce is Gallagher?

Edit: just a FYI, Im not advocating selling both players for cheap, if that is the case than yeah keep them. i'm assuming based on the market right now with guys like Zucker and Coleman, that Tatar and Petry would net massive returns, especially if the Habs retain salary which seems to be the real selling point for teams.

I'm in for trading Tatar, but not for Petry because the habs actually have prospects that could potentially replace Tatar, but not Petry.

Domi could move to wing for KK or Poehling. Hudon has been scoring a lot in Laval. The tatar trade in this case would be bringing back Robertson, who could replace Tatar himself. The habs have Caufield who they could sign. Lehkonen or Drouin cout step up. Or they can target any top 6 forward in free agency (there are a lot of them). Are any of these guarantees? Obviously not but their are plenty of options.

Petry on the other hand is not replaceable in MTL (yet). Fluery? 1 pt in 41 games. Brook? Struggled in Laval this year, scratched and playing forward at times. Juulsen? Not healthy.

If the habs trade Tatar, they don't detract much from the goal of making playoffs next year. If the habs trade Petry, they don't have a chance. At that point you trade Weber, you trade Price (if you can, if you cant he wont be happy). You suck next year, you probably have to trade Gallagher and armia the next year. You suck again.

Maybe we have to agree to disagree, but I don't like that plan at all.

Also, I don't see any team giving us a potential top 4 d for next season for a 33 year old petry. It's different than giving up robertson for a 28 year old tatar.

Too narrow sighted IMO. Smart managers look out for what others aren't. They also take advantage of situations when the time arises.

Claiming that if we trade Petry, we go full rebuild that is. There are the other options you glossed over. Free agency and trades. Buffalo has a some RHD for sale for the right price. Free agency has a ton of RHD available. We can replace Petry with an albeit potentially lesser option but that same positivist outlook you had with replacing Tatar applies here also. I think you are undervaluing how well Tatar has done at the wing for the Habs. Drouin, Domi, Hudon, Caulfield....these are all pretty hail mary'ish as well. Domi has been much worse when playing wing than when he was center. Drouin is a rollercoster of inconsistency, Hudon......come on man. Caulfield, please don't rush this kid. Let him marinate. Habs don't have an incredible track record of young players coming into the NHL right away and killing it. Suzuki might be the only one.

Habs can very easily be just as good next year without Tatar and Petry and their replacements if done correctly but the major difference is they just added 1st rounders and prospects in a year when teams are paying premiums for these players. That year also happens to be one of the best drafts in ages. We don't know when the next chance we'll get where everything aligns the way it has. Its not like we're deconstructing a playoff juggernaut...... this team has only made the playoffs once in the past 4 years with the main players on it still here and getting older.

Give me an example of a RHD the habs could get to replace Petry next year. Why would they trade Petry to go out and trade for another RHD from Buffalo like you are suggesting? That makes no sense.

I gave you 6 players within the organization who could potentially step up to replace Tatar (including Robertson), not to mention the free agent wingers available.

Edit:
Also it doesnt have to be Tatar specifically, I just think he would have the most interest out of Domi, Drouin, and Lehkonen. I would be fine with trading Domi or Drouin if the return is right and just keeping Tatar.

So using Robertson to replace Tatar is valid but adding other players to replace Petry isn't? There are a ton of names. Just check free agency and go look at Buffalo for example. Montour, Ristolainen, Miller are all reported to be available.

The candidates to replace Tatar's production are no less valid than the ones the Habs could use to replace Petry's. The whole point here is to maximize the return on Petry while the Habs are clearly not a playoff team this year nor next, while replacing that player with a live body capable of hopefully playing well AND getting a kings ransom.

Petry is going to be 33 next year. No one can argue that players generally hit a major drop off at this age...... expecting Petry to be the Petry of this year and last for the next 5 years is asinine. Trade Petry now while the value is through the roof and replace him with any one of the options out there this offseason. Even if that option isn't as good as Petry will be next year, the team still has a "replacement" for Petry next year. Only difference is you've added (insert the package you'd get fror Petry here) on top of the replacement for Petry. This is how you replenish your team's picks and prospects alwhile still remaining competitive.

Names of RHD the Habs could target in free agency:

Alex Pietrangelo
Tyson Barrie
Kevin Shattenkirk
Sami Vatanen
Christopher Tanev
Mark Pysyk
Justin Braun
Radko Gudas
Travis Hamonic
Dylan DeMelo
Mike Green
Justin Schultz
Brodie
Demelo
Stecher
etc

Names of some players the Habs could trade for:

Ristolainen
Brodin
Dumba
Severson
Stralman
Murphy
Montour
Miller
etc

No one said Petry will be good for the next 5 years, so yeah that's asinine. Let's be realistic here, a lot of those players can't replace Petry or arent even realistic options. But I will admit their are a few options there, the most realistic one is probably Vatanen.

Pietrangelo isn't coming to MTL. That's like saying Hall will be Tatar's replacement. I can't see Barrie coming. Shattenkirk maybe an option. Tanev, a downgrade. Pysyk, isnt he playing forward for Florida at times? Braun, soon to be 34 and a downgrade. Gudas, a tough dman but definitely not Petry. Demelo, downgrade. Green, will be 35.. he's done. Schultz, he would be a good option. Brodie, I doubt it left handed anyways (I know he plays both sides but Weber is MTL's only RHD besides Petry). Demelo, no downgrade. Stecher, no downgrade.

Ristolainen? He is worth more than Petry. Brodin, hes a lefty and would be worth similar to Petry. Dumba, worth more than Petry, why would minnesota trade him? Severson, why would NJ trade him? Stralman, 33 years old same cap hit as Petry. Why? Murphy, downgrade. Montour downgrade. Miller, I like him he would probably cost something similar to Petry (better contract).

Of everyone you names there is like 2 or 3 options that make any sense there. I doubt the habs gamble that on those 2 or 3 guys coming to MTL as a free agent, nobody wants to come to Montreal.

Petry is not as tradeable as Tatar, the habs have internal options to replace him if they strikeout everywhere else. The same is just not true for Petry.

Petry is 33 years old and a pending UFA. Hence it is next year or bust for him with the Habs. If you are ok with another year of mediocrity and then waiting till the last minute where the player no longer holds the value they once had, be my guess.

I choose to be proactive when the previous thing we were doing wasnt working anyway..... But we're confident for absolutely no reason that "this is the year".... Thats blind hope IMO.

I think the fundamental thing we are disagreeing on is like you said, do we want to compete next year or years ahead.

I prefer to have a team that has a chance to compete every season, which is why I am advocating for keeping Petry. I also believe adding as many picks as I did with this armchair gm team and with MTL already having the 2nd best prospect pool in the NHL, they can try to compete next year while still being set for the future.

If the plan is to suck next year to build for the future (maybe it is the right plan) that is a good reason to trade Petry who won't be a factor for the habs 3-4 years from now.

It the habs trade Petry though, then I dont think you can stop there. The habs should be trading Weber and even Price (if possible). I personally don't want the canadiens to go down that road at this moment.

Agreed. Its absolutely a philosophical difference of opinion. More than happy to agree to disagree on this one. Not easy to get someone to express a good/valid differing opinion on this site sometimes!

My only qualm is that what has the NHL become? The league of parity. Was Columbus supposed to be good this year? Unless you are full on tanking, you have a chance to make it. I feel like the Habs biggest success factor rests on two things: Carey Price playing like a 10M goalie and the team staying relatively healthy. Without that, the Habs will not make the playoffs regardless. The proof is in the pudding. There's no need to worry about Petry and top 6 scoring, etc. Those can all be filled. What can't be filled is when CP is a average goalie and the team is struck with injuries to key personnel. This team isn't good enough to do what the Pens are doing for example. So the real worry lies in things outside our control irregardless of the other positions.

I am not advocating "tanking" or full on "rebuilding". I'm advocating being proactive. Taking advantage of situations at the proper time and maximizing efficiency. Nothing in my plan suggest we can't replace lost players with able bodies. The difference is those able bodies are not worth as much as Petry and Tatar are. Hence using their high value to continue the prospect growth all while still attempting to compete. Habs still won games without Weber and Gallagher an others. Losing Tatar and Petry and replacing them with (picking names out of a hat here) Vatanen UFA and Josh Anderson via trade for example would not mean that the Habs need to rebuild... That team could surprise just as much as the one with Tatar and Petry.

Good managers IMHO are opportunistic and don't shy away from doing the unpopular thing when its the most opportune time. Colorado trading Duchene for what they did is an example of this. STL getting O'Reilly is another example. Couple that with the teams that traded for picks and prospects when the going was good! Chicago turning Shaw into Debrincat or Nashville moving Erat for Forsberg.

The good teams in the NHL didn't only luck into a franchise player, they made there own luck with smart trades when the time was right. I feel MB is too reactionary. Domi is having a great year, untouchable. Has one bad year, now I got to trade him. This is why the team is staying mediocre. Never capitalizing on the right assets when the time is right. It doesn't take 3 or 4 years to change the makeup of the team and compete anymore. Prospects are ready to come in and make an impact earlier and earlier. Its all about making the right picks and trading for the right prospects.

If MB was able to turn Weise and Fleischmann into Danault and Romanov, Imagine if he did the same with Tatar and Petry!

Interesting debate guys. I guess the "sell or not to sell on Petry" argument boils down to your confidence level that this team has all the pieces to play for .600 over 110 games.

Agreed. I do not have faith this team can do it and even if they did, what good would come from it afterwards? One playoff birth then having to try and resign a 35 year old Petry or let him go in free agency for nothing...

How valuable is a pretty small chance the Habs make the playoffs next year? IMO Not that valuable. Especially when you could trade Petry and Tatar for picks and prospects, replace them with able bodies through trade and free agency, and still maybe even make the playoffs next year. It all comes down to Price and the health of the team mostly anyway. So why risk not capitalizing on a buyers market with two of the most valuable trade assets?

Something that glosses over people's minds that should absolutely NOT, is the idea that Petry and Tatar could have crappy years next year. That is also an option. Maybe Tatar and Petry could get injured and all that added value they had is diminished badly because they are injured...... That is very plausible scenario also.

@F50marco after seeing what Bergevin got for Scandella, I'd be quite intrigued to see what they could get for Petry.

Wow what a trade. That move would have this site attacking posters for even suggesting Scandella goes for a 2nd. Amazing.