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Question for TB Fans

Créé par: rja
Équipe: 2019-20 Lightning de Tampa Bay
Date de création initiale: 6 mars 2019
Publié: 6 mars 2019
Mode - plafond salarial: Basique
Description
I am looking at the Lightning's roster and noticed that there will be a couple of spots open on the defense (most notably the right side, but Sergachev could move over there; still, that leaves 2 spots open on the third pair).

I was wondering in a trade where TB would receive a cost effective defenseman, while also trading away Callahan (and retaining half of the salary because I assume nobody would want to take more), what else would TB be willing to throw into the trade? It is no secret that TB needs to move as much salary as it can if it wants to keep its core, and half of Callahan's contract ($2.9 million) would be a huge help.

So, TB Fans, what else would be willing to throw in? A future second rounder? A good prospect? If a prospect, which ones would you be willing to part with?

Please share your thoughts.

Also, ANA is not necessarily the team that the trade needs to be with of course. Could be any team.
Transactions
TBL
    -A cost effective defenseman (or could be another piece, that's just a position that will likely need to be filled).
    ANA
    1. Callahan, Ryan (2 900 000 $ retained)
    Détails additionnels:
    -???
    Rachats de contrats
    Transactions impliquant une retenue de salaire
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    TAILLE DE LA FORMATIONPLAFOND SALARIALCAP HITEXCÉDENTS Info-bulleBONISESPACE SOUS LE PLAFOND SALARIAL
    1582 500 000 $70 223 331 $0 $1 362 500 $12 276 669 $
    Ailier gaucheCentreAilier droit
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    5 000 000 $5 000 000 $
    AD, C, AG
    NTC
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    8 500 000 $8 500 000 $
    AG, C
    NMC
    UFA - 5
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    4 450 000 $4 450 000 $
    AD, AG
    NTC
    UFA - 4
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    5 250 000 $5 250 000 $
    C, AG, AD
    UFA - 4
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    5 300 000 $5 300 000 $
    AG, AD
    NTC
    UFA - 3
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    728 333 $728 333 $ (Bonis de performance182 500 $$182K)
    AG, AD
    UFA - 1
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    728 333 $728 333 $ (Bonis de performance182 500 $$182K)
    C, AG
    UFA - 1
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    9 500 000 $9 500 000 $
    AD
    UFA - 8
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    5 166 666 $5 166 666 $
    C, AG, AD
    NTC
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    Défenseur gaucherDéfenseur droitierGardien de but
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    7 875 000 $7 875 000 $
    DG
    NMC
    UFA - 6
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    697 500 $697 500 $ (Bonis de performance147 500 $$148K)
    DD
    UFA - 1
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    3 500 000 $3 500 000 $
    G
    UFA - 1
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    6 750 000 $6 750 000 $
    DG
    NTC
    UFA - 7
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    1 150 000 $1 150 000 $
    G
    UFA - 1
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    894 166 $894 166 $ (Bonis de performance850 000 $$850K)
    DG/DD
    UFA - 1

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    6 mars 2019 à 18 h 25
    #1
    Rangers 2023
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    How about callahan and gourde/miller for casey nelson and the blues 2021 2nd?
    6 mars 2019 à 18 h 35
    #2
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    We need to move his whole contract
    6 mars 2019 à 18 h 43
    #3
    KUUUCH
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    Depends on which "cost effective defenseman" is in question. If we're retaining half of Cally's hit, then expect half of his full value being traded with him. If Cally half retained, add a 3rd-4th. If Cally un-retained, add a 2nd / Katchouk.
    6 mars 2019 à 18 h 57
    #4
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    Quoting: Hedman77
    We need to move his whole contract


    That seems pretty unlikely, no?
    6 mars 2019 à 18 h 59
    #5
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    Trade him to Anaheim for Dotchin lol
    6 mars 2019 à 19 h 6
    #6
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    Quoting: KUUUCH
    Depends on which "cost effective defenseman" is in question. If we're retaining half of Cally's hit, then expect half of his full value being traded with him. If Cally half retained, add a 3rd-4th. If Cally un-retained, add a 2nd / Katchouk.


    A cost effective defenseman is someone who will have an AAV less than or equal to 2 million, in my mind. Easy examples would be second or third pairing defensemen with ELCs and/or are RFAs

    In no way do I mean to be rude here; I am not trying to be obnoxious when I ask this. Do me a favor and try to put yourself in another person's shoes who does not root for the Lightning. Would you take on Callahan, who has been a fourth liner for the past two seasons, at $2.9 million, knowing that the team he's coming from is desperate to move any bit of his salary, for a fourth round pick, while also giving up an NHL caliber defenseman? I just have a hard time seeing a GM accept that trade, but we can agree to disagree.
    6 mars 2019 à 19 h 7
    #7
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    Quoting: Ragsandbluesfan
    How about callahan and gourde/miller for casey nelson and the blues 2021 2nd?


    That's not really answering the hypothetical. Was curious if you could fill in the "???" if you had to.

    TB receives: Cost effective defenseman
    Other receives: Callahan (1/2 retained), ???
    6 mars 2019 à 19 h 23
    #8
    KUUUCH
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    Quoting: rja
    A cost effective defenseman is someone who will have an AAV less than or equal to 2 million, in my mind. Easy examples would be second or third pairing defensemen with ELCs and/or are RFAs

    In no way do I mean to be rude here; I am not trying to be obnoxious when I ask this. Do me a favor and try to put yourself in another person's shoes who does not root for the Lightning. Would you take on Callahan, who has been a fourth liner for the past two seasons, at $2.9 million, knowing that the team he's coming from is desperate to move any bit of his salary, for a fourth round pick, while also giving up an NHL caliber defenseman? I just have a hard time seeing a GM accept that trade, but we can agree to disagree.


    I wasn't talking including the unknown cost effective dman (a name would be easier for me to give you a theoretical trade). But yes I think a non playoff team would take Callahan's 1 yr 2.9m for a free 3rd-4th rd pick.
    6 mars 2019 à 19 h 23
    #9
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    Quoting: Ragsandbluesfan
    How about callahan and gourde/miller for casey nelson and the blues 2021 2nd?


    Don’t you touch my good sweet Casey.
    6 mars 2019 à 19 h 25
    #10
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    Quoting: KUUUCH
    I wasn't talking including the unknown cost effective dman (a name would be easier for me to give you a theoretical trade). But yes I think a non playoff team would take Callahan's 1 yr 2.9m for a free 3rd-4th rd pick.


    I'm from NY, so let's use Pelech or Pionk as an example (they should cost about the same). Then what else would you throw into the trade along with Callahan?
    6 mars 2019 à 19 h 34
    #11
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    Quoting: rja
    That's not really answering the hypothetical. Was curious if you could fill in the "???" if you had to.

    TB receives: Cost effective defenseman
    Other receives: Callahan (1/2 retained), ???


    Probably yan and or spencer
    6 mars 2019 à 19 h 36
    #12
    KUUUCH
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    Quoting: rja
    I'm from NY, so let's use Pelech or Pionk as an example (they should cost about the same). Then what else would you throw into the trade along with Callahan?


    If it's 2.9m Cally, and Pionk resigns @ 2m or less x 3yr, I'd trade a 1st, OR a 2nd/3rd rd pick & Domingue. Or if it's 5.9m Cally, maybe a 2nd & Ingram.
    6 mars 2019 à 19 h 41
    #13
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    Quoting: KUUUCH
    If it's 2.9m Cally, and Pionk resigns @ 2m or less x 3yr, I'd trade a 1st, OR a 2nd/3rd rd pick & Domingue. Or if it's 5.9m Cally, maybe a 2nd & Ingram.


    Well he's a RFA so you'd negotiate and likely arbitrate with him. And ok wow that's more than I would expect. What if instead of a first it was a prospect and a later pick? Either Raddysh, Katchouk or Volkov
    6 mars 2019 à 19 h 44
    #14
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    Quoting: Ragsandbluesfan
    Probably yan and or spencer


    Interesting. @KUUUCH seems to be willing to offer more. For simplicity, would you keep your offer if the "cost effective defenseman" was either Pionk or Pelech?
    6 mars 2019 à 19 h 49
    #15
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    Quoting: rja
    That seems pretty unlikely, no?


    That’s why I’m so nervous
    6 mars 2019 à 19 h 49
    #16
    KUUUCH
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    Quoting: rja
    Well he's a RFA so you'd negotiate and likely arbitrate with him. And ok wow that's more than I would expect. What if instead of a first it was a prospect and a later pick? Either Raddysh, Katchouk or Volkov


    Like I said if he resigns @ 2m or less x 3 years, I'd pull the trigger I guess. Cally has to go one way or the other. I'd do Katchouk & 5.8m Cally straight up. Or Pionk & 3rd/4th for Katchouk & 2.9m Cally.
    6 mars 2019 à 19 h 54
    #17
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    Quoting: Hedman77
    That’s why I’m so nervous


    I think TB will move Miller as well to be cap compliant, because he'll only have an eight team no trade list. I think you could get back a decent return and still have a contender.
    Hedman77 a aimé ceci.
    6 mars 2019 à 19 h 55
    #18
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    Quoting: KUUUCH
    Like I said if he resigns @ 2m or less x 3 years, I'd pull the trigger I guess. Cally has to go one way or the other. I'd do Katchouk & 5.8m Cally straight up. Or Pionk & 3rd/4th for Katchouk & 2.9m Cally.


    Ok, so be on the lookout down the road because I might post a thread with a trade like this haha.
    KUUUCH a aimé ceci.
    6 mars 2019 à 19 h 58
    #19
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    Quoting: Hedman77
    That’s why I’m so nervous


    I'll make a post for you with details down the road haha.
    6 mars 2019 à 20 h 46
    #20
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    Quoting: rja
    Interesting. @KUUUCH seems to be willing to offer more. For simplicity, would you keep your offer if the "cost effective defenseman" was either Pionk or Pelech?


    Im rangers and blues fan not rangers and isles fan smh
    6 mars 2019 à 20 h 53
    #21
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    Quoting: Ragsandbluesfan
    Im rangers and blues fan not rangers and isles fan smh


    I understand; I am just saying objectively, if you were the TB GM, would Pionk or Pelech interest you more?
    6 mars 2019 à 21 h 48
    #22
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    Quoting: rja
    I understand; I am just saying objectively, if you were the TB GM, would Pionk or Pelech interest you more?


    Oh pionk for sure
    6 mars 2019 à 22 h 4
    #23
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    Quoting: Ragsandbluesfan
    Oh pionk for sure


    Ok, so if you were TB GM, and NYR offered Pionk and to take Callahan and half of his contract, and you had to add another asset to make NYR happy, what would that be? How high would you go? A 2nd rounder? Raddysh? Cal Foote? That's all I am asking.
    6 mars 2019 à 22 h 55
    #24
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    Quoting: rja
    Ok, so if you were TB GM, and NYR offered Pionk and to take Callahan and half of his contract, and you had to add another asset to make NYR happy, what would that be? How high would you go? A 2nd rounder? Raddysh? Cal Foote? That's all I am asking.


    Probably raddysh
    8 mars 2019 à 17 h 27
    #25
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    So you're kinda asking a multi-level question. So what will we do about Cally & Cap? What tradeable assets do we have? Our RHD options?

    First is what our GM JBB said (I'm paraphrasing this quote) "Our priority is signing Point and we know we will have to shed 2 mid-level cap hits to do so." So think every forward in $4-$6M range. Next, look at who has NTC, modified NTC, and who doesn't have any (yet - July 1st) and that tells us who JBB is referring to.
    Miller (has a lot of value, signed long term, great price, top 6 guy, power play guy, and a center)
    Gourde (I don't see them moving Gourde cause they just signed him. JBB has said his style of play if how he is gonna build our team.)
    Callahan (becomes an assistant coach, what? ... keep reading)

    Now we could still try to move a NTC. Ask the player to waive it. Especially if we win the cup this yr. Think maybe an Alex Killorn. He has a NTC but holds a lot of value still. He is one of the reasons we have the number 1 PK in the league. Really clutch goal scorer in the playoffs. He gets 3rd line minutes here. Say we offer him a trade to his home town with the Habs. He would get PP time, top 2 line minutes, etc. His name (hopefully) is already on the cup. If he refused, we could buy him out as well as an option. Habs would jump at this b/c the ask would be very low. Why wouldn't you want him for next to nothing in return?

    Callahan - I don't see them trading him with salary retained because we would likely loss assets in the deal. We can just buy him out instead of trading assets in that case. I can't see us keeping Cally, as must as he is loved and a leader, you can't pay a healthy scratch (or 4th line guy on this team) almost $6M. Faced with a buyout or trade to a non-playoff, rebuilding team willing to take on a contract for assets, (again hopefully his name is on the cup at this point,) I believe (just my guess) the Lightning offer him a coaching or front office job to retire early. This clears his cap but he still gets paid as a LTIR. He is a great leader in that room and would be a great assistant coach. Another option is offering another team assets to take Cally for the purpose of buying him out and then Tampa resigns him cheaper on a veteran deal. Of course, we could just straight up trade his whole contract and give up assets to do so for nothing in return but the cap relief. (Not a great option.)

    Other roster assets, RFA rights to:
    Erne
    Paquette
    Martel
    I believe Paquette gets moved. We shouldn't resign them all with how much depth we have in Syracuse. He is a Center, he is having a career yr so he is now in his prime, and we have plenty of talent to replace him.

    Other forward assets/ Syracuse:
    ABB - Having a monster rookie yr and is too good to let go. He is probably off the board as a trade asset.
    Verhaeghe & Stephens are 2 centers that could replace Paquette next yr. So they are NHL ready and one might be traded.
    Biggest trade piece is Volkov. Scouted as the next Kucherov so why trade him? His is top 6 talent and there is no room in our top 6 in Tampa. He doesn't play that bottom 6 grit style, he is a pure goal scorer so we either waste his amazing talent in the AHL or trade him. He is very valuable as a trade piece, will immediately improve a team in scoring.
    More names to watch. Katchouk, Conacher, & our goalie Ingram. Yep, I said it, Ingram might get traded. He is really good, AHL all-star, etc but he has no room in Tampa behind Vasy. Don't wanna sit a young talent as a number 2. Goalies need game time. Domingue is the perfect #2 so they may trade Ingram as an asset.

    RHD -
    In our system, we have Foote which has started to pick it up in Syracuse but scouts and people like Bolt Prospects on twitter (which is a great follow) says he is still at least 1/2 a yr away. So maybe a call-up Dec, Jan time next yr if he is proving to deserve it.
    Also, Masin is in our system for the left side. Was one of the last cuts during training camp. He really impressed the coaching staff. Could cover LHD while Serg is on the right side. Masin is 23 years old and needs to take that next step and break into the league soon.
    Rutta can be a cheap option for RHD.
    The 3 UFAs Strals, Coburn, & Girardi. All are declining and would sign a "veteran" type low deal I believe. However, does Tampa want that with the league getting faster? I could see Tampa signing one of them, either Coburn or Strals if the deal is right and short term. I think Girardi retires.
    Serg I think works all offseason to become better at the right side. He should be a top 4 D guy but can't be one on the left side behind Heddy and MacD.
    Based on this without a trade or UFA not in our current system, next yr could be like this:
    Heddy - Serg
    MacD - Cernak
    Coburn/Masin - Rutta (with Foote called up mid yr)

    But I could see Tampa trading for an RHD at the draft. Remember some NTC kick in on July 1st. I could see a move like J.Faulk (Carolina) for JT Miller for example. Then our team is drastically better:
    Heddy - Serg
    MacD - Cernak
    Coburn/Masin - Faulk
    [Foote - 1 more full yr in AHL]

    The crazy wild card for RHD still out there. Eric Karlsson. haha I know I know crazy. Tampa could move things around to fit him in (yes even with signing Point) but is it worth it? I don't know. Heard (even recently) podcasts/ lightning power play (a TBL radio station on iHeart) that they still believe Karlsson wants to come to Tampa. Even if he takes a huge discount/ short deal to go for the cup, I can't see him making less than Heddy on the discount. So again I don't know if it's worth it cause it really puts us in a bind the following yr for Vasy, Cernak, Cirelli, Joseph, and Serg. To me, Karlsson isn't worth the cap trouble.

    So my guess is we do bring in one RHD this offseason like a Faulk, Tanev, Trouba (might be still too much $), Gudas, etc.

    Thanks for reading this far. You asked a great question which has lots of layers so I wanted to give ya my guesses as a Tampa resident.
     
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