Why they need to trade Mylander*

Who is Mylander?

hahaha Sorry Typo mistakes!!! Nylander of course...
Because they can't get under the 82M cap space without trading for a TOP RHD at lower cost than 5M... and Gardiner will ask at least 6M $

That's all you have to say... seriously!!! you can call him Mildander as well

William Nylander

22 years old, back to back 61 point seasons. Top 100 5v5 points last season (I believe he was in the top 50 but don't have time to confirm) Wants long term deal with the Leafs

Jeff Petry

30 years old, career high 42 points (last season) hasn't hit 30 prior too that, is right handed, is not a top pairing dman and also is 30.

Who cares about Scherbak, he wouldn't make the Leafs lineup.

Do I really need to add anything else? Hab fans go nuts when anyone trades Price for less than an entire roster worth of players and then immediately post this silliness.

I guess at least good for you for not offering Weber this time.

Either way, no. Toronto has no interest in anything Montreal has to offer.

1. I'm a sens fan so there's absolutely no bias from either side 'cause i hate both teams.
2. you really underestimate Jeff Petry, he's a great rhd and i would love to have him on the sens.
3. 61 points in 82 games is not that amazing. definitely not worth 8 mil. thats almost 1.5 mil more than what Gaudreau or Pastrnak and i would take either of those two over Nylander.
4. You can't compare point totals of fwd's to d's. thats just not how you compare players.

Now im not saying that Nylander isn't a great player, but if im dubas then im looking to trade him instead of signing him for 8 mil. thats too much. But heres the problem . Leafs wont get Parayko for him so you have to settle at some point. or sign him for more than he's worth

Your premise is all wrong. The Leafs don't have to sign trade Nylander. He's under Leaf control for 5 years. Leafs can be under cap, if reasonable contracts are signed with their RFA players.
You are correct , Gardiner is not going to be a Leaf next year. Leafs have lots of LHD and won't/can't overpay for a UFA. But what is that Carrick at 3.5m signing? He might not even make the Leafs this year. He's an iffy NHLer.

Everyone at this point (especially with Nylander still unsigned) can see that the Leafs need to do something about all these expensive forwards. I mean, if Freddy ccan continue being a beast and they can somehow keep everyone together, y need a top RHD honestly? Look at how dangerous Tampa is, and they dont have 1.

1) The only time 8+ million was mentioned was a quote from Darren Dreger that read like this, "There are sources, not attached to the Leafs or the Nylander camp but sources, who think that Nylander's camp may be asking for as much as 8.5 million on a max term deal." You can't get much more vague or speculative than that. So is he asking 8 mill? Maybe at one point but if he was asking for that kind of money coming off his production, then he wants out of TO because they can't pay him that. And he would know that by now. So since both sides are still negotiating, that number is 100% just speculation.

2) Hall for Larsson, that is the example of trading a young offensive player for a defensive defenceman and its a disaster. Is Petry close to as good as Larsson, not even close. Larsson is younger and all around just better than Petry who while being a talented and good player isn't worth close to someone of Nylander's calibre.

3) You can absolutely compare point totals between forwards and D. Because the hardest thing to do in the NHL is score goals. If you can't score goals, you can't win games. So is trading Nylander for Petry and a 2nd even remotely close to being fair? No it, could be one of the worst trades I've seen on here. Well I guess Weber for Nylander is far worse.

I'm fascinated with the Leafs' upcoming cap situation, but I think you've got it all wrong here. For what it's worth, I subscribe to the camp that's proven that Nylander and Marner are statistically equivalent. I'll use $8M as what Nylander should be signed at.

1. I'm like 99.99% sure Marleau has either a handshake deal to be traded back to San Jose for this year of his deal. If the Sharks resign Karlsson, Pavelski, Thornton, Labanc, and Meier to team-friendly deals (and Wilson is probably more than capable of that), I'm anticipating that Toronto can save about 4M on Marleau (they must retain 2.25M to move him).

The entire 4th line will have to be made out of either cheap ELC deals or players making league minimum. There's at least $1M to be freed up on the 4th line. Anyone with an RFA expiry can be moved for late-round picks (or higher should they warrant it) to keep fueling this tea with cheap, effective players. Borgman falls into this camp as well: he's definitely a useful player, but there are players within the Leafs' system that can be just as effective for >$300k cheaper. It all matters when the team is in cap hell. I'll touch on Scherbak later. I'm estimating that there can be about $1.3M found just in those inefficiencies: avoid getting attached to non-core players. The turnover on this roster is going to be violent until the cap raises enough to give this team room to keep players for longer.

Carrick will not be resigned by the Leafs, especially not at $3.5M: If they do resign him, the deal will be at ~$2M. However, I imagine the remainder of that money is split between Jonsson and Kapanen in order to get them on 3 or 4-year deals. No savings there, just better allocation of money.

By not doing that Petry trade at all, any remaining cash needed for a Nylander contract can be found. Without Scherbak coming in, there's another $200k that can be saved as well.

Matthews would be wise to not sign a deal close to what Tavares signed for (which looks like a bad deal after seeing what Seguin got). Draisaitl is a good comparable, but for the optics as Matthews being Toronto's star, a deal closer to Seguin's makes more sense to me. Assume $2M in savings here, Auston will make his money through sponsors. He wants to win, I don't think it silly to think he takes a modest discount.

McElhinney probably won't have much left in the tank by this point. The Leafs would be better off spending more on Sparks. Around $1.5M AT MOST. Liljegren is probably ready to go at this point, and the blueline most likely looks like:

Rielly | Zaitsev
Dermott | Carrick
[] | Liljegren

If Sandin isn't NHL-ready, throw money at a short-term deal for someone who can anchor Liljegren and push him into the top-4 by the deadline.

There's room here to sign everyone. Dubas isn't a madman, and he's not a liar. Wat's holding up the Nylander deal is most likely Marner's camp wanting more despite the two players being statistically equivalent. I'm very jealous of the Leafs.

This team is better with Nylander than without him. There are zero trades involving him where TO comes out better than before. Nylander for Petry is a joke. Nylander for Parayko would be a good trade but it won't happen, St Louis would ask for way too much. In fact every team that has a young good right handed defenceman, would ask for Nylander plus and the only way that makes sense is if they are getting a guy like Seth Jones back, which none of his calibre of player are available. So Nylander can't be traded, unless TO is willing to get fleeced. Which they are not, because Dubas is a guy who manages assets, Chiarelli is a guy who makes moves based on "need" at the cost of skill and talent that overall damages his team.

You are correct, this stud and the importance of having one is so overblown IMO. Hasn't helped Ottawa that much, or even St Louis over the years. Have six or seven good dman might be better value than loading your cap on one or two dmen, and then have iffy guys on your bottom pair.

1) Looking at cap space.. they can't keep all of them
2) They can't keep Gardiner as well at higher cost (6-7M$/y)
3) Goal was to create the best return against a GOOD RHD at a cheap price until Marleau contract get off.
4) If you don't like Petry or anything from Mtl... Maybe simply trade him for Theodore in Vegas but it was only to point down the problem that Dubas created in Tavares signature.
4.1) We all know players age and point and you can't compare a forward point per match with a D.
5) The other plan would be to trade Matthews after this season for a BIG PACK!

Well said, and well thought out. I've toyed around with their cap hit next season a lot and here is what I have come up with.

1) you are right, there will be turnover. Gardiner and Hainsey are gone, without a doubt. Replaced by younger cheaper depth players. I do think one of Johnsson or Kapanen could be lost as well if either have a very good season.

2) Marleau will either retire or play out his last year with TO. Eitherway its not the biggest problem. They can still fit it all next year regardless.

3) 8 Million a season is too much for Nylander or Marner, neither are centres so they'll have trouble demanding that much unless they are getting over 90 points a season which neither have done. I think between 7 and 7.5 each is a better deal but I agree that their contracts will be a lot closer. In fact I wouldn't be surprised if they got matching deals.

4) where Toronto needs to keep clear is with the overpriced bad deals so many teams have to deal with. Which I don't see them doing because they just can't afford it. So many teams got into trouble by bridging their stars and then giving them huge 3rd contracts as they left their 20's. Now those teams are aging and have zero cap space because they are playing their older stars huge money they no longer can live up to. (Chicago, LA, Anahiem etc) Toronto is unique because bridge deals are essentially dead (for star players anyways) and they don't have any bad contracts currently (Marleau doesn't really count since he still scores close to 30 goals)

So many are thinking San Jose is a surefire Stanley Cup contender now that they have Karlsson but I look at them and see a team that has huge depth issues. Their top line isn't much better than Toronto's 3rd line and is a big step back of either the Matthews or Tavares lines. Sure they have the most expensive defence in hockey but if they can't score, will that matter?
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I agree with the +/- 300K $ right and left but with the above D-line up you proposed... I don't think they can be a cup-pretender IMO.
That's why I was suggesting getting a good D like Petry, Faulk, Theodore... etc... They were high on Hanafin... for sure it will be very interesting

1) They can, but it will require creativity and the stones to go with a young and inexperienced blue line for next season
2) Gardiner is dust and won't be back, unless he comes and says give me a 3 year deal at 3.5 mill a season, he'll be gone.
3) That price for Petry is a joke, he's worth a 2nd round pick at best. Nylander is worth 4 of Petry.
4) Yeah, Tavares signing is a problem for TO.
4.1 you can compare point totals of any player, scoring goals is the hardest thing to do and Nylander creates offence at an elite level, all his advance stats point to this, he's also 8 years younger than Petry. That means he has 8 years of his prime that an 8 year deal would cover.
5) You literally can't trade a super elite franchise centre. It just can't happen. You'll get wrecked every time. There is only 1 player in the league currently who would be a fair return for Matthews and that would be McDavid and the Leafs would have to add a lot to make that happen. Every other trade would either have to be a landslide overpayment from the opposition or it would leave the Leafs without a generational talent centre and a bunch of mid round picks and lesser prospects or players. Matthews can't be traded for fair value. Its the same boat as if Edmonton wanted to trade McDavid, unless they are getting a younger McDavid back, they have lost that trade in a big way.

So what do you suggest?
keeping Nylander @ 7-8M/y
and moving forward with this D
Rielly- Zaitsev
Dermott- Borgman
Carrick- Lilegren

Leafs do not need to trade for a rhd, we will most likely go with zaitsev liljegren and ozhiganov next season. Dubas has already publically states that as long as he is the GM Nylander is on the team. We have plenty of mobile pieces to trade other than nylander should the need arise to sturdy the blue line.

Do you really think the leafs are offering 8m???? Why did nylander miss camp if they did???

Reilly/zaitsev
Dermott/liljegren
Borgaman or Rosen/Ozhiganov or Carrick

Nylander will not be signed over 7m if the leafs were offering that he wouldn’t have missed training camp.

I think something more like

Rielly - Carrick/Ozhiganov
Dermott - Zaitsev
Rosen/Borgman - Holl/Liljigren

To be honest, I think its a very likely scenario where Rosen makes the lineup over Dermott this season, he's really impressing this preseason.

I am not too concerned about the defence, mainly because the style of game the Leafs will play is going to do the following things.

1) The leafs forwards are going to be high pressure with tonnes of speed, they will hound the opposition and limit their space. Which will lead to a lot of dump and chase form the opposition. If that is the case, you need fast mobile defence who can get back and get the puck faster than the opposition. So guys like Carrick, Liljegren, Rosen, Borgman, Ozhiganov etc will be far more effective than you may think because they are all very good skaters. In a couple of years guys like Sandin may be ready and then the defence isn't the weakness people think it is.

2) That blue line could vastly outperform the current lineup, mainly because when you lose Hainsey and Gardiner and replace with any of these guys, you gain speed, and that will be a where TO will have a big edge.

I think Carrick is a better option with Rielly, he's a far more complimentary style to Rielly. A great skater, plays with an edge and is by far the best on the team at suppressing shots on goal, something they need to be better at. He deserves a shot at that but I doubt Babs moves away from Hainsey.

No a big fan of carrick not that I dislike the kid. I don’t think he had a strong showing in camp or preseason and I do believe he loses his spot to Ozhiganov. Babs loves him... Enogh to fly to Russia and personally recruit him.

You are not wrong and that is the only knock I have against Babs, he does have favourites who seem to do no wrong. Hainsey is the best PK guy on the team but he should be 3rd pair LHD, anyone would be better playing with Rielly at 5v5. Carrick has impressed me though, he's not flashy but he doesn't do anything wrong. He's just a smaller guy who skates very well and keeps the puck away from his own net. That is literally the exact thing everyone is clamouring for but want someone who is flashier.

I don't get this fascination that the Leafs are so bad on defence...especially look OK to me as Jamiepo indicated on post 20. Remains to be seen by why do folks think Nylander deserves to paid among top 15/20 wingers in the NHL next year. Let's forget what the media says "what Nylander wants". A more realistic ending to the contract impasse is a contract based on comparables.