Does Pit want him back. Also what the deal with trading brannstrom in your proposals each time? Do you dislike him that much

Pierre Dorion claims that the Senators see a wide tier of prospects from 7th to 19th in the draft. Which means if they move down, they can conceivably get a similar player. Pittsburgh's pick is 21, but the Senators have multiple second or third round picks that can be used to move up into the teens.

John Marino is likely worth a late 1st or two 2nds. Similar to what Devon Toews went for when he was traded to Colorado. Connor Brown is likely worth a 2nd and a small plus. As high as Senators fans are on Brown, his trade value is way overrated. Brannstrom is worth maybe a 3rd to 5th round pick, depending on the team. Pittsburgh can sign Brannstrom to a cheap 2 year deal at under 1.5M AAV, and roll the dice on him becoming a regular NHLer. At worst, he is cheap depth as he can quarterback a PP unit.

Both Zucker and Murray have negative value. The point of including Zucker in the trade is twofold. First, it makes the cap workable for Pittsburgh. Second, it makes it so Ottawa is only dumping 1 bad year of Murray, since the bad year of Zucker they take offsets 1 of Murray's 2 years left. This lowers what they have to give to Pittsburgh to take Murray. We'll assume Pittsburgh will not re-sign DeSmith.

Ottawa saves 2.3M in real dollars. They are a budget team. They do this while getting a comparable prospect with the Pittsburgh pick than they would at 7. They also add Chabot's partner for the next few years. Zucker stinks, but he is a few years removed from being a legitimate goal scorer.

This trade is close to cap neutral for Pittsburgh this year. They only do it if they feel they can get a legitimate top prospect at 7th overall who will come in on his ELC in the next few years and help extend their window. They also get Brown as a very solid top 9 forward for at least 1 year. They get out of Marino's long term contract. While he is not a negative value contract, this does increase their cap flexibility going forward.

Sens fans won't be happy with this type of proposal, but if Murray is going to be in a trade with the 7th overall pick, something like this would be a best case scenario.

The Senators have been shopping Brannstrom all year. I think he gets put in a multi-man trade because he isn't worth that much, but the Senators likely don't want to liquidate him for a 4th or 5th round pick, and have to face the scrutiny of "we traded Stone for nothing". If he ends up in a multi-man trade, its easier to falsely pass off that they got value for Stone, without requiring Sokolov to become a star.

Pittsburgh does not want Murray, but take him because instead of getting something like two 2nds for Marino, they get the 7th overall, Brown, and Brannstrom for Marino and 21 by taking on 1 bad year of Murray. I say 1 bad year, because the year of Zucker they dump cancels out one of Murray's two years.

“They are a budget team” hence your name

He was a lottery pick and the main pice in the stone deal. Such a shame he never panned out to that pick value. Also Ottawa shouldn’t give in on a low return on a bottom pair 22 year old yet

My real name is Bud Geteam, I guess I should have included an underscore. I would have never in a million years thought to make my username on a cap related web forum a tribute to the existence of the Ottawa Senators budget. Now that I look at my name, I can see how someone could make that mistake.

He wasn't a lottery pick, but I mean he was considered one of the top defensive prospects in the league so I don't disagree with what you're saying. The return for Stone sucked because Dorion had to hold on to Stone and Duchene both to convince Tkachuk to sign and not go back to college, and to dupe the season ticket holders into possibly thinking they had a shot at keeping the stars. But I mean, in the context of the situation Melnyk and Dorion put the team in, the return was great.

The thing is, the optics of waiving him or losing him for a 3rd-5th round pick is pretty bad. It's much better for the Senators to throw him in a multi-man trade for a core piece so that it isn't as blatantly obvious that as of now they got very little for Stone.

He was number 15 in 2017. Therefore Lottery pick. Look for yourself

its either the 7th OA or connor brown, not both. idk how this helps the sens... lose your top pick and a forward who played the most minutes on your team for only a 2nd pair RD. murray and zucker, whatever, sens dont need to trade murray away this badly that they give up 2 big pieces + branny.

Let me ask you a question..........do you think Brown and Brannstrom get Marino in a trade?

depends on how they value branny. probably not unless brown is 50% retained

What would be your thoughts if Zucker and Murray were gone from this?

Senators fans way overrate Connor Brown. A lot of them talk about his value, as if he is an elite first line forward.

It is considered blasphemy to point out that only one forward received a 1st round pick at the deadline, and that forward was a superstar, Claude Giroux. Copp got a conditional pick, but the conditions were difficult to meet (conference final).

On a decent team, Brown is a 10-15 goal 25-35 point defensive forward. GMs know he was used above his skill level because Ottawa has been rebuilding and does not have depth. In three seasons in Ottawa he has been a 50 point forward, yet his three previous seasons in Toronto he was a 31 point forward. GMs are going to take that into account. He will still be in demand because he has a very solid top 9 forward on a cap hit that is a bit cheaper than a UFA matchup winger, but he probably will only get a 2nd round pick and maybe a small plus in return.

I don't get the poster who says 7th or Brown as a criticism of the proposal, because Brown isn't even in the same ballpark as the 7th overall in terms of value. Taking all the money out of this trade, Sens would probably have to add a 2nd round pick to Brown and Brannstrom to get Marino. Marino is likely worth a late 1st, or two 2nds, similar to what Toews went for. That's just a guess though. He is a RHD, which are in short supply, and the market could be different than before.

The way I see it, the value to move up from 21 to 7 is much greater than even a high 2nd round pick. So that jump covers both the difference in value between Brown/Brannstrom and Marino, along with the compensation for Murray having 2 years left while Zucker only has 1 year left.

At 21, Dorion likely will get at least the player they have 19th on their list since every team has a different list, and teams go off the board. Dorion has claimed they don't see much difference between their 7th best prospect and their 19th best.

Conner brown or 7th. Not even close to same value. I agree with that. Do you know who he wants. You have claimed that they don’t feel much difference between 7-19. Are you suggesting the make a deal for Minnesota’s 19th.

Dorion has said something like the team sees the first tier ending at 6, and the second tier of prospects being between 7th and 19th. Basically that, they could pick 7th or 19th, and they will get a similar value of prospect.

With that said, it is possible that isn't true, or is a fabrication. He knew what his plan was going into the off season, so it does benefit him from an optics POV to condition fans and media to the idea that the Senators aren't losing a typical top 10 prospect by trading away the pick.

There is also the fact that if they see the first group as being 6 deep, there is a reasonable chance (but not a guarantee), that a player in the Senators top 6 falls to 7. It isn't uncommon for someone who was previously a consensus at a certain spot to fall like Puljujarvi or Zadina in years past, or for a team to go off the board and select a guy who publicly wasn't expected to go where he was selected (Seider, Boucher, etc).

There are now rumors from Garrioch that Murray will be attached to the pick. Dorion is backed against the wall, someone is going to take advantage of it. He needs to improve the team, but budget and money is an issue. If Murray is attached to the pick, it will be a player who isn't worth 7th overall but is still a top 6F or top 4D coming back because Ottawa gets most of the value from the other team taking Murray.

Colin White was bought out. Here are the savings. 10.5million https://www.dailyfaceoff.com/ottawa-senators-place-colin-white-on-waivers-for-purpose-of-buyout/