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Trade for Eichel Both Sides Win

Créé par: SensFanFromTO
Équipe: 2021-22 Sénateurs d'Ottawa
Date de création initiale: 24 juin 2021
Publié: 24 juin 2021
Mode - plafond salarial: Basique
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Before you comment just know that you’re wrong.
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1.
BUF
  1. Brännström, Erik
  2. Brown, Logan
  3. Greig, Ridly
  4. Thomson, Lassi
  5. Choix de 1e ronde en 2021 (OTT)
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Essentially 5 first round picks for franchise 1C. Ottawa fans probably say they overpay. Buffalo fans probably say not enough. Can both sides be wrong? …. Yes.
2.
OTT
SEA
  1. Daccord, Joey
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24 juin 2021 à 21 h 40
#26
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Quoting: Tjm220
Our “terrible GM“ hasn’t made a bad trade yet. Even the Taylor Hall trade where he had his hands tied by where Taylor Hall wanted to go, he still got his guy in return. And it’s not like we gave up any assets to get Taylor Hall in the first place. Buffalo holds all the cards, because they are under no obligation to trade Jack Eichel no matter what he wants. They also don’t have to send him to you if they decide to send him anywhere. They will take the best offer when and only when they decide it’s an offer they want.

I don’t know if you saw the supposed offer on the table for Jack from Columbus. Supposedly they were offering their first round pick, Texier, Merzlinkins, and Chinakov. That is a package miles better than the one you’re proposing here, and supposedly Kevyn Adams said it wasn’t enough. None of that may be true, but it does make me wonder if there’s any truth to it, what kind of offer is Kevyn Adams prepared to accept? Certainly never this one.


You traded a healthy Taylor Hall as a rental and retained half his salary. I mean, I'm glad you're happy with the return but, these are completely different trades. Eichel has 5 years and 50 million dollars remaining on his contract and is undergoing an anterior cervical discectomy with fusion that could have significant impact on his game going forward. If Adams is waiting for a better offer than what Columbus (supposedly) called with, it sure as hell shouldn't come from Ottawa. Too risky. Their rebuild will be fine without Eichel. Potentially even better.
25 juin 2021 à 0 h 48
#27
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Quoting: Tjm220
Our “terrible GM“ hasn’t made a bad trade yet. Even the Taylor Hall trade where he had his hands tied by where Taylor Hall wanted to go, he still got his guy in return. And it’s not like we gave up any assets to get Taylor Hall in the first place. Buffalo holds all the cards, because they are under no obligation to trade Jack Eichel no matter what he wants. They also don’t have to send him to you if they decide to send him anywhere. They will take the best offer when and only when they decide it’s an offer they want.

I don’t know if you saw the supposed offer on the table for Jack from Columbus. Supposedly they were offering their first round pick, Texier, Merzlinkins, and Chinakov. That is a package miles better than the one you’re proposing here, and supposedly Kevyn Adams said it wasn’t enough. None of that may be true, but it does make me wonder if there’s any truth to it, what kind of offer is Kevyn Adams prepared to accept? Certainly never this one.


I wouldnt trade this package for that Columbus one. Greig over Chinakov any day. Texier had a very down year but you can definitely still give him the edge over Brown with his injuries. Really not much difference between 5th and 10th this year but again a slight edge. So that leaves us with Brannstrom and Thomson for Merzlikins? Youre telling me that you'd rather have Merzlikins? Columbus is already likely losing a goalie in the expansion draft. If anything youre doing them a favour. He's also a UFA next season and I didnt even mention that goalies arent at the top of the list of problems in Buffalo. Brannstrom just started to hit this stride at the end of the year and Thomson was a 1st round pick less than two years ago and just played his first pro season in NA.

Miles better is a massive stretch. Texier and the CBJ 1st are marginally better than Brown and OTT's 1st. Greig > Chinakov. Brannstrom & Thomson > Merzlikins. I'm sure Ottawa could send you a goalie if you think thats some sort of dealbreaker but thats certainly not what I'd be looking for in an Eichel trade.

Speaking of Eichel and trades, Adams hands were tied in the Hall trade but #53 and Bjork isnt exactly anything to write home about when you retained half the salary on Eichel AND gave Lazar away. Also the team holds the leverage this season but as soon as that NTC kicks in next season the leverage shifts the same way it did with Hall and much like the Hall trade, at that point you'll have better offers available but will be handcuffed but the no move. The clock's ticking.
25 juin 2021 à 1 h 36
#28
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Modifié 25 juin 2021 à 1 h 48
Quoting: TheBoyDuddus
I wouldnt trade this package for that Columbus one. Greig over Chinakov any day. Texier had a very down year but you can definitely still give him the edge over Brown with his injuries. Really not much difference between 5th and 10th this year but again a slight edge. So that leaves us with Brannstrom and Thomson for Merzlikins? Youre telling me that you'd rather have Merzlikins? Columbus is already likely losing a goalie in the expansion draft. If anything youre doing them a favour. He's also a UFA next season and I didnt even mention that goalies arent at the top of the list of problems in Buffalo. Brannstrom just started to hit this stride at the end of the year and Thomson was a 1st round pick less than two years ago and just played his first pro season in NA.

Miles better is a massive stretch. Texier and the CBJ 1st are marginally better than Brown and OTT's 1st. Greig > Chinakov. Brannstrom & Thomson > Merzlikins. I'm sure Ottawa could send you a goalie if you think thats some sort of dealbreaker but thats certainly not what I'd be looking for in an Eichel trade.

Speaking of Eichel and trades, Adams hands were tied in the Hall trade but #53 and Bjork isnt exactly anything to write home about when you retained half the salary on Eichel AND gave Lazar away. Also the team holds the leverage this season but as soon as that NTC kicks in next season the leverage shifts the same way it did with Hall and much like the Hall trade, at that point you'll have better offers available but will be handcuffed but the no move. The clock's ticking.

You’re wrong even with the no movement clause kicking in next year. Buffalo doesn’t have to trade him no matter what he wants. Just because he can theoretically have say in where he goes doesn’t mean he can orchestrate a trade and force them to make it. The Sabres can also tell him to waive the no movement clause for this trade that we like or you’re not going anywhere. The situations are not the same, Taylor Hall could walk away to free agency leaving Buffalo with nothing if they did not make a trade. Jack Eichel has a five year contract, he’s not going anywhere unless buffalo agrees to send him somewhere.

To be perfectly honest I liked Lazar. But we made him what he was. Before signing in Buffalo he was seen as a career AHLer who might be a depth call up in case of injury but was never supposed to stick with the NHL team. That’s exactly what happened too. He got called up because of injuries but played well enough to stick around and earned a new contract. He’s not a young player anymore, and after next year he’s not exactly earning a raise anyway unless he sets the world on fire. Bjork is still young and has the same potential Lazar had as a first round pick. I liked what I saw from Bjork, and if we give him an opportunity that he wasn’t getting in Boston, much like we gave Lazar the opportunity he wasn’t getting elsewhere, he just might live up to that potential.

Also, Merzlinkins is exempt from the expansion draft and Columbus can protect Korpisalo if they choose, and why wouldn’t they? Their third string goaltender can be exposed in the expansion draft, and why would you bother taking him when you can have Jake Allen and Vanicek as your two goaltenders instead?

And finally, if you think goaltending isn’t a significant problem in Buffalo you’re not watching the games. Ullmark was good last season, but Carter Hutton has been so bad for the last two years that the team couldn’t rely on him. Anytime he played you could basically guarantee it was a loss no matter who they were playing. That resulted in them over playing Ullmark, likely tiring him out and leading to his injury problems. Hutton was below AHL caliber, so bad that every other goaltender Buffalo played this year had better numbers than him including Michael Houser who only played in the ECHL in the last two years. I like Merzlinkins as a number one goaltender, of course any team worth much has 2 goaltenders they can rely on when they need to. I would say any good team has two goalies they can play at least 30 games without concerns. Merzlinkins would be a good start to that. I would also think acquiring him as the big piece of the trade means the Sabres would intend to immediately talk contract extension with him. Lock him down as your guy for the next few years, let Luukonen learn behind him, and then eventually become the number two guy when Luukonen is ready to take the reins.
25 juin 2021 à 11 h 55
#29
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Don't wanna sound ridiculous here but IMO this is a similar situation to Erik Karlsson leaving Ottawa. Ottawa and Buffalo are rebuilding in both scenarios, the player wants to go, and both had the same roster issues with owner and player relationship issues. Ottawa got Tierney, Balcers, Demelo, Norris, a first (wasn't projected at the time to even be top 20) and a second round pick initially with another one if he signed a contract extension. So that's 2 roster players, 2 prospects and at the time a first and second round pick which weren't supposed to be high selections. the offered trade in this thread is definitely along those lines but even at the time of the Karlsson trade IMO Ottawa was getting less then they could have got. My offer would probably be built around Thomson, Pinto or Greig and Brannstrom exactly how the author here has it. throw in that top 10 pick and I do believe you have the makings of something here
25 juin 2021 à 12 h 24
#30
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Quoting: Tjm220
You’re wrong even with the no movement clause kicking in next year. Buffalo doesn’t have to trade him no matter what he wants. Just because he can theoretically have say in where he goes doesn’t mean he can orchestrate a trade and force them to make it. The Sabres can also tell him to waive the no movement clause for this trade that we like or you’re not going anywhere. The situations are not the same, Taylor Hall could walk away to free agency leaving Buffalo with nothing if they did not make a trade. Jack Eichel has a five year contract, he’s not going anywhere unless buffalo agrees to send him somewhere.

To be perfectly honest I liked Lazar. But we made him what he was. Before signing in Buffalo he was seen as a career AHLer who might be a depth call up in case of injury but was never supposed to stick with the NHL team. That’s exactly what happened too. He got called up because of injuries but played well enough to stick around and earned a new contract. He’s not a young player anymore, and after next year he’s not exactly earning a raise anyway unless he sets the world on fire. Bjork is still young and has the same potential Lazar had as a first round pick. I liked what I saw from Bjork, and if we give him an opportunity that he wasn’t getting in Boston, much like we gave Lazar the opportunity he wasn’t getting elsewhere, he just might live up to that potential.

Also, Merzlinkins is exempt from the expansion draft and Columbus can protect Korpisalo if they choose, and why wouldn’t they? Their third string goaltender can be exposed in the expansion draft, and why would you bother taking him when you can have Jake Allen and Vanicek as your two goaltenders instead?

And finally, if you think goaltending isn’t a significant problem in Buffalo you’re not watching the games. Ullmark was good last season, but Carter Hutton has been so bad for the last two years that the team couldn’t rely on him. Anytime he played you could basically guarantee it was a loss no matter who they were playing. That resulted in them over playing Ullmark, likely tiring him out and leading to his injury problems. Hutton was below AHL caliber, so bad that every other goaltender Buffalo played this year had better numbers than him including Michael Houser who only played in the ECHL in the last two years. I like Merzlinkins as a number one goaltender, of course any team worth much has 2 goaltenders they can rely on when they need to. I would say any good team has two goalies they can play at least 30 games without concerns. Merzlinkins would be a good start to that. I would also think acquiring him as the big piece of the trade means the Sabres would intend to immediately talk contract extension with him. Lock him down as your guy for the next few years, let Luukonen learn behind him, and then eventually become the number two guy when Luukonen is ready to take the reins.


They can "tell" him to waive the nmc or he's not going anywhere? Just like they did with Hall right? Youre right though the situations arent the same. Unlike with Hall, choosing not to trade Eichel results in your team being the biggest side show in the league while simultaneously letting a cancer infect your locker room. Not trading him will do you more harm than good. But then again the nmc argument is irrelevant because hes getting traded before the draft anyway.

Genuinely didn't know he was exempt. Just knew he was closer to 30 than 20 so I thought he met the threshold of eligibility. However my point still stands about them losing a goalie. You'd be doing them a favor regardless because theyd just stay protecting Korpi and grab a backup in free agency.

Ullmark was great. Luukonen is one of the best goalie prospects in the world. Hutton was clearly a mistake but I would think that could be addressed in free agency instead of letting it take up space in an Eichel trade. I guess it all depends on what you think the teams most pressing need is. I still think the Ottawa offer is valid but I can understand you putting more of an emphasis on goaltending.
25 juin 2021 à 16 h 58
#31
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Quoting: TheBoyDuddus
They can "tell" him to waive the nmc or he's not going anywhere? Just like they did with Hall right? Youre right though the situations arent the same. Unlike with Hall, choosing not to trade Eichel results in your team being the biggest side show in the league while simultaneously letting a cancer infect your locker room. Not trading him will do you more harm than good. But then again the nmc argument is irrelevant because hes getting traded before the draft anyway.

Genuinely didn't know he was exempt. Just knew he was closer to 30 than 20 so I thought he met the threshold of eligibility. However my point still stands about them losing a goalie. You'd be doing them a favor regardless because theyd just stay protecting Korpi and grab a backup in free agency.

Ullmark was great. Luukonen is one of the best goalie prospects in the world. Hutton was clearly a mistake but I would think that could be addressed in free agency instead of letting it take up space in an Eichel trade. I guess it all depends on what you think the teams most pressing need is. I still think the Ottawa offer is valid but I can understand you putting more of an emphasis on goaltending.


My expectation is that if Kevyn Adams does not get the offer he wants before the season starts Jack Eichel doesn’t get traded. It’s too important to make sure that you get exactly what you want in a trade that is one of the most significant in the franchise history. His job very much hinges on how well he makes this move if he even does.

I say if because let’s say Buffalo doesn’t get the offer they want before the season starts, which I think is rather likely. It would make the most sense for Jack Eichel to get healthy, return to play and prove that he is still in the elite center we know he is. Jack’s motivation could be playing as well as possible so as to drum up more interest from other teams, and teams being more willing to meet Buffalo’s asking price. However, if the team is actually competitive and on the track to make the playoffs maybe Jack changes his mind and doesn’t want to leave. That might sound like a pipe dream, and it probably is. But who knows? Jack could absolutely love the coach Buffalo hires, and for once some of the moves they make could actually pay off. If Sam Reinhart demands to be traded because he refuses to sign a long-term deal it’s at least possible the pieces they receive in return work out immediately. Success breeds contentment, and in the last decade Buffalo really hasn’t had any success. Just a little bit, the light at the end of the tunnel if you will could make all the difference.
25 juin 2021 à 22 h 34
#32
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Quoting: Tjm220
My expectation is that if Kevyn Adams does not get the offer he wants before the season starts Jack Eichel doesn’t get traded. It’s too important to make sure that you get exactly what you want in a trade that is one of the most significant in the franchise history. His job very much hinges on how well he makes this move if he even does.

I say if because let’s say Buffalo doesn’t get the offer they want before the season starts, which I think is rather likely. It would make the most sense for Jack Eichel to get healthy, return to play and prove that he is still in the elite center we know he is. Jack’s motivation could be playing as well as possible so as to drum up more interest from other teams, and teams being more willing to meet Buffalo’s asking price. However, if the team is actually competitive and on the track to make the playoffs maybe Jack changes his mind and doesn’t want to leave. That might sound like a pipe dream, and it probably is. But who knows? Jack could absolutely love the coach Buffalo hires, and for once some of the moves they make could actually pay off. If Sam Reinhart demands to be traded because he refuses to sign a long-term deal it’s at least possible the pieces they receive in return work out immediately. Success breeds contentment, and in the last decade Buffalo really hasn’t had any success. Just a little bit, the light at the end of the tunnel if you will could make all the difference.


I’m hearing everything you’re saying. Time will talk when the trade actually goes through. I know I’ve heard from a lot of “experts” that Buffalo wants to get it done before the draft because they want picks, which is fair. Also think it’s important to note that management and ownership make internal deadlines.

I do think it’s pipe dream that he ends up content and decides to stay, the damage is likely done at this point. But even with Reinhart, the problem is that you’re not likely to get anything back that equals the impact that he has on the game. I know I was defending the Ottawa offer for Eichel but I’d much rather them make an offer for Reinhart. I think something around the 10th overall pick this year could be realistic but if that’s one of the main pieces of the deal then that’s definitely not helping you be competitive this year.
 
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