You are drastically overpaying for both pieces. You screw the team long term with these trades

Failing to see how the gaudreau trade is an overpay. Patrick would never recover from his migraines in Calgary and konecny is a 50ish point 2nd liner who had one good year where he barely eclipsed the worst points pace johnny’s ever put up (read: his ceiling is gaudreau’s floor). I still don’t understand why people on this site cling to the idea that they’re close to one for one, gaudreau is significantly better.

Konecny is secured on a solid contract for 5 more years. This was a down year. The year before was a high year. It's logical to think he will be somewhere in between usually. Patrick is a risk piece, but he still carries the value of at least a 2nd.

Is this worth it for one year of JG? especially when the team isn't certain to be a contender? If this experiment fails, the team is screwed. Even if the pure value is right, it's not the right type of value. For instance, do the sens move Batherson and Brown for one year of JG? Both teams are in the same place and both pieces equate in similar value. It just doesn't make sense.

I’m not sure it’s fair to say that Konecny is in between this year and last year, as that would be his 2nd highest point total. If anything, this year (55 point pace) is a reasonable expectation, as it’s between what he got from 2017-19 and his 19-20 career year. The term is nice, but Johnny’s willing to resign in Calgary, and in the minds of everyone who thinks he wants to go to philly he’d be willing to resign there so that doesn’t affect the value of the trade at all. Patrick would be a nice piece to have, and Calgary might be interested in him as a reclamation project in theory, but he doesn’t hold much value period right now (2nd or 3rd, which doesn’t make up for the difference in skill level at all), and Calgary isn’t the place for him to recover his career (constant weather changes, particularly chinooks, would worsen his migraine issues). Also Ottawa and Philly are not in the same place at all. The average age of Philly’s top 4 scorers + Hayes is 31 and the average cost is 7mil apiece (even with Couturier’s steal of a contract). The average age of Ottawa’s top line + Stutzle/Pinto is 21 and 3 of those guys are still on an ELC next year.

Nobody on this website knows who wants to sign where. We have no clue what JG wants, so for safety I assume the worst case - that he's a one year rental. Does PHI pay this price for a one year rental? Heck no. Most of the Flyers had a down year, and Konecny was definitely one of those on the eye test. This year shouldn't be an indication of what he usually is.

You skewed my reference to ottawa. I am talking about both teams missing the playoffs and looking to take steps forward. Batherson is essentially the same thing as Konency, especially given it seems like he will be signing a comparable contract. Given that both teams just missed the playoffs, it doesn't make sense to move a young piece on a nice contract for a one year rental. If PHI wants JG, this is not the best way about it.

The reasoning that Johnny desperately wants to return to Philly or New Jersey is generally the justification for this trade, so sorry for jumping to a conclusion there I guess. But Johnny in general doesn’t seem like the kind of guy to raise a big fuss as long as he’s not presented with an insulting offer. I’m still hesitant to say Konecny will consistently be at a higher level (60pt expectation? 65?) but if we’re treating 19-20 as his peak, that’s still not much higher than Johnny’s floor, which he reaches even in his down years with ease, and his ceiling is obviously 100 points. This would be like the Fiala/Granlund trade, only Gaudreau is significantly better than Granlund ever was.

I suppose that evaluation is fair on the surface in that they’re looking to take a step forward, but my point was that Philly is more advanced in terms of age, 5 of their 7 best forwards (regardless of how you rank Farabee/Konecny against them) average out to be on the wrong side of 30, so a rental is an option for Philly, as they think they’re good, have recent 2nd round experience, should be well within their window as long as Hart bounces back, and have a need to go for it soon, before those guys age out. Ottawa is probably 1.5-2 years away from pursuing a big fish rental as they are still young and developing with no playoff experience.

edit: I actually did some calculations, I’d be willing to call Konecny a 60pt guy, as the average of his last 3 years is 24 goals and 60 points per 82 games, and that’s a way I think is pretty accurate for determining expectations for a guy moving forward. That’s still below Gaudreau’s floor though. Maybe he grows a little bit, but at 24 he’s probably pretty close to what he’ll be, I don’t see him suddenly becoming a reliable 75 point guy or anything.

Ultimately all I'm trying to say is that there are better ways about going at JG that still make sense. Starting with this year's first, Foerster and maybe a roster replacement like Patrick/Lindblom. Fair value doesn't always mean its the best way about the deal. Batherson and Brown might be a fair price for JG, but does it really make sense when there are more expendable prospects and pieces in the system?

Nashville is likely more open to a NHL ready return, so instead of drastically overpaying for Ellis, both of these can be reworked into something fair but that makes more sense.