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BigShoots

Big Shoots
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17 sept. 2020
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Canucks de Vancouver
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Forum: Armchair-GMHier à 13 h 29
Sujet: Zegras
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>The_Rocket</b></div><div>For stats, I’m gunna ask you to look at scoring rates instead of season totals. Boeser dealt with injury issues early in his career and played through 2 shortened seasons, so his season totals are deflated due to not having played many full 82 game seasons. His career points per game is 0.80, which is 65 points in and 82 games season. His career goals per game is 0.37 which is over 30 goals per season. This means Boeser’s career numbers (479 game sample) are better than zegras’s best ever season. You’re being dishonest in your evaluation which just makes you look bad.

The main disagreement we have is the idea that Zegras ever reaches his potential. The guy has skills for days but I think he’s going to have a very difficult ever becoming a top of the line-up contributor, and instead he will cap out at a high end playmaker that needs favourable matchups in order to produce.

You can live your fantasy world where Zegras out produces Boeser next year. Is possible, but I probable. I’d much rather bank on the sure thing</div></div>

This is getting a bit tedious but just look at the only two full seasons Zegras has played. 67 point pace and 65 points in 82. How is that not comparable!!!! Even if you want to use his whole career he's at 60 points per 82. Now lets look at linemates.

Well he's already a top of lineup contributor so thats good if that all you're hoping for. He's been 2nd in points and lead his team in points in his only two full seasons. Pretty sure those matchups aren't gonna be favourable for a 1st line leading scorer.

The sure thing is Zegras, Boeser shot 5% above his career average this yr. A regression is almost certainly coming. I know it's hard to imagine your fav player getting less productive when it's not age related but just think of Kuzmenko for the case in point. Boeser is a much better all around player than Kuzmenko so that not the analogy I am making, I am saying Kuzmenko shot an unsustainably high shooting % and everyone penciled him in for that this yr and we all know what ended up happening.

If Boeser just shoots his career average he gets 26 goals. That'd be 59 points. Now god forbid he shot below average like the last couple yrs. In that case you're paying 8 mil (probably what he gets?) for 20 goals 50 points with most of his absolute prime already done.
Forum: Armchair-GMmer. à 20 h 21
Sujet: Zegras
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>The_Rocket</b></div><div>to address the bolded:

i pointed out the stats because you claimed Zegras has reached a similar offensive ceiling. obviously, he hasnt. he has the potential to, but so far he has greatly underformed to boeser, even when you consider similar aged seasons.

regarding contracts, again you dont even save a million dollars next year so barely savings, and zegras still needs to be re-upped in 2 years. if your concerned about what boeser will get as a ufa, why are you not concerned about what zegras will get on his next contract? RFAs that are one year from free agency have a lot of leverage (see hronek...). youre gambling that zegras greatly improves in vancouver, but if he does then you have to pay him anyways. if he doesnt, then youre worse off than keeping boeser

if zegras is at his lowest value and boeser is at his highest, why is vancouver adding?

for play driving, zegras has good shot contributions with smart passes and is able to find space with the puck. his off puck play leaves a lot to be desired, poor along the walls and in corners, and below average in generating shots from high danger areas.

boeser, comparably, wins a higher percentage of battles on the wall, does excellent in finding open space in the o-zone, and lives in the net front. boeser isnt the flashiest puck carrier, doesnt create a lot of time for his team mates, and isnt the best skater.

essentially, you are trading away a high end goal scorer that compliments a pass first centre and can play matchup minutes, and you are getting a puck dominant centre that plays softer matchups and defers to the pass more often.

this is a huge change, and its tough to argue that zegras's style of play will be better on the canucks than boeser is.

overall, trading for a worse player who hasnt ever hit their potential and whose style of play is likely a worse fit for van simply to save a million buck and kick the contract negotiation one year down the road while your in the middle of a contention window is simply bad business.</div></div>

Again we both have access to hockeydb. Boeser has one season of 60+ points, which was this yr off the back of unsustainably high shooting %. Zegras has 2. Boeser's career high 73 points, Zegras 65. How are you arguing these aren't similar?

Ok so you save 1 million almost which is good in the first yr. probably more like 2+ the 2nd. And then you have team control on a younger player who you can then sign for more of his prime yrs. How is that not so much better. You're poo pooing like 3 more than subtle advantages that add up.

Because Zegras has the upside and everything else. In a yrs time, I wouldn't at all be surprised if Zegras is untouchable.

Zegras and Pettersson would run wild. Zegras and Miller too. You always want playmakers. It's why we traded Horvat and got better. He was just a shooter. Boeser is just a shooter too. I get he battles and is decent defensively but he is one dimensional. Players like Zegras make their linemates better. Players like Boeser rely on their linemates to drive the play.

I'd happily bet that Zegras will outproduce Boeser this yr. He definitely has had his issues defensively, as most young players do, the potential upside would just be too tantalizing to pass up.
Forum: Armchair-GMmer. à 18 h 59
Sujet: Zegras
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>The_Rocket</b></div><div>zegras career high is 23 goals in 71 games. career pace is 21 goals per 82 games

boeser career high is 40 goals. career pace is 31 goals per 82 games.

less than a million in savings, and only one extra year before getting re-upped.

if youre argument to trade boeser is that he doesnt drive play, you are going to be very very disappointed with zegras.</div></div>

I can look at the stats also. Just go over a column and report back. One is a UFA, one has an extra yr, cheaper and then is still under team control.

The argument is that he is he is younger, cheaper, under team control for longer, at a low point in his value compared to high point for Boeser, can play multiple positions, has way more upside.

Zegras is one of the better play drivers in the entire league. Guy is magic with the puck. That comment is literally so bad I need to you to explain yourself.
Forum: Armchair-GM11 juin à 0 h 34
Sujet: RHD trade targets
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>mokumboi</b></div><div>Heh. Where was Vancouver last spring? Or Winnipeg? Lots can change across seasons. Any way you slice it, most teams won't trade impact players to a rival.

And frankly, aside from Willander, who is presumably not available, Vancouver doesn't really have the ammo to trade for huge targets right now anyway.</div></div>

We at least had a base of young high end talent. Calgary needs to build that. And they lost obv like 3-4 key pieces last season.

I don't see it as a rivalry at this point. Not even saying the Canucks are that good. We're prob fighting for a playoff spot kinda team next yr. I just don't see how Calgary improves. I'd be open to moving off of long term deals and rebuilding. Talks of a Markstrom trade too.

That is true Canucks would have a tough time making a fair offer.