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18 mar 2018
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Blues de St-Louis
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Hurricanes de la Caroline
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Forum: Armchair-GM 5 fév à 13 h 58
Forum: Armchair-GM 5 fév à 13 h 52
Sujet: Blues beef up the back end
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>mytduxfan</b></div><div>If Yakupov put up 95 pts consistently across multiple seasons, even playing with McDavid, yes, I would class him as a good player. What’s weird about that? So you think points have different values or a goal from a “bad advanced stats player” is worth less than one with “good advanced stats”. A goals a goal. I want goal scorers on my team that actually produced 50 goals, not some kid who had great g/60 numbers, but never hit 50 because he didn’t get enough minutes or was injured or [insert excuse] or [insert excuse] or [insert excuse].



The problem is that you’re assuming I judge a player on one season like you though, which I don’t. Players have ups and downs in their careers, which makes it important to consider multiple seasons. I am not trying to oversimplify the game the way you are.</div></div>

We are talking about this year, and considering who Werenski had last year. This is the year that shows why he was overrated bud, but that's a classic comment "I use multiple years because he had more quality last year so i'm not wrong" why not look at this for a change. Dunn's teammate is f*ckin Bortuzzo, you know who Werenski linemate is f*ckin Seth Jones. Now how come is Dunn playing top lines and playing better with a worse linemate. Obviously Werenski is going to have more points because guess what he has Seth Jones on his line.
Forum: Armchair-GM 5 fév à 13 h 49
Sujet: Blues beef up the back end
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>mytduxfan</b></div><div>None of those charts adjust for quality of possession/opposition. Dunn sits behind Gunnarsson and Boumeester in the depth chart and faces far weaker competition that Werenski, who is 1st pairing. Also, STL has a better forward corp than CLB, which helps. You’re also taking a 1 seasons sample size, when both Werenski and Dunn have been in the NHL longer than that.

I think advanced stats are useful, but you’re just abusing them to prove something that isn’t categorically wrong. If you’d take Dunn over Werenski, fine. That’s you’re decision. I disagree and I’m sure 99% of NHL fans would take Werenski over Dunn. You’re are of course welcome to your opinion though, based on whatever numbers you wish use.</div></div>

Talking about CF% when Dunn has a 54.3, and Werenski has a 47.8 lmao. You clearly have no understanding of hockey. Go watch the Angels play or something because you are now just being completely ignorant because you don't want to be wrong.
Forum: Armchair-GM 5 fév à 13 h 45
Sujet: Blues beef up the back end
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>mytduxfan</b></div><div>None of those charts adjust for quality of possession/opposition. Dunn sits behind Gunnarsson and Boumeester in the depth chart and faces far weaker competition that Werenski, who is 1st pairing. Also, STL has a better forward corp than CLB, which helps. You’re also taking a 1 seasons sample size, when both Werenski and Dunn have been in the NHL longer than that.

I think advanced stats are useful, but you’re just abusing them to prove something that isn’t categorically wrong. If you’d take Dunn over Werenski, fine. That’s you’re decision. I disagree and I’m sure 99% of NHL fans would take Werenski over Dunn. You’re are of course welcome to your opinion though, based on whatever numbers you wish use.</div></div>

you want to know why he sits behind them? Because if you put Pietrangelo and Dunn together its a hot mess of only Offensive Defenseman. Jay Bouwmeester is only good with Parayko because Parayko can pick him up. Until you can actually understand what the Blues are doing go try to win a cup losing 16-20 games in a row again.
Forum: Armchair-GM 5 fév à 13 h 38
Sujet: Blues beef up the back end
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>mytduxfan</b></div><div>I appreciate what you’re saying, but, at the end of the day, actual points trumps projected points. If it was close, I’d listen to the advanced stats, but it’s not close. You can say that Werenski has more minutes, but you’re assuming that Dunn would score more if given more minutes. Point production doesn’t increase linearly with TOI. Higher TOI = harder minutes, against tougher opponents, when you’re more fatigued. What’s the quality of Werenski’s minutes vs. Dunn? Moreover, you can say that Werenski gets more PP time than Dunn, but he also plays over 2 mins of PK time per game, whereas Dunn plays 0 mins. You going to consider that and how those extra minutes could drain Werenski’s energy so that he’s less effective offensively 5-on-5. No, of course not.

Again, i understand your position, but, if we’re going to play that game I have a bunch of charts that show Yamamoto is a better player than Draisaitl because p/60 says so say. If the point totals were even remotely close, I’d consider the advanced stats, but they’re not. Werenski is categorically a better player and no advanced stat chart will change that.



Lol... so goals and point totals are just for dumbies. “What’s the score dad? Forget the score, thats for simple people. Least check out CF%... because that’s how games are won and lost, right?”.

Vince Dunn &gt; Zach Werenski... hahahah... what a load of nonsense. Still waiting for that useless chart brah!</div></div>

Apparently Perron is better than Couturier because Perron has 53 Points and 20 Goals whereas Couturier has 46 points and 13 Goals. BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAAAAAA Cya Genius.
Forum: Armchair-GM 5 fév à 13 h 32
Sujet: Blues beef up the back end
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>mytduxfan</b></div><div>I appreciate what you’re saying, but, at the end of the day, actual points trumps projected points. If it was close, I’d listen to the advanced stats, but it’s not close. You can say that Werenski has more minutes, but you’re assuming that Dunn would score more if given more minutes. Point production doesn’t increase linearly with TOI. Higher TOI = harder minutes, against tougher opponents, when you’re more fatigued. What’s the quality of Werenski’s minutes vs. Dunn? Moreover, you can say that Werenski gets more PP time than Dunn, but he also plays over 2 mins of PK time per game, whereas Dunn plays 0 mins. You going to consider that and how those extra minutes could drain Werenski’s energy so that he’s less effective offensively 5-on-5. No, of course not.

Again, i understand your position, but, if we’re going to play that game I have a bunch of charts that show Yamamoto is a better player than Draisaitl because p/60 says so say. If the point totals were even remotely close, I’d consider the advanced stats, but they’re not. Werenski is categorically a better player and no advanced stat chart will change that.



Lol... so goals and point totals are just for dumbies. “What’s the score dad? Forget the score, thats for simple people. Least check out CF%... because that’s how games are won and lost, right?”.

Vince Dunn &gt; Zach Werenski... hahahah... what a load of nonsense. Still waiting for that useless chart brah!</div></div>

Team game so let's say Yakupov plays with McDavid he gets 95 points and 80 of them are assists to McDavid. By your logic Yakupov is a Top 10 Forward in the League because of points. Because Points. Good luck with telling anyone that bud lmao. I can't even argue with you anymore you are so dumb. Seth Jones does that for Werenski bud. Anderson does that for Werenski bud. Almost every single top 6 forward in Columbus does that for Werenski bud. But nvm I will remember when some player goes from 5 points to 80 because he is now with McDavid and now he is a Top 10 Forward because of Points. Have fun bud.
Forum: Armchair-GM 5 fév à 13 h 18
Sujet: Blues beef up the back end
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>mytduxfan</b></div><div>Except he is and that’s proven by his numbers. The fact you have get some 5v5, goals/60, on high danger opportunities, on a sunny day on a Tuesday just shows how much you’re reaching. Dunn has less points per game than Werenski. Therefore, Werenski is better. Splitting hairs is only useful when it’s close, but it’s not close. Werenski is better than Dunn and no cherry-picked chart is going to change that.</div></div>

<img class="for_img" src="https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/617523534175928321/674680108665143336/ycAAACgn4SGhhIEgS9QBACgQwJmHwAAAAAAgF7AtgVAAAAAAAAAP4IwOwDAAAAAADQC8DXALLxAAAALUlEQVTsAwAAAAAA0AvA7A.png?width=481&amp;height=397" alt="ycAAACgn4SGhhIEgS9QBACgQwJmHwAAAAAAgF7AtgVAAAAAAAAAP4IwOwDAAAAAADQC8DXALLxAAAALUlEQVTsAwAAAAAA0AvA7A.png?width=481&amp;height=397">

Like I said he might have a better shot, but that certainly isn't translating to anywhere else on the offense.
Forum: Armchair-GM 5 fév à 13 h 11
Sujet: Blues beef up the back end
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>mytduxfan</b></div><div>Except he is and that’s proven by his numbers. The fact you have get some 5v5, goals/60, on high danger opportunities, on a sunny day on a Tuesday just shows how much you’re reaching. Dunn has less points per game than Werenski. Therefore, Werenski is better. Splitting hairs is only useful when it’s close, but it’s not close. Werenski is better than Dunn and no cherry-picked chart is going to change that.</div></div>

and when it comes to defense its much of the same thing. Werenski doesn't make an offensive threat more than Dunn does. He has a better shot sure, but being more effective. Dunn takes the cake.

Defensively
<img class="for_img" src="https://www.hockeyviz.com/fixedImg/teamShotLocDefWi/1920/CBJ/werenza97" alt="werenza97">

<img class="for_img" src="https://www.hockeyviz.com/fixedImg/teamShotLocDefWo/1920/CBJ/werenza97" alt="werenza97">

<img class="for_img" src="https://www.hockeyviz.com/fixedImg/teamShotLocDefWi/1920/STL/dunnxvi96" alt="dunnxvi96">
Forum: Armchair-GM 5 fév à 13 h 09
Sujet: Blues beef up the back end
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>mytduxfan</b></div><div>Except he is and that’s proven by his numbers. The fact you have get some 5v5, goals/60, on high danger opportunities, on a sunny day on a Tuesday just shows how much you’re reaching. Dunn has less points per game than Werenski. Therefore, Werenski is better. Splitting hairs is only useful when it’s close, but it’s not close. Werenski is better than Dunn and no cherry-picked chart is going to change that.</div></div>

<img class="for_img" src="https://www.hockeyviz.com/fixedImg/teamShotLocOffWi/1920/STL/dunnxvi96" alt="dunnxvi96">

<img class="for_img" src="https://www.hockeyviz.com/fixedImg/teamShotLocOffWoThumb/1920/STL/dunnxvi96" alt="dunnxvi96">

<img class="for_img" src="https://www.hockeyviz.com/fixedImg/teamShotLocOffWi/1920/CBJ/werenza97" alt="werenza97">

<img class="for_img" src="https://www.hockeyviz.com/fixedImg/teamShotLocOffWo/1920/CBJ/werenza97" alt="werenza97">
Forum: Armchair-GM 5 fév à 13 h 06
Sujet: Blues beef up the back end
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>mytduxfan</b></div><div>Not really when their advanced stats are largely same and we’re talking about offensive D-men. If you’re comparing Werenski vs Parayako, then you’re right. However, here we are talking about two players who excel on offence and so comparing goals and points totals is absolutely a valid means of assessing their abilities as hockey players.</div></div>

<img class="for_img" src="https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/617523534175928321/674489006893039626/APQZRFQqFQKBTKJwH7Q1eAQqFQKBQKhfJPQJd9FAqFQqFQKJ8EdNlHoVAoFAqF8klAl30UCoVCoVAonwR02UehUCgUCoXySUCXfR.png?width=481&amp;height=397" alt="APQZRFQqFQKBTKJwH7Q1eAQqFQKBQKhfJPQJd9FAqFQqFQKJ8EdNlHoVAoFAqF8klAl30UCoVCoVAonwR02UehUCgUCoXySUCXfR.png?width=481&amp;height=397">

<img class="for_img" src="https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/617523534175928321/674488949925871641/OAEAAADgjyEyMpKiKHyAIgAAfwBg9gEAAAAAAOgFnAtAAAAAAAAAPBHAGYfAAAAAACAXgBmHwAAAAAAgF4AZh8AAAAAAIBeAGYfA.png?width=481&amp;height=397" alt="OAEAAADgjyEyMpKiKHyAIgAAfwBg9gEAAAAAAOgFnAtAAAAAAAAAPBHAGYfAAAAAACAXgBmHwAAAAAAgF4AZh8AAAAAAIBeAGYfA.png?width=481&amp;height=397">

Signiifcantly wrong when looking at the Charts. Werenski is a powerplay specialist.
Forum: Armchair-GM 5 fév à 0 h 27
Sujet: Blues beef up the back end
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Ajp_18</b></div><div>You aren’t even close on the Columbus trade. Dunn would need to be going the other way for Werenski not the pile of meh you’re sending. Quality over quantity.</div></div>

<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>mytduxfan</b></div><div>Fine. I’m not even a CLB fan. You keep your guys and CLB can keep theirs. Faulk is more than a few tiers below Werenski. Allen is awful and you know it. Super inconsistent and crumbles during the playoffs. Kostin is ok, but he doesn’t make up for the shortfall in value. The rest are just throw-ins.

It’s funny how Dunn&gt;Werenski, but the kid is older, scored less points, and is more sheltered. Werenski is on pace for 20+ goals this season as a D-man. He’s an extremely talented, albeit sheltered, individual and still developing. Dunn is at least a couple tiers below Werenski. Take the homer glasses off and stop being so offended. It’s ok if opposing teams have better players than you.

More importantly though, where is the consideration of CLB’s needs? Why would CLB, a team that currently sits in a playoff spot move their 2nd best D-man in a quality for quantity deal? Makes no sense.</div></div>

<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>mytduxfan</b></div><div>Fine. I’m not even a CLB fan. You keep your guys and CLB can keep theirs. Faulk is more than a few tiers below Werenski. Allen is awful and you know it. Super inconsistent and crumbles during the playoffs. Kostin is ok, but he doesn’t make up for the shortfall in value. The rest are just throw-ins.

It’s funny how Dunn&gt;Werenski, but the kid is older, scored less points, and is more sheltered. Werenski is on pace for 20+ goals this season as a D-man. He’s an extremely talented, albeit sheltered, individual and still developing. Dunn is at least a couple tiers below Werenski. Take the homer glasses off and stop being so offended. It’s ok if opposing teams have better players than you.

More importantly though, where is the consideration of CLB’s needs? Why would CLB, a team that currently sits in a playoff spot move their 2nd best D-man in a quality for quantity deal? Makes no sense.</div></div>

I don't want to hear BS.
Forum: Armchair-GM 4 fév à 23 h 10
Sujet: Blues beef up the back end
<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>Ajp_18</b></div><div>You aren’t even close on the Columbus trade. Dunn would need to be going the other way for Werenski not the pile of meh you’re sending. Quality over quantity.</div></div>

<div class="quote"><div class="quote_t">Quoting: <b>mytduxfan</b></div><div>Lol... is this a joke. Why would CLB, a team vying for a playoff spot, give up their young D-men? Especially for a whole pile of “nothing special”</div></div>


First of all you both are hilariously biased. Second this is bad from both points of view. Dunn&gt;Werenski so that’s a huge no. Faulk is more in the Werenski skill range even tho being the elder. Kostin is a Top Prospect, Allen has a .925 Sv Pct this year. Perunovich and Walman both have Top 4 Upside. Korpisalo is like useless for us, and tbh I don’t want Werenski to be honest. Wouldnt want him. I like having Dunn, and Werenski isn’t worth him with what Dunn brings to the table for us.