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50Leafs 2023 2024 Season Discussion Part 5 - TDL additions (Go Big or Go Small)

28 févr. à 23 h 13
#201
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Modifié 28 févr. à 23 h 41
Quoting: NorthernLeafsFan05
Idk how people have become so disillusioned about Peeke. How can you honestly tell me you'd pay for LYUBUSHKIN, but you won't even take Peeke unless you're getting assets back. Everything you think Boosh does is what Peeke does. He's physical, defensively sound, blocks shots, is good at clearing the crease, and has term for a reasonable amount of money. He is an excellent buy low candidate


Lybushkin cheap and u can walk away from if it dont work and to pkg him with an almost 30+ goal scorer in Vatano for 1.5 seasons for 1st + 4th or even a lower pick like a 5th thats fine

Peeke = 2.75m for 3 more seasons hell nah

Guy is Bad. At least we know Rielly can play with Lybushkin and have good enough results. Peeke should be in the AHL with how hes been these past 2 seasons heck this year CBJ be playing him 15 mins from his old 21mins and he still bad

25 years old sure but man its just ew ew ew

The eye test dont support him, the stats dont support him, he would just be a waste of cap space


If he was the last option out there would rather just stay put and waste a 70 goal Matthews season then spend a dime on him. Only way I take him is if CBJ ask for FC eat 50% and give us a nice prospect or two
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28 févr. à 23 h 18
#202
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Quoting: aadoyle
Lybushkin cheap and u can walk away from if it dont work again. To get him and a 20 + goal scorer in Vatano for 1.5 seasons for 1st + 4th or even a lower pick like a 5th thats fine

Peeke = 2.75m for 3 more seasons hell nah

Guy is Bad. At least we know Rielly can play with Lybushkin. Peeke should be in the AHL with how hes been these past 2 seasons heck this year CBJ be playing him 15 mins from his old 21mins and he still bad

25 years old sure but man its just ew ew ew

The eye test dont support him, the stats dont support him, he would just be a waste of cap space


If he was the last option out there would rather just stay put and waste a 70 goal Matthews season then spend a dime on him. Only way I take him is if CBJ ask for FC eat 50% and give us a nice prospect or two


To further and yes this was back in Dec but still hell nah

GBKyWhDXIAAzF9M?format=jpg&name=medium

https://twitter.com/ilikethejackets/status/1734646003150537095/photo/2
28 févr. à 23 h 28
#203
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Friend actually suggested some not bad idea's for packaged trades

Fabbro + Novak or TVR + Dowd

Honestly not bad to consider either
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29 févr. à 0 h 9
#204
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Quoting: aadoyle
Friend actually suggested some not bad idea's for packaged trades

Fabbro + Novak or TVR + Dowd

Honestly not bad to consider either


Fabbro + Novak is 100x better than TVR and Dowd, but Nashville isnt selling
29 févr. à 0 h 11
#205
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Modifié 29 févr. à 0 h 18
Quoting: NorthernLeafsFan05
Fabbro + Novak is 100x better than TVR and Dowd, but Nashville isnt selling


They be fools once again

Should sell like they did last year heck even PHI in its position be eyeing potential sell offs.

As Novak, Carrier, etc walking for nothing aint a good idea, and they got to many Dman where Fabbro has been a HS 13 times

I know they won 6 in a row but meh sell the rentals as they be middle of ground no mans land team
29 févr. à 1 h 32
#206
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Quoting: aadoyle
Just spitballing imagine a 2 step plan to improve the blue line like this

1. Trade for Rasmus Andersson or Adam Larsson (in this case would need it to be Andersson and you will see why).

Rielly-Liligren (fill in temporary could probs get the job done)
Brodie-Andersson
Benoit-McCabe

Then in the summer and this is where step II comes in go get either Roy or Demelo this FA.

Rielly-Demelo/Roy
McCabe-Andersson
Benoit-Liligren

Thats a pretty nice Dcore right there


You make a trade now for someone with term but then in the summer go get the other piece needed to make something even better.


Yeah this is ideally what I'd like for to happen. I think this team needs at least one top quality RD and another RD who maybe is a notch below that top RD.
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29 févr. à 7 h 12
#207
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Quoting: Random2152
Buy low candidate then


Interesting option but 4.4 for the next 3 years after this one tough when hoping for a rebound.
29 févr. à 7 h 20
#208
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Quoting: NorthernLeafsFan05
Idk how people have become so disillusioned about Peeke. How can you honestly tell me you'd pay for LYUBUSHKIN, but you won't even take Peeke unless you're getting assets back. Everything you think Boosh does is what Peeke does. He's physical, defensively sound, blocks shots, is good at clearing the crease, and has term for a reasonable amount of money. He is an excellent buy low candidate


I don't really want either guy to be our acquisition, but what do you mean "everything you think Lyubushkin does"? He unquestionably does do those things, and at a better level than Peeke, imo.
29 févr. à 9 h 45
#209
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Quoting: fangm
Robertson is crushing Kartye with less TOI he's already better and has way more potential.

Larsson is GARBAGE I don't know how to communicate this more clearly to Leaf fans who don't watch west coast games. He has a 43% CF this year and the team's CF% is 11.4% worse with him on the ice. He has less blocked shots than Alexandre Carrier. Like it's hard to explain just how bad he is. This isn't 2018.

So you are downgrading Robertson, trading a 1st and trading our best defensive prospect who is a RHD for a guy who it's easier to argue (using his analytics) that he shouldn't be in the NHL than that he should be on a top pair for a cup contender.

The names you keep bringing up are so bad. Here is Andersson cause I know that's the other one you are high on:
GGoP5ysXIAA0a5a.jpg:large
img_1751.jpg?resize=767%2C383&ssl=1


Rielly-Lilly
Brodie-Andersson
Benoit-McCabe


3/6 are signed for another year
2/6 are RFAs
Brodie should sign for cheaper or can be replaced
29 févr. à 9 h 48
#210
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I'd personally go after Andersson or Boqvist depending on assets...

Maybe something like Andersson, then go after a cheaper forward...

Or go Boqvist+Kuraly/Olivier/Texier


Rielly-Lilly
Brodie-Andersson
Benoit-McCabe

OR

Rielly-Boqvist
Benoit-McCabe
Brodie-Lilly
29 févr. à 10 h 27
#211
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we should trade fore on of Roy, Gudbranson, Savard at the TDL and then trade for ferraro in the offseason
29 févr. à 12 h 19
#212
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Obviously with the TDL fast approaching, there is a ton of different theories surrounding what the Leafs plan on doing. The thing is, we honestly don't have a ton of flexibility. Here are some important things to note:

- Pontus Holmberg will lose his waiver exemption by playing tonight, so he will be on the active roster for the remainder of the season
- Leafs will carry 3 goalies
- Jarnkrok should be coming off of LTIR relatively soon, Timmins still on IR but progressing well
-23 man roster (with Woll and Jarnkrok back) has only $43,550 in cap space
- 1st rounder is likely going to be kept

In order to add any significant pieces, the Leafs would have to send out a matching salary. There are no obvious choices on the main roster when it comes to clearing cap space. Assuming Gregor and Lagesson are waived, we then have 1.5m in cap space. Any trade would also likely see Robertson get dealt seeing as though he is the only valuable asset that isn't an everyday player for the Leafs, meaning we could bring in someone making 2.39m. The only real part of this roster that can be realistically assessed by trade right now is the defense, where a 2nd / 3rd pairing defenseman is needed. Are there any defensemen out there capable of playing second pair minutes making only 2.39m (or ~4.8m + retention?). I have a feeling the Leafs are gunning for Hanifin, and if they strike out on him then we are just going to stand pat. There are really no notable forwards worth trading for (aside from guys like Texier and Toropchenko), and the defense market is sparce. Hanifin is THE guy when it comes to defensemen, and I would guess that he is a player Brad would move the 1st for assuming he will extend in Toronto.

The criteria the Leafs want is so specific that it's pretty easy to figure out some targets, but I really doubt we see anything come to fruition within the next week or so. The Leafs just seem like they are going to be super stingy. Plus, Brad isn't really much of a TDL guy.

10 Defenseman That Check The Boxes (Ranked in order of how much I like them)

1. Marcus Pettersson (50% retained); Pie in the sky addition, unsure if Pens are selling but if they are then this is our guy. Defensively sound, has term, could be 2LD
2. Noah Hanifin (50% retained); Best defenseman who is for sure available for trade, obvious stipulation is needed a contract extension
3. Dante Fabbro; Not sure if Preds will be sellers, but Fabbro would be a savvy, young, cheap addition
4. Will Borgen; Physical young-ish defenseman, not sure what Seattle's plans are
5. Adam Larsson (50% retained); Reportedly unavailable for trade, don't love his play this season but if he doesnt cost a ton to get, he could be a nice commodity at 2m
6. Alex Carrier; Good underlying numbers, able to produce offensively while being sound defensively. Easy to extend
7. Matt Dumba (50% retained); Would have to cost next to nothing, and the Leafs would be gambling on a huge resurgence. His physicality could be nice
8. Andrew Peeke; Physical, shot blocking defenseman with term who should cost little to nothing to acquire
9. David Savard; Solid vet with Cup winning experience, but not sold on him this season. He's been bad defensively (could just be a product of playing in MTL). Plus nobody likes seeing us trade with the Habs
10. Joel Edmundson; Very cheap physical vet defenseman
29 févr. à 12 h 54
#213
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Quoting: Leafsfan98
I'd personally go after Andersson or Boqvist depending on assets...

Maybe something like Andersson, then go after a cheaper forward...

Or go Boqvist+Kuraly/Olivier/Texier


Rielly-Lilly
Brodie-Andersson
Benoit-McCabe

OR

Rielly-Boqvist
Benoit-McCabe
Brodie-Lilly


Boqvist is a offensive Dman. If we need that we got Timmins

Andersson has some defensive flaws but is a good PKer and in the past has put up better defensive numbers

Thats the guy to target
29 févr. à 12 h 58
#214
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Quoting: HappyKampfers
we should trade fore on of Roy, Gudbranson, Savard at the TDL and then trade for ferraro in the offseason


Gudbranson sucks

Roy wont be available as LA in the playoffs/race

Savard's interesting but slow.

Ferraro aint really what TOR needs as next year their LD is pretty much established

Rielly
McCabe
Benoit
29 févr. à 13 h 23
#215
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https://twitter.com/markhmasters/status/1763225694639665312

Just insert facepalm meme and fill in the blanks as to why _______ - _________
29 févr. à 13 h 37
#216
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Modifié 29 févr. à 13 h 48
Quoting: NorthernLeafsFan05
Obviously with the TDL fast approaching, there is a ton of different theories surrounding what the Leafs plan on doing. The thing is, we honestly don't have a ton of flexibility. Here are some important things to note:

- Pontus Holmberg will lose his waiver exemption by playing tonight, so he will be on the active roster for the remainder of the season
- Leafs will carry 3 goalies
- Jarnkrok should be coming off of LTIR relatively soon, Timmins still on IR but progressing well
-23 man roster (with Woll and Jarnkrok back) has only $43,550 in cap space
- 1st rounder is likely going to be kept

In order to add any significant pieces, the Leafs would have to send out a matching salary. There are no obvious choices on the main roster when it comes to clearing cap space. Assuming Gregor and Lagesson are waived, we then have 1.5m in cap space. Any trade would also likely see Robertson get dealt seeing as though he is the only valuable asset that isn't an everyday player for the Leafs, meaning we could bring in someone making 2.39m. The only real part of this roster that can be realistically assessed by trade right now is the defense, where a 2nd / 3rd pairing defenseman is needed. Are there any defensemen out there capable of playing second pair minutes making only 2.39m (or ~4.8m + retention?). I have a feeling the Leafs are gunning for Hanifin, and if they strike out on him then we are just going to stand pat. There are really no notable forwards worth trading for (aside from guys like Texier and Toropchenko), and the defense market is sparce. Hanifin is THE guy when it comes to defensemen, and I would guess that he is a player Brad would move the 1st for assuming he will extend in Toronto.

The criteria the Leafs want is so specific that it's pretty easy to figure out some targets, but I really doubt we see anything come to fruition within the next week or so. The Leafs just seem like they are going to be super stingy. Plus, Brad isn't really much of a TDL guy.

10 Defenseman That Check The Boxes (Ranked in order of how much I like them)

1. Marcus Pettersson (50% retained); Pie in the sky addition, unsure if Pens are selling but if they are then this is our guy. Defensively sound, has term, could be 2LD
2. Noah Hanifin (50% retained); Best defenseman who is for sure available for trade, obvious stipulation is needed a contract extension
3. Dante Fabbro; Not sure if Preds will be sellers, but Fabbro would be a savvy, young, cheap addition
4. Will Borgen; Physical young-ish defenseman, not sure what Seattle's plans are
5. Adam Larsson (50% retained); Reportedly unavailable for trade, don't love his play this season but if he doesnt cost a ton to get, he could be a nice commodity at 2m
6. Alex Carrier; Good underlying numbers, able to produce offensively while being sound defensively. Easy to extend
7. Matt Dumba (50% retained); Would have to cost next to nothing, and the Leafs would be gambling on a huge resurgence. His physicality could be nice
8. Andrew Peeke; Physical, shot blocking defenseman with term who should cost little to nothing to acquire
9. David Savard; Solid vet with Cup winning experience, but not sold on him this season. He's been bad defensively (could just be a product of playing in MTL). Plus nobody likes seeing us trade with the Habs
10. Joel Edmundson; Very cheap physical vet defenseman


Marcus Petterson would work if we needed a LD

Noah Hanifin same as above

Fabbro is a gamble but one I would try. Guys probs out of NSH anyways as they have 7 Dman and I doubt he likes the 13 HS

Borgen is a guy I see a lot but dont see what all the hype is. Hes basically someone that if u put in your top pair your blue line be thin

Larsson's my guy as his style fits so well with Rielly but sadly SEA is gonna hold on to him

Carrier is undersized and yea in the playoffs vs. BOS or FLA hell nah he gonna get bullied

Dumba's bad. Just straight up bad. The offense is gone and so nothing to cover that bad defense. Him with Rielly would not be fun at all

Peeke sucks. Like straight up this kids not an NHLer. Unless they eat 50% and send us a prospect back for FC have no interest

Savard's slow and dont seem top 4 anymore. Like maybe he would work with Rielly due to the styles of play but man if not 3.5m for him's not great

Joel Edmunson = Benoit so no need, also LD


Basically of everyone here its either do you want an all LD system (after reading that Cassidy article NTU), risking Savard, or gambling on Fabbro



There is another name but Blues would have to do some serious ret on him = Parayko

Yes there has been bad but he and Rielly did show chemistry when they played in the world cup

6'6 228 pounds, has term and might be worth a look especially if Blues ret 2-2.5m (4m-4.5m). Now this is a gamble but if you can reignite the chemistry he and Rielly had in that WC you could have a solid big top pair
29 févr. à 13 h 45
#217
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Quoting: aadoyle
Marcus Petterson would work if we needed a LD

Noah Hanifin same as above

Fabbro is a gamble but one I would try. Guys probs out of NSH anyways as they have 7 Dman and I doubt he likes the 13 HS

Borgen is a guy I see a lot but dont see what all the hype is. Hes basically someone that if u put in your top pair your blue line be thin

Larsson's my guy as his style fits so well with Rielly but sadly SEA is gonna hold on to him

Carrier is undersized and yea in the playoffs vs. BOS or FLA hell nah he gonna get bullied

Dumba's bad. Just straight up bad. The offense is gone and so nothing to cover that bad defense. Him with Rielly would not be fun at all

Peeke sucks. Like straight up this kids not an NHLer. Unless they eat 50% and send us a prospect back for FC have no interest

Savard's slow and dont seem top 4 anymore. Like maybe he would work with Rielly due to the styles of play but man if not 3.5m for him's not great

Joel Edmunson = Benoit so no need, also LD


Basically of everyone here its either do you want an all LD system (after reading that Cassidy article NTU), risking Savard, or gambling on Fabbro


Evaluating these guys through the lens of being Mo's partner is not fair. Like I said, we've got McCabe and Lili to play with Mo. Get a 2nd pairing defender and we are good. Make a push for Roy this offseason. Problem solved
29 févr. à 13 h 49
#218
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Quoting: NorthernLeafsFan05
Evaluating these guys through the lens of being Mo's partner is not fair. Like I said, we've got McCabe and Lili to play with Mo. Get a 2nd pairing defender and we are good. Make a push for Roy this offseason. Problem solved


As said before why would TOR want to break up Brodie-Liligren and Benoit-McCabe

It makes 0 sense

The whole thing for this TDL is finding MO a partner lul

Rielly-?
Brodie-Liligren
Benoit-McCabe


Only if they got RA would I say to split Brodie-Liligren but seems that guys not available either. So basically its once again Rielly partner hunting time
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29 févr. à 13 h 50
#219
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Quoting: aadoyle
As said before why would TOR want to break up Brodie-Liligren and Benoit-McCabe

It makes 0 sense

The whole thing for this TDL is finding MO a partner lul

Rielly-?
Brodie-Liligren
Benoit-McCabe


Good luck with that lmao
29 févr. à 13 h 51
#220
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Quoting: NorthernLeafsFan05
Good luck with that lmao


Well they seem to find one every year so dont have much concern

They know what type he likes to play with and a former partner is available

Got a feeling hes coming in some PKG'D deal

Dont know why u make it seem like its hard lul. Its been a tradition for them to split Rielly-Brodie and find him a partner.
29 févr. à 13 h 56
#221
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Quoting: aadoyle
Well they seem to find one every year so dont have much concern

They know what type he likes to play with and a former partner is available

Got a feeling hes coming

Dont know why u make it seem like its hard lul


Because who is there? We aren't going to move the 1st for a rental, Minten and Cowan are untouchable, and the market is so dry. You keep throwing out names like Lyubushkin because physical, defensive defenseman typically do well with Mo. Well what is Jake McCabe??? Go out and get another LD to lock down the second pair, and get Rielly and McCabe together. Hanifin and Pettersson are the only real legit Top 4 defensemen making reasonable amounts of money on teams slated to be sellers. Either one of those guys on the second pair would round this defense out very nicely

Rielly - McCabe
Pettersson / Hanifin - Liljegren
Benoit - Brodie

We know Larsson is a no go, so what other RHD are out there? Fabbro is too much of a gamble, granted I would like to add him to see what he could do, but the Leafs need someone we can trust to come in and make an impact.
29 févr. à 13 h 57
#222
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Quoting: NorthernLeafsFan05
Because we don't have a ton of cap space to bring in someone pricey, and we don't really have the assets to go out there and get a premier RHD to pair with Mo. You keep throwing out names like Lyubushkin because physical, defensive defenseman typically do well with Mo. Well what is Jake McCabe??? Go out and get another LD to lock down the second pair, and get Rielly and McCabe together. Hanifin and Pettersson are the only real legit Top 4 defensemen making reasonable amounts of money on teams slated to be sellers. Either one of those guys on the second pair would round this defense out very nicely

Rielly - McCabe
Pettersson / Hanifin - Liljegren
Benoit - Brodie

We know Larsson is a no go, so what other RHD are out there? Fabbro is too much of a gamble, granted I would like to add him to see what he could do, but the Leafs need someone we can trust to come in and make an impact.


Leafs factoring in LTIR and some reassignments, and money in and out trades can have up to 4.75m in cap space

They have never been shy of maximizing before.

Leafs rn can bring in Vatrano + Lybushkin 50% ret or TVR + Mantha (50% ret) with not much headache. Would factor a Jones move but they can always spend a 7th on a goalie whose already passed through waivers if need be.


As said before you dont split up pairs that work I dont know why you cant comprehend that. If it works leave it

Benoit-McCabe has been good along with Brodie-Liligren

The whole thing rn is k find MO a partner why mix and match the other pairings when we know the other two work but just dont have that guy to play with him rn

Rielly-?
Brodie-Liligren
Benoit-McCabe
29 févr. à 13 h 59
#223
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Quoting: NorthernLeafsFan05
Because who is there? We aren't going to move the 1st for a rental, Minten and Cowan are untouchable, and the market is so dry. You keep throwing out names like Lyubushkin because physical, defensive defenseman typically do well with Mo. Well what is Jake McCabe??? Go out and get another LD to lock down the second pair, and get Rielly and McCabe together. Hanifin and Pettersson are the only real legit Top 4 defensemen making reasonable amounts of money on teams slated to be sellers. Either one of those guys on the second pair would round this defense out very nicely

Rielly - McCabe
Pettersson / Hanifin - Liljegren
Benoit - Brodie

We know Larsson is a no go, so what other RHD are out there? Fabbro is too much of a gamble, granted I would like to add him to see what he could do, but the Leafs need someone we can trust to come in and make an impact.


Quoting: aadoyle
Leafs factoring in LTIR and some reassignments, and money in and out trades can have up to 4.75m in cap space


Not what I wanted to say, I fixed my mistake in an edit.
29 févr. à 14 h 0
#224
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Modifié 29 févr. à 14 h 6
Quoting: NorthernLeafsFan05
Not what I wanted to say, I fixed my mistake in an edit.


Benoit-McCabe has been good along with Brodie-Liligren. Leave them be

No need to mix and match pairings again. Find someone to play with Mo and keep the other two together

Rielly-?
Brodie-Liligren
Benoit-McCabe

As why break up what worked on that 5 game winstreak
29 févr. à 14 h 6
#225
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Quoting: aadoyle
Leafs factoring in LTIR and some reassignments, and money in and out trades can have up to 4.75m in cap space

They have never been shy of maximizing before.

Leafs rn can bring in Vatrano + Lybushkin 50% ret or TVR + Mantha (50% ret) with not much headache. Would factor a Jones move but they can always spend a 7th on a goalie whose already passed through waivers if need be.


As said before you dont split up pairs that work I dont know why you cant comprehend that

Benoit-McCabe has been good along with Brodie-Liligren

The whole thing rn is k find MO a partner why mix and match the other pairings when we know the other two work but just dont have that guy to play with him rn

Rielly-?
Brodie-Liligren
Benoit-McCabe


Agree to disagree, bringing in a depth defenseman and thrusting him onto the top pair doesn't work. You kind of have to shake up the pairings we have if you want to address the blueline in a meaningful way. I don't care how bad Rielly - Brodie has been this year, I can assure you that Rielly - Lyubushkin would be way worse. TVR is a fine player, but he's making 3m for 3 years. I wouldn't hate it but he doesnt move the needle. Either get a 2LD with term and ride out this season or don't make a move at all.

I hate that we are acting like no other D-combinations would be good. Yes Benoit - McCabe has been good, but I feel like Rielly - McCabe and Hanifin/Pettersson - Liljegren would also dominate. Excuse me for not wanting Simon Benoit in our top 4 come playoff time lmfao.

The parameters the Leafs have set for themselves limit our TDL approach significantly. We want an impact defenseman but don't want to pay a premium unless they have term. We are keeping 3 goalies on the main roster. Jarnkrok is coming back soon so his LTIR assignment doesn't mean much. The only guys that make any sense at this stage are Hanifin or Pettersson IMO. If we can't get those guys, then why even bother spending?
 
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