SalarySwishSalarySwish
Forums/NHL Trades

(WPG/LAK) - Dubois for Iafallo, Kupari, Vilardi, 2024 2nd (MTL)

Who won the trade?
Le graphique a été masqué

Options de sondage


14 déc. 2023 à 1 h 12
#101
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: juill. 2021
Messages: 1,116
Mentions "j'aime": 851
Quoting: jr400
I guess the only consolation for LA is that they're the best team in the league now.


Cam Talbot is having his best season since his rookie year. If he slips to his career average, or is injured, then LA is in trouble.

But back to PLD, his point-per-game average is close to the lowest in his career and his on-ice goal differential is 7.5 below expected. According to The Athletic, his market value is $4.0 million, less than half of what he's being paid.
14 déc. 2023 à 21 h 41
#102
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: févr. 2022
Messages: 4,992
Mentions "j'aime": 2,315
Quoting: jr400
I guess the only consolation for LA is that they're the best team in the league now.


Reeeeeeeeee
15 déc. 2023 à 13 h 56
#103
I Love J Boqvist
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: janv. 2023
Messages: 11,606
Mentions "j'aime": 3,042
Quoting: CSStrowbridge
Cam Talbot is having his best season since his rookie year. If he slips to his career average, or is injured, then LA is in trouble.

But back to PLD, his point-per-game average is close to the lowest in his career and his on-ice goal differential is 7.5 below expected. According to The Athletic, his market value is $4.0 million, less than half of what he's being paid.


The kings are elite in xgoal metrics too.
21 déc. 2023 à 16 h 59
#104
Bedard23
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: mai 2021
Messages: 9,268
Mentions "j'aime": 4,452
Safe to say Winnipeg got a better package from LA then whatever the **** Montreal fans were offering for him
Rolfadinho, palhal, Saskleaf and 1 other person a aimé ceci.
21 déc. 2023 à 20 h 14
#105
LongtimeLeafsufferer
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: juill. 2015
Messages: 59,348
Mentions "j'aime": 22,607
Quoting: IconicHawk
Safe to say Winnipeg got a better package from LA then whatever the **** Montreal fans were offering for him


Just to add. Habs look like they dodged a bullet not trading for him, or possibly signing PLD as a UFA.
Saskleaf, CSStrowbridge, Rolfadinho and 1 other person a aimé ceci.
21 déc. 2023 à 22 h 30
#106
Bedard23
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: mai 2021
Messages: 9,268
Mentions "j'aime": 4,452
Quoting: palhal
Just to add. Habs look like they dodged a bullet not trading for him, or possibly signing PLD as a UFA.


Yeah that too
Saskleaf a aimé ceci.
23 déc. 2023 à 10 h 9
#107
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: juill. 2021
Messages: 1,116
Mentions "j'aime": 851
Quoting: CSStrowbridge
Cam Talbot is having his best season since his rookie year. If he slips to his career average, or is injured, then LA is in trouble.

But back to PLD, his point-per-game average is close to the lowest in his career and his on-ice goal differential is 7.5 below expected. According to The Athletic, his market value is $4.0 million, less than half of what he's being paid.


It has been less than ten days since I wrote this and PLD's on-ice goal differential has fallen to 9.8 below expected.

He's on an 82-game pace for 14 goal, 20 assists, and an on-ice goal differential 27.7 below expected.

And he's getting paid $8.5 million this season and the next seven.

I'd rather have Kupari at $1 million than PLD at $8.5 million.
RawDeal a aimé ceci.
24 déc. 2023 à 16 h 44
#108
Leafs going to Leafs
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: déc. 2022
Messages: 9,432
Mentions "j'aime": 2,864
The trade in isolation looks bad for LA... But if you're LA, you don't change a thing rn... Their team looks stacked and are playing really well, not sure how PLD has affected it but he surely did
RationalHockeyFan a aimé ceci.
27 déc. 2023 à 8 h 42
#109
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: juill. 2021
Messages: 1,044
Mentions "j'aime": 544
Quoting: CSStrowbridge
I'd rather have Kupari at $1 million than PLD at $8.5 million.


This might have been a little tongue-in-cheek, but it raises a good point. When you trade for a player on an expiring contract and then sign him to a UFA-like contract (in this case bigger than UFA, because it’s 8 years), you’re really paying for him twice, once with the assets you give up in the trade and again with the cap space you give up to sign him.

I often wonder if the opposite strategy would be better: Trade your pending free agents for futures and then use the cap space it frees up to replace them with UFAs. You still end up with the big contract, but you have other assets coming in instead of going out. It’s risky because it depends on UFAs being available for the holes you need to fill and them wanting to play for you, but if you can pull it off, you could build for the future without sacrificing the present.
CSStrowbridge et RawDeal a aimé ceci.
27 déc. 2023 à 19 h 13
#110
Lets go fishing
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: juill. 2023
Messages: 360
Mentions "j'aime": 188
Quoting: Leafsfan98
The trade in isolation looks bad for LA... But if you're LA, you don't change a thing rn... Their team looks stacked and are playing really well, not sure how PLD has affected it but he surely did


PLD is under-performing, but the fundamental ideas behind the trade have been working for both teams. LA got to free up some roster spots for guys to move up, clearing some of their forward backlog. They also got a star player in return (or at least he's expected to be someday). The Jets lost a guy they were going to lose anyway but fixed their forward depth problems at the same time. Chevaldayoff did his thing where he finds guys who are undervalued on the market or underutilized on their team and buys low.

Everyone is looking at the players and deciding who won the trade. The value for the Kings was in addition by subtraction, not necessarily the return. The value for the Jets was fixing depth problems and the "omg they got something for PLD even though he was leaving anyway" effect.
27 déc. 2023 à 19 h 43
#111
Leafs going to Leafs
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: déc. 2022
Messages: 9,432
Mentions "j'aime": 2,864
Quoting: RationalHockeyFan
PLD is under-performing, but the fundamental ideas behind the trade have been working for both teams. LA got to free up some roster spots for guys to move up, clearing some of their forward backlog. They also got a star player in return (or at least he's expected to be someday). The Jets lost a guy they were going to lose anyway but fixed their forward depth problems at the same time. Chevaldayoff did his thing where he finds guys who are undervalued on the market or underutilized on their team and buys low.

Everyone is looking at the players and deciding who won the trade. The value for the Kings was in addition by subtraction, not necessarily the return. The value for the Jets was fixing depth problems and the "omg they got something for PLD even though he was leaving anyway" effect.


Fair, I was just pointing out that LA is doing better than last year... So I wouldn't change a thing if I were LA
RationalHockeyFan a aimé ceci.
18 janv. à 21 h 16
#112
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: juill. 2021
Messages: 1,044
Mentions "j'aime": 544
Quoting: RationalHockeyFan
PLD is under-performing, but the fundamental ideas behind the trade have been working for both teams. LA got to free up some roster spots for guys to move up, clearing some of their forward backlog. They also got a star player in return (or at least he's expected to be someday). The Jets lost a guy they were going to lose anyway but fixed their forward depth problems at the same time. Chevaldayoff did his thing where he finds guys who are undervalued on the market or underutilized on their team and buys low.

Everyone is looking at the players and deciding who won the trade. The value for the Kings was in addition by subtraction, not necessarily the return. The value for the Jets was fixing depth problems and the "omg they got something for PLD even though he was leaving anyway" effect.


So you’re saying the Kings spent $68M and a probably early 2nd-round pick just to clear a couple of roster spots? I must be misunderstanding you because that makes no sense.
RationalHockeyFan a aimé ceci.
19 janv. à 0 h 40
#113
Lets go fishing
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: juill. 2023
Messages: 360
Mentions "j'aime": 188
Quoting: jr400
So you’re saying the Kings spent $68M and a probably early 2nd-round pick just to clear a couple of roster spots? I must be misunderstanding you because that makes no sense.


Obviously the Kings thought they were getting a better player. Last off-season, the Kings had a backlog of forwards. Byfield and Vilardi both weren't getting the minutes they needed, and Laferriere was coming into the lineup. My understanding of the trade, from the Kings perspective, is that they gave the top6 opportunity to Byfield and used Vilardi to acquire a star player. They also moved Iafallo and Kupari, which gave them enough cap space and room in the lineup to fit Laferriere and the star player. The Kings basically consolidated a few average players into a star player, clearing their forward backlog in the process. It was a net -2 forwards and -1 Dman (MTL 2nd = Sean Durzi) which created space for the Kings future (Byfield, Laferriere, Spence) to flourish.

Admittedly, the last 3 weeks have made this trade look even more lopsided, as the Kings have lost 9 out of 10 games since I posted my first comment on Dec 27th. They are also currently losing to the Predators as I type this out. The Kings thought that they were getting a star player in PLD. For Rob Blake's sake I hope PLD starts playing like he cares.

It doesn't make sense from a strictly Chel trade value meter perspective, but it does make sense from the position that the Kings found themselves in. You can only dress 12 FWD, 6 D, and 2 G. The Kings had too many players that deserved a spot in the lineup and the opportunity to consolidate a few "old toys" into a "new shiny toy" while making room for their other homegrown shiny toys. It would be easier to justify if PLD was playing like the "super hot studmuffin Ferrari" the Kings thought they were getting instead of the "shopping cart with 3 wheels" the Jets knew he could be at times.

So yeah the Kings spent $8.5M on 1 player instead of 4 players (MTL 2nd = Durzi), opening up roster spots for the new kids in the process.

Just for comparison's sake:
Group A: PLD, Byfield, Laferriere, Spence combined cap hit = $11,089,167. (8.5M + 894,167 + 875,000 + 820,000)

Group B: Iafallo, Vilardi, Kupari, Durzi combined cap hit = $10,137,500. (WPG: 4M + 3,437,500 + 1M = $8,437,500; + ARI: $1.7M)

It's only ~$900K difference between the two. Byfield and Spence have impressed me so far. if PLD was performing like an 8.5M player, then any rational GM would rather have Group A.
palhal et jr400 a aimé ceci.
19 janv. à 10 h 5
#114
LongtimeLeafsufferer
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: juill. 2015
Messages: 59,348
Mentions "j'aime": 22,607
Quoting: RationalHockeyFan
Obviously the Kings thought they were getting a better player. Last off-season, the Kings had a backlog of forwards. Byfield and Vilardi both weren't getting the minutes they needed, and Laferriere was coming into the lineup. My understanding of the trade, from the Kings perspective, is that they gave the top6 opportunity to Byfield and used Vilardi to acquire a star player. They also moved Iafallo and Kupari, which gave them enough cap space and room in the lineup to fit Laferriere and the star player. The Kings basically consolidated a few average players into a star player, clearing their forward backlog in the process. It was a net -2 forwards and -1 Dman (MTL 2nd = Sean Durzi) which created space for the Kings future (Byfield, Laferriere, Spence) to flourish.

Admittedly, the last 3 weeks have made this trade look even more lopsided, as the Kings have lost 9 out of 10 games since I posted my first comment on Dec 27th. They are also currently losing to the Predators as I type this out. The Kings thought that they were getting a star player in PLD. For Rob Blake's sake I hope PLD starts playing like he cares.

It doesn't make sense from a strictly Chel trade value meter perspective, but it does make sense from the position that the Kings found themselves in. You can only dress 12 FWD, 6 D, and 2 G. The Kings had too many players that deserved a spot in the lineup and the opportunity to consolidate a few "old toys" into a "new shiny toy" while making room for their other homegrown shiny toys. It would be easier to justify if PLD was playing like the "super hot studmuffin Ferrari" the Kings thought they were getting instead of the "shopping cart with 3 wheels" the Jets knew he could be at times.

So yeah the Kings spent $8.5M on 1 player instead of 4 players (MTL 2nd = Durzi), opening up roster spots for the new kids in the process.

Just for comparison's sake:
Group A: PLD, Byfield, Laferriere, Spence combined cap hit = $11,089,167. (8.5M + 894,167 + 875,000 + 820,000)

Group B: Iafallo, Vilardi, Kupari, Durzi combined cap hit = $10,137,500. (WPG: 4M + 3,437,500 + 1M = $8,437,500; + ARI: $1.7M)

It's only ~$900K difference between the two. Byfield and Spence have impressed me so far. if PLD was performing like an 8.5M player, then any rational GM would rather have Group A.


Thanks for the thoughtful analysis. I guess the only question is....and we wouldn't know for another spring of 2031 is whether PLD has been worth his contract.
19 janv. à 18 h 43
#115
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: mai 2022
Messages: 684
Mentions "j'aime": 297
Any sensible hockey fan could see from a mile away how much of a fraud PLD was. The fact that the Kings made this trade will always puzzle me.
Andy_Dick et CSStrowbridge a aimé ceci.
20 janv. à 8 h 11
#116
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: févr. 2022
Messages: 4,992
Mentions "j'aime": 2,315
Quoting: Rolfadinho
Any sensible hockey fan could see from a mile away how much of a fraud PLD was. The fact that the Kings made this trade will always puzzle me.


The Zegras smell is starting to be pugnant as well. I stated over and over how much I didnt want PLD on the Habs yet put forth a few ACGM, where, of course, I was told he was worth multiple 1sts plus much like TZ. Funny enough I see the Blackhawks overpaying with a 1st plus an A prospect plus a roster player.
20 janv. à 8 h 23
#117
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: févr. 2022
Messages: 4,992
Mentions "j'aime": 2,315
Quoting: jr400
I guess the only consolation for LA is that they're the best team in the league now.


Hasnt aged too well after losing 10 of 11 and barely hanging on to the wild card. PLD being moved all over the lineup and cant produce.
24 janv. à 8 h 56
#118
Miss YA Killer
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: juin 2022
Messages: 3,739
Mentions "j'aime": 1,415
This trade aged well for KA enjoy Prima Dona Luc Dubios
24 janv. à 9 h 0
#119
Miss YA Killer
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: juin 2022
Messages: 3,739
Mentions "j'aime": 1,415
Quoting: RationalHockeyFan
Obviously the Kings thought they were getting a better player. Last off-season, the Kings had a backlog of forwards. Byfield and Vilardi both weren't getting the minutes they needed, and Laferriere was coming into the lineup. My understanding of the trade, from the Kings perspective, is that they gave the top6 opportunity to Byfield and used Vilardi to acquire a star player. They also moved Iafallo and Kupari, which gave them enough cap space and room in the lineup to fit Laferriere and the star player. The Kings basically consolidated a few average players into a star player, clearing their forward backlog in the process. It was a net -2 forwards and -1 Dman (MTL 2nd = Sean Durzi) which created space for the Kings future (Byfield, Laferriere, Spence) to flourish.

Admittedly, the last 3 weeks have made this trade look even more lopsided, as the Kings have lost 9 out of 10 games since I posted my first comment on Dec 27th. They are also currently losing to the Predators as I type this out. The Kings thought that they were getting a star player in PLD. For Rob Blake's sake I hope PLD starts playing like he cares.

It doesn't make sense from a strictly Chel trade value meter perspective, but it does make sense from the position that the Kings found themselves in. You can only dress 12 FWD, 6 D, and 2 G. The Kings had too many players that deserved a spot in the lineup and the opportunity to consolidate a few "old toys" into a "new shiny toy" while making room for their other homegrown shiny toys. It would be easier to justify if PLD was playing like the "super hot studmuffin Ferrari" the Kings thought they were getting instead of the "shopping cart with 3 wheels" the Jets knew he could be at times.

So yeah the Kings spent $8.5M on 1 player instead of 4 players (MTL 2nd = Durzi), opening up roster spots for the new kids in the process.

Just for comparison's sake:
Group A: PLD, Byfield, Laferriere, Spence combined cap hit = $11,089,167. (8.5M + 894,167 + 875,000 + 820,000)

Group B: Iafallo, Vilardi, Kupari, Durzi combined cap hit = $10,137,500. (WPG: 4M + 3,437,500 + 1M = $8,437,500; + ARI: $1.7M)

It's only ~$900K difference between the two. Byfield and Spence have impressed me so far. if PLD was performing like an 8.5M player, then any rational GM would rather have Group A.


Just don't understand why they thought that Dude had all the signs big flashing neon type of being a lazy a$$ primadona. How did Blake blow it soo bad.
25 janv. à 17 h 10
#120
Go leafs go
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: avr. 2020
Messages: 13,195
Mentions "j'aime": 9,163
Quoting: Saskleaf
I don’t understand why everyone is saying “big L for the kings”. PLD is still a solid number 2, maybe borderline number 1 C in the right situation. LA isn’t giving up anything crazy.

That said Winnipeg is doing well here if their plan was to just retool. Fair trade overall


I have to say, I was very wrong about this trade. Totally thought PLD could finally take that next step with the kings but he’s sucked. Meanwhile Winnipeg has made out like bandits. But since the jets are probably my second favourite team, I’ve been very happy with how things are going lol
Andy_Dick a aimé ceci.
26 janv. à 16 h 49
#121
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: févr. 2022
Messages: 4,992
Mentions "j'aime": 2,315
Oof. Teammates and coach calling out PLDrama now?!

Thank you Bergevin for leaving and taking your terrible ideas with you! Gallagher had be had, Bergy. You cried for him, once!
22 févr. à 12 h 31
#122
Bedard23
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: mai 2021
Messages: 9,268
Mentions "j'aime": 4,452
Someone please investigate someone by the name of Kevin A. Cheveldayoff for his role in at least 3 highway robberies in Manitoba
FoxYou727 a aimé ceci.
Hier à 10 h 36
#123
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: févr. 2022
Messages: 4,992
Mentions "j'aime": 2,315
Quoting: Saskleaf
I have to say, I was very wrong about this trade. Totally thought PLD could finally take that next step with the kings but he’s sucked. Meanwhile Winnipeg has made out like bandits. But since the jets are probably my second favourite team, I’ve been very happy with how things are going lol


Lets check in on my favourite soap PLDrama..
Saskleaf a aimé ceci.
Hier à 10 h 42
#124
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: févr. 2022
Messages: 4,992
Mentions "j'aime": 2,315
Most overrated players on this site were definitely PLD last season, Seider two years ago as he's not close to this top pair D, he's turning into Thomas Chabot. Same trajectory. Hockey sense ain't great, 2nd goal was his fault by giving Rust too much space instead of playing the loose puck but he cant commit with his average skating and he cant even catch 50 year old Jeff Carter in a foot race for the 5th Pens goal shorthanded.

Defense all around last night was brutal in Pittsburgh. No clue what EK67 was doing behind the net and leaving Larkin alone for an easy goal.
Hier à 14 h 43
#125
Leafs going to Leafs
Avatar de l'utilisateur
Rejoint: déc. 2022
Messages: 9,432
Mentions "j'aime": 2,864
It's actually hilarious that; while being in a deserved bottom 6 role with the Kings,

Dubois would still be 5th in scoring if he played on the Habs...


No Habs fan has the right to clown on this trade, Jets fans however...
 
Répondre
To create a post please Login or S'inscrire
Question:
Options:
Chargement de l'animation
Soumettre les modifications du sondage