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viable opponent for vasilevskiy only way id be ok with knies deal

Créé par: leafs101
Équipe: 2022-23 Maple Leafs de Toronto
Date de création initiale: 23 févr. 2023
Publié: 23 févr. 2023
Mode - plafond salarial: Basique
Description
I would even add a bit, Saros would be a gamebreaker that would give us a sure-bet competitor against the top goaltenders in the league in the playoffs. This would only happen if NSH commits to the rebuild/retool, could make sense to sell off. And maybe even makes sense with Saros given Askarov's timing with a potential 2-5 year rebuild/retool. I'd probably even consider adding a bit more but Knies + 1st for a goalie is a pretty big offer. NSH would re-sign Lankinen and run Lankinen-Murray for a couple years before bringing up Askarov.

Sandin, Holl and Gudas battle out for last spot on D, probably we get an injury and there's no issue there. ZAR plays 3rd line just to have a physical line with Domi and Acciari, then Kampf shutdown line. Gives two bottom 6 lines with a clear identity for the first time in ages.

Yes, I know this is unrealistic, but if we're going all in and NSH would entertain this as a base of a deal (maybe we add) I'd do it
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NSH
  1. Knies, Matthew [Liste de réserve]
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23 févr. 2023 à 13 h 6
#1
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NSH fans I know you're not trading Saros. I think it could make sense though. I'd add to the trade even. But understand if its a no.
23 févr. 2023 à 13 h 6
#2
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LOL that doesn't get Saros.
I wish it did though.
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23 févr. 2023 à 13 h 8
#3
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Quoting: Dominot
LOL that doesn't get Saros.
I wish it did though.


It's a decent starting offer, to get the conversation going.
But it's not enough.
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23 févr. 2023 à 13 h 9
#4
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Quoting: EvanderKanesLawyer
It's a decent starting offer, to get the conversation going.
But it's not enough.


yea thats really all I was shooting for. I think its a lower end offer but its a strong base if that makes sense. I think maybe a Niemela type prospect also ends up in the mix.

Top goalie deals involving any more than a team's #1 prospect and a 1st are rare though. Granted trading a goalie of Saros' calibre is also rare.
23 févr. 2023 à 13 h 13
#5
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NSH fans, genuinely want convo and input. I know Leafs likely add but I think this is a good base. I also think this is really the only thing left that could be done to truly put Toronto over the top, so would be curious if it's even a possibility and just how much more would have to be included. I think what would probably end up happening in a Leafs-Saros deal would be that Niemela also has be included.
23 févr. 2023 à 13 h 13
#6
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Modifié 23 févr. 2023 à 13 h 28
Idk, maybe Tampa sweeps the Leafs with Saros in net.

In 10-game vs TB in his career this is his save % and GAA: 882 3.71.

Murray vs TB in regular season is 895 and 3.01 in the same amount of games.

Samsonov has only played them twice ever and has decent stats against them. His inner slot sv % suggests that Nick Paul might not be too much of an issue even if he does crash the net and get the inside positioning on defenders.
23 févr. 2023 à 13 h 13
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23 févr. 2023 à 13 h 15
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Honestly not a horrible starting point as you've acknowledged, and you deserve credit for not absolutely low balling. I would have to think the Predators would want more as we've said. If I was them, I'm looking at 1.) Young forwards (their offense is ROUGH) 2.) Young D and 3.) NHL goalie to fill until they bring up Askarov/back him up.
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23 févr. 2023 à 13 h 15
#9
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Personally, I like that offer for Domi a lot. But I think I like Hirvonen and Moldenhauer more than most.
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23 févr. 2023 à 13 h 16
#10
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Quoting: Garak
Personally, I like that offer for Domi a lot. But I think I like Hirvonen and Moldenhauer more than most.


Thought i'd get sh** on because people don't know prospects and prefer the shiny pick lol, I just think if Toronto goes for Domi it'll be a prospect going the other way not a pick. I also think him on a line with ZAR and Acciari would be a very mean, physical line that could chip in offensively. Domi's playmaking would go well with Acciari's net front finishing capabilities as well.
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23 févr. 2023 à 13 h 17
#11
Danny Mr. GM Briere
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saros is untouchable. Giving that offer for Hart is more realistic. lets remember how good hart was the last time he had a competent team in front of him
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23 févr. 2023 à 13 h 18
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Quoting: bluspy88
Honestly not a horrible starting point as you've acknowledged, and you deserve credit for not absolutely low balling. I would have to think the Predators would want more as we've said. If I was them, I'm looking at 1.) Young forwards (their offense is ROUGH) 2.) Young D and 3.) NHL goalie to fill until they bring up Askarov/back him up.


yea. Murray gives the stopgap for Askarov, Knies brings the young F, then the 1st could be used on another need. Maybe Niemela is what rounds the needs out for point #2 there.
23 févr. 2023 à 13 h 18
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Quoting: leafs101
NSH fans, genuinely want convo and input. I know Leafs likely add but I think this is a good base. I also think this is really the only thing left that could be done to truly put Toronto over the top, so would be curious if it's even a possibility and just how much more would have to be included. I think what would probably end up happening in a Leafs-Saros deal would be that Niemela also has be included.


Quoting: leafs101
yea thats really all I was shooting for. I think its a lower end offer but its a strong base if that makes sense. I think maybe a Niemela type prospect also ends up in the mix.

Top goalie deals involving any more than a team's #1 prospect and a 1st are rare though. Granted trading a goalie of Saros' calibre is also rare.


Quoting: bluspy88
Honestly not a horrible starting point as you've acknowledged, and you deserve credit for not absolutely low balling. I would have to think the Predators would want more as we've said. If I was them, I'm looking at 1.) Young forwards (their offense is ROUGH) 2.) Young D and 3.) NHL goalie to fill until they bring up Askarov/back him up.


A good comparison I like to make is the Horvat deal. While he is a forward (two different positions) you gotta think we could net a similar return. Horvat got a blue chip prospect, a 1st, and a young roster player. Top end player, top end goalie. Different condiments, same sandwich.

If I'm moving a Vezina caliber goalie under a team friendly deal for the next 3 seasons, I'm asking for no less. The deal would have to really entice me to consider moving him.
But like I said, Knies and a 1st is a good conversation starter but it would likely cost more.
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23 févr. 2023 à 13 h 19
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Quoting: Sicksi
saros is untouchable. Giving that offer for Hart is more realistic. lets remember how good hart was the last time he had a competent team in front of him


I would agree except will NSH be contending again by the time Saros' deal is up and/or by the time Askarov is starter calibre? Maybe now, while his value is incredibly high and this draft is worth dropping in the standings for, is the time to do it.
23 févr. 2023 à 13 h 20
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Quoting: EvanderKanesLawyer
A good comparison I like to make is the Horvat deal. While he is a forward (two different positions) you gotta think we could net a similar return. Horvat got a blue chip prospect, a 1st, and a young roster player. Top end player, top end goalie. Different condiments, same sandwich.

If I'm moving a Vezina caliber goalie under a team friendly deal for the next 3 seasons, I'm asking for no less. The deal would have to really entice me to consider moving him.
But like I said, Knies and a 1st is a good conversation starter but it would likely cost more.


Absolutely agreed. I would say they need someone who is already proven at the NHL level along with Knies for example, because at the end of the day until he's proven he is still a risk to bust.
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23 févr. 2023 à 13 h 21
#16
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Quoting: EvanderKanesLawyer
A good comparison I like to make is the Horvat deal. While he is a forward (two different positions) you gotta think we could net a similar return. Horvat got a blue chip prospect, a 1st, and a young roster player. Top end player, top end goalie. Different condiments, same sandwich.

If I'm moving a Vezina caliber goalie under a team friendly deal for the next 3 seasons, I'm asking for no less. The deal would have to really entice me to consider moving him.
But like I said, Knies and a 1st is a good conversation starter but it would likely cost more.


to me this deal basically is the horvat deal

knies > raty (prospect)
beau > murray (NHLer), Murray stopgaps the net position
1st

the 3rd is missing but I think Knies is that good a prospect that the value difference there is offset
granted I would be willing to add in another prospect. Probably anyone except Minten really (Minten only because I think he's our best F prospect after Knies now and we shouldn't move both)
23 févr. 2023 à 13 h 21
#17
Danny Mr. GM Briere
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Quoting: leafs101
I would agree except will NSH be contending again by the time Saros' deal is up and/or by the time Askarov is starter calibre? Maybe now, while his value is incredibly high and this draft is worth dropping in the standings for, is the time to do it.


poille has never really been one to blow everything up. the time to do that was last year and he doubled down
23 févr. 2023 à 13 h 21
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Quoting: leafs101
Thought i'd get sh** on because people don't know prospects and prefer the shiny pick lol, I just think if Toronto goes for Domi it'll be a prospect going the other way not a pick. I also think him on a line with ZAR and Acciari would be a very mean, physical line that could chip in offensively. Domi's playmaking would go well with Acciari's net front finishing capabilities as well.


For sure. That is just my own opinion too. But if I try to envision CHI actually doing this, I'm not sure I can see it. Davidson seems to really likes his picks and drafting in general, it's kind of his bread and butter. Plus, Hirvonen and Moldy are small guys. So, idk... But I like them.
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23 févr. 2023 à 13 h 22
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Quoting: bluspy88
Absolutely agreed. I would say they need someone who is already proven at the NHL level along with Knies for example, because at the end of the day until he's proven he is still a risk to bust.


i mean i'm sure the Hawks deal still works without kerfoot and they could have him. Could have Robertson as well who at least has had some body of work in the NHL. But to both of you appreciate the actually constructive discussion and glad to hear I at least provided a reasonable framework for this type of move.
23 févr. 2023 à 13 h 24
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Quoting: leafs101
i mean i'm sure the Hawks deal still works without kerfoot and they could have him. Could have Robertson as well who at least has had some body of work in the NHL. But to both of you appreciate the actually constructive discussion and glad to hear I at least provided a reasonable framework for this type of move.


Oh I wasn't talking about the Hawks deal at all, my comment was about Saros. I think Saros will cost more than Horvat because he is under contract for more years, and yes Horvat got extended but there's still risk there.
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23 févr. 2023 à 13 h 24
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Quoting: Sicksi
poille has never really been one to blow everything up. the time to do that was last year and he doubled down


yea. I don't think its too late to blow up though. Could get very, very nice packages for Ekholm, Fabbro, Nino, Saros, and a couple others as well. I just think they're tracking to be the next San Jose and would be better suited making their moves today. Fair argument though absolutely.
23 févr. 2023 à 13 h 24
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Quoting: leafs101
to me this deal basically is the horvat deal

knies > raty (prospect)
beau > murray (NHLer), Murray stopgaps the net position
1st

the 3rd is missing but I think Knies is that good a prospect that the value difference there is offset
granted I would be willing to add in another prospect. Probably anyone except Minten really (Minten only because I think he's our best F prospect after Knies now and we shouldn't move both)


Murray is a stopgap, but if I'm shipping Saros to Toronto, I'm asking for:

1st
Knies
Woll,

to get it started. Toronto would have to ship out one of Samsonov or Murray for it to work (ideally Murray), but if I'm Nashville's GM I'm not interested in taking Murray back. So the deal likely doesn't go through unless you can find a 3rd team to take on Murray
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23 févr. 2023 à 13 h 25
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Quoting: bluspy88
Oh I wasn't talking about the Hawks deal at all, my comment was about Saros. I think Saros will cost more than Horvat because he is under contract for more years, and yes Horvat got extended but there's still risk there.


no I know, you said they may also want another NHLer going with Knies and I was saying take Kerfoot off the Hawks deal and give him to NSH. Though I doubt that really moves the needle
23 févr. 2023 à 13 h 26
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Quoting: EvanderKanesLawyer
Murray is a stopgap, but if I'm shipping Saros to Toronto, I'm asking for:

1st
Knies
Woll,

to get it started. Toronto would have to ship out one of Samsonov or Murray for it to work (ideally Murray), but if I'm Nashville's GM I'm not interested in taking Murray back. So the deal likely doesn't go through unless you can find a 3rd team to take on Murray


I'd give Woll too. Only reason I think they may want Murray in this is, if they go through with Saros deal they won't be planning on competing next season. Murray gives you an NHL body and some time to figure out the transition plan to Askarov over the next couple of years. But all fair points, appreciate the actually quality discussion from everyone on this post.
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23 févr. 2023 à 13 h 36
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Quoting: leafs101
no I know, you said they may also want another NHLer going with Knies and I was saying take Kerfoot off the Hawks deal and give him to NSH. Though I doubt that really moves the needle


Gotcha. Yeah, Kerfoot I don't think is much of anything in such a deal. I think it'd be young (say, 26 or under) guys. Woll like you said is not a bad idea. I think they'd be more interested in Knies/Woll/1st than Murray to be honest. I know that Murray would need to be moved still, but from NSH perspective.
 
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