If he doesn't get traded what is the next Alexis Lafreniere deal going to look like in New York

Kakko deal of 2x2.1. Chytil 2x4.5 Miller whatever he wants

L

Laf would get the Kakko deal I referenced in case that didn't make sense

Blues say no obviously
VT starts with a 23 first. Also I’d rather not touch kratzov
So It’d proably be a 23 first 24 2nd 23 3rd, and like Othman for both VT and Barby

Blues won't accept that trade. Not enough in assets to begin with. But with 2 Picks available from a better 2023 Draft class, they wouldn't want the 2024.

Hahaha what??? That offer doesn't even get you Tarasenko alone and unretained.

Othmann isn’t going anywhere due to our cap constraints next season, and you’re not going to get a top 40 prospect on top of a 23 1st for Tarasenko (assuming the 2nd and 3rd = Barbashev) from anyone let alone the Rangers.

Gonna have to pay at least 1 23 first and possibly even another one for both. Not sure or the interest in Kravstov.

Generally speaking would expect these types of returns

VT: 23 1st, prospect, 3rd
IB: 2 2nds or a 2 + earlier 3.

Pushing back the 1st to 24 hurts the outcome as the Blues more than likely won’t want to wait the 4-5 years you’re looking at forward on a late 1st rounder in 24.

Well…

Don't overvalue your rentals. Barbashev isn't producing and Tarasenko coming off injury

Yeah. You might be disappointed this trade deadline.
For what it's worth, I wanted a 1st and Jordan Kyrou in exchange for Chris Kreider back in March 2020 (I know, extremely cringe LOL), so I won't pretend that I'm exempt from the same criticism.

This is actually a good evaluation for both rentals in my opinion, but that prospect is going to be much closer to a Vitali Kravtsov then say a Brennan Othmann, as I previously touched upon

Lol idk if I’ve ever had one that bad but I will be real idk much about Othman other than he’s pretty good

Yeah, I’ll full up confess everything: I wanted that for Kyrou and I wanted a 1st + Ilya Mikheyev (reminder that 2019-20 was his excellent rookie season) in exchange for Alexandar Georgiev… I hope I’ve reduced my bias since then haha.

And yeah, THW ranked Othmann at 33 this midseason (Bolduc is 35 for comparison)

I don’t disagree at all. It shouldn’t be expected to have a top end prospect coming back for a rental. However, I’m not fully convinced that Kravstov would be a high enough value prospect at this point to be the headline of a package verse the prospect that is added in.

Then try to trade for somebody else? You seemingly want to trade for those players for a reason. And I can gaurantee you it’s not because you believe they’re worthless.

I don’t know what to tell you, Barbashev is an all situations flexible forward who isn’t the 60 point player he was last season. But he’s a 45-50 point player who is a valuable PKer and quite frequently slots up and down the lineup. A 2nd and a 3rd is a very conservative ask for that.

Tarasenko is a PPG winger who has a lot of playoff experience and his injury isn’t the same situation as it was before. It’s a broken bone from being hit in the hand with a shot.

A 1st, prospect and a 3rd is a pretty reasonable ask.

If you don’t like those prices shop for a 3rd or 4th liner. Don’t ask for guys who have been integral players for a cup run.

The jury shouldn’t be out on Kravstov yet. I’m not sure what your evaluation of him is, but I’d venture to guess he’s not going to return much more than another struggling prospect at a different position or a pick after 50.

Kravtsov is an NHL talent with solid defensive metrics at a young age. He will have a long career. Tarasenko and Barbashev are approaching UFA and Blues aren't in playoff position, get a quality young player and a 1st. Might have to add a second in the deal but Tarasenko's value is different due to his NMC. This deal assumes he approves trade to NYR.

Tarasenko has a full NTC, not a NMC although it’s not largely different. I’m comping Tarasenko close to Girouxs return. That was Tippet, a 1st 2 drafts out, and a 3rd in this draft. Philadelphia added a couple of ok prospects and a 5th in the next draft. If you were asking for Tarasenko alone I think Kravstov and the 24 1st is close. Adding on Barbashev isn’t merely a 2nd.

There’s a real chance the Blues plan on extending Barbashev.

Point being is you were pretty direct that my evaluation was overrating the players, yet you’ve doubled back to something similar to what I had said. I don’t think Kravstovs defensive metrics are terribly important as a forward tbh. There are few wingers who truly make a considerable enough impact defensively that I (and I could be wrong for doing so) generally don’t value defense all that much for wingers

We could split hairs all day long on this, but realistically it’s moot and I don’t think in general we are far off from agreeing around the basis of where a potential trade would look.

My point is a deal could make sense for both sides and get worked out. This is capfriendly anyway lol, we're just spitballing. I think my original offer was a lowball but not as far off as you make it seem.