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Whats newhooks value

Créé par: Howie
Équipe: 2022-23 Avalanche du Colorado
Date de création initiale: 17 nov. 2022
Publié: 17 nov. 2022
Mode - plafond salarial: Basique
Description
He seems to be struggling out the gate and had a meeting with the coach one on one with the expectation they have and that how he isn't meeting them to get looks at top 6. Does he get frustrated with this situation where he could use a change of scenery to help give him a different opportunity elsewhere with a different system? Just feels like he's stalling and putting the trust into him into the future may be okay but with how young he is he can learn to bounce and be effective or trade him while he is valued where a team can still mold him in their system. I understand both sides and just curious if he's stays long term, traded this season or near future and what his value is as he has the projection of a good 2c but something just isn't working.
Transactions
VAN
  1. Newhook, Alex
  2. Ranta, Sampo
  3. Choix de 5e ronde en 2023 (COL)
Détails additionnels:
Returns that fit? Would he be the main piece in bringing in a solid 2c like Horvat?
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2023
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2024
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TAILLE DE LA FORMATIONPLAFOND SALARIALCAP HITEXCÉDENTS Info-bulleBONISESPACE SOUS LE PLAFOND SALARIAL
2382 500 000 $79 395 000 $25 000 $2 925 000 $3 105 000 $
Ailier gaucheCentreAilier droit
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4 500 000 $4 500 000 $
AG, AD
UFA - 5
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6 300 000 $6 300 000 $
C
NMC
UFA - 1
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9 250 000 $9 250 000 $
AD, C
UFA - 3
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1 250 000 $1 250 000 $
AG
UFA - 1
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3 500 000 $3 500 000 $
C, AD
UFA - 1
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2 000 000 $2 000 000 $
AG, C
UFA - 1
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762 500 $762 500 $
AG, AD
UFA - 1
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1 050 000 $1 050 000 $
AD, AG
UFA - 3
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750 000 $750 000 $
AG, AD
UFA - 1
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863 333 $863 333 $ (Bonis de performance425 000 $$425K)
AD
RFA - 1
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4 125 000 $4 125 000 $
C
UFA - 1
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750 000 $750 000 $
C, AG, AD
UFA - 1
Défenseur gaucherDéfenseur droitierGardien de but
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5 000 000 $5 000 000 $
DG/DD
UFA - 5
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9 000 000 $9 000 000 $
DD
UFA - 5
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3 400 000 $3 400 000 $
G
UFA - 3
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4 100 000 $4 100 000 $
DG
UFA - 2
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6 000 000 $6 000 000 $
DD
M-NTC, NMC
UFA - 1
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2 000 000 $2 000 000 $
G
UFA - 2
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987 500 $987 500 $
DG/DD, AG
UFA - 2
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4 500 000 $4 500 000 $
DD
NTC
UFA - 4
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894 167 $894 167 $ (Bonis de performance2 500 000 $$2M)
DG/DD
RFA - 1
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762 500 $762 500 $
DG/DD
UFA - 2
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750 000 $750 000 $
DG
UFA - 1
Laissés de côtéListe des blessés (IR)Liste des blessés à long terme (LTIR)
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6 125 000 $6 125 000 $
AD, AG
NMC
UFA - 8
Logo de Avalanche du Colorado
7 000 000 $7 000 000 $
AG, C
NMC
UFA - 7
Logo de Avalanche du Colorado
750 000 $750 000 $
C
RFA - 1
Logo de Avalanche du Colorado
1 250 000 $1 250 000 $
C, AG, AD
UFA - 1

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17 nov. 2022 à 16 h 48
#1
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Newhook has been overrated for a while now just like most players/prospects are with the Avalanche. His best season is comparable to Hoglander's rookie year in terms of points.

However, the best teams tend to value their own players more since they have experience with their established system and existing chemistry and familiarity. That makes sense, but it does not mean their trade value is higher simply because of the team they're on. It just means the best teams usually don't make huge trades from their roster.
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17 nov. 2022 à 16 h 54
#2
TuckerKaberleSundin
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Probably not as much as Colorado fans think.
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17 nov. 2022 à 16 h 54
#3
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Newhook has had a slower start than we’d like. And even before the season started, I had some skepticism about whether he would be ready for the 2C role. The process has been pretty decent, the points just aren’t there yet.

That said: he’s so young and so talented. On a team where cap space is going to be harder and harder to come by. His value to a team like Colorado is higher than it is for a team like Vancouver because his contract status and cap hit allow the Avs to spend elsewhere (I.e. an expensive top 4 and top 6 wingers).
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17 nov. 2022 à 17 h 11
#4
Dr.
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He still has value, i think he is gonna need a new home to find his potential though. Colorado doesn't have time to give him the minutes to figure out his mistakes, they were hoping for a big stride this year and he is cratering. I don't see him being anything outside of your average 2C, 50~ points when a good team is rolling. I think someone will have to go to give us a 2C this year whether it be newhook or girard but we need that 2C, we quickly forgot how bad it was before kadri.
17 nov. 2022 à 17 h 27
#5
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Quoting: ArakinSkywalker
He still has value, i think he is gonna need a new home to find his potential though. Colorado doesn't have time to give him the minutes to figure out his mistakes, they were hoping for a big stride this year and he is cratering. I don't see him being anything outside of your average 2C, 50~ points when a good team is rolling. I think someone will have to go to give us a 2C this year whether it be newhook or girard but we need that 2C, we quickly forgot how bad it was before kadri.


Yeah thats why I feel they would rather trade him then a first in a stacked class for a really good 2c maybe trade someone else but the quality of 2c that would be able to make the impact would decrease significantly
17 nov. 2022 à 17 h 43
#6
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Quoting: ArakinSkywalker
He still has value, i think he is gonna need a new home to find his potential though. Colorado doesn't have time to give him the minutes to figure out his mistakes, they were hoping for a big stride this year and he is cratering. I don't see him being anything outside of your average 2C, 50~ points when a good team is rolling. I think someone will have to go to give us a 2C this year whether it be newhook or girard but we need that 2C, we quickly forgot how bad it was before kadri.


Quoting: Howie
Yeah thats why I feel they would rather trade him then a first in a stacked class for a really good 2c maybe trade someone else but the quality of 2c that would be able to make the impact would decrease significantly


Newhook is in his 2nd year. Let's chill out on the change of scenery needs, this isn't Jost. I doubt they would trade him for a rental or someone overpaid and that doesn't leave many options.
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17 nov. 2022 à 18 h 0
#7
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Quoting: MeetYourMakar
Newhook is in his 2nd year. Let's chill out on the change of scenery needs, this isn't Jost. I doubt they would trade him for a rental or someone overpaid and that doesn't leave many options.


I understand what you're saying, he's 22 this january he's super young but colorados window is right now. it's a gamble to wait and see what a guys potential could be when mack and rants are playing their best hockey right now. I don't see newhook being ready for another 2 years with his current play and do we want to just have a hole there for those two years? We've had that before kadri, we had it when kadri was suspended, not having an actual 2C in playoffs gets exploited pretty quickly. We don't have to burn newhook for anyone but if we want a quality center we will have to give up a quality piece. I'm all for keeping him and moving girard but i think that 2C is going to be our achilles heel till we find someone who can play it again
17 nov. 2022 à 21 h 28
#8
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Quoting: Canucks33
Newhook has been overrated for a while now just like most players/prospects are with the Avalanche. His best season is comparable to Hoglander's rookie year in terms of points.

However, the best teams tend to value their own players more since they have experience with their established system and existing chemistry and familiarity. That makes sense, but it does not mean their trade value is higher simply because of the team they're on. It just means the best teams usually don't make huge trades from their roster.


hes in this second season, what the heck are you even going on about. He hasn't even played 100 NHL games yet
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17 nov. 2022 à 21 h 28
#9
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Modifié 17 nov. 2022 à 21 h 37
Quoting: ArakinSkywalker
He still has value, i think he is gonna need a new home to find his potential though. Colorado doesn't have time to give him the minutes to figure out his mistakes, they were hoping for a big stride this year and he is cratering. I don't see him being anything outside of your average 2C, 50~ points when a good team is rolling. I think someone will have to go to give us a 2C this year whether it be newhook or girard but we need that 2C, we quickly forgot how bad it was before kadri.


this literally makes 0 sense, Find his potential. Hes in his 2nd nhl season and hasn't even played 100 career games yet.
That is like saying they should have traded MacKinnon in his second season bc he wasn't a ppg player yet
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17 nov. 2022 à 22 h 4
#10
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Quoting: ArakinSkywalker
I understand what you're saying, he's 22 this january he's super young but colorados window is right now. it's a gamble to wait and see what a guys potential could be when mack and rants are playing their best hockey right now. I don't see newhook being ready for another 2 years with his current play and do we want to just have a hole there for those two years? We've had that before kadri, we had it when kadri was suspended, not having an actual 2C in playoffs gets exploited pretty quickly. We don't have to burn newhook for anyone but if we want a quality center we will have to give up a quality piece. I'm all for keeping him and moving girard but i think that 2C is going to be our achilles heel till we find someone who can play it again


What is your solution for next season at 2c and 3c? Jtc will be gone and in this acgm so is Newhook and Horvat/rental. This is how you close a window. Trading the '23 or '24 1st will happen before they move a main roster player for a rental. Toews probably won't even cost that much.
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17 nov. 2022 à 23 h 58
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Quoting: coga16
hes in this second season, what the heck are you even going on about. He hasn't even played 100 NHL games yet


The idea that the Avs wouldn't even consider moving Newhook for a massive upgrade at center to win now because of value is absurd. Maybe they'd rather not give up on a young player, which is fine. But to say Newhook is more valuable than Horvat if you're trying to win the Cup this year is crazy.
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18 nov. 2022 à 0 h 26
#12
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Modifié 18 nov. 2022 à 0 h 33
Quoting: Canucks33
The idea that the Avs wouldn't even consider moving Newhook for a massive upgrade at center to win now because of value is absurd. Maybe they'd rather not give up on a young player, which is fine. But to say Newhook is more valuable than Horvat if you're trying to win the Cup this year is crazy.


At no point did I say that
And you clearly have no paid attention to the avs and how they have built their roster of the years of you think they do that kind of move

They don’t burn assets recklessly on rentals, this isn’t rocket science
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18 nov. 2022 à 0 h 44
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Quoting: coga16
At no point did I say that
And you clearly have no paid attention to the avs and how they have built their roster of the years of you think they do that kind of move

They don’t burn assets recklessly on rentals, this isn’t rocket science


Timmins + 1st for 1 year of Kuemper? Manson was a rental when they acquired him, they just happened to re-sign him later.
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18 nov. 2022 à 7 h 50
#14
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Quoting: ArakinSkywalker
He still has value, i think he is gonna need a new home to find his potential though. Colorado doesn't have time to give him the minutes to figure out his mistakes, they were hoping for a big stride this year and he is cratering. I don't see him being anything outside of your average 2C, 50~ points when a good team is rolling. I think someone will have to go to give us a 2C this year whether it be newhook or girard but we need that 2C, we quickly forgot how bad it was before kadri.


Doesn't have time to give a player the minutes he needs to develop? A player who plays a position of need for them? Something's not adding up
18 nov. 2022 à 7 h 52
#15
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Quoting: coga16
At no point did I say that
And you clearly have no paid attention to the avs and how they have built their roster of the years of you think they do that kind of move

They don’t burn assets recklessly on rentals, this isn’t rocket science


They did with Kuemper, and there was no guarantee that Manson was coming back in the off-season
18 nov. 2022 à 7 h 52
#16
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Quoting: MeetYourMakar
What is your solution for next season at 2c and 3c? Jtc will be gone and in this acgm so is Newhook and Horvat/rental. This is how you close a window. Trading the '23 or '24 1st will happen before they move a main roster player for a rental. Toews probably won't even cost that much.


You sure Compher won't be re-signed?
18 nov. 2022 à 8 h 3
#17
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Quoting: Knuckl3s
They did with Kuemper, and there was no guarantee that Manson was coming back in the off-season


Manson they knew they could keep, kuemper they had no other choice bc of Seattle over paying for grubauer

You are agreeejng with my point,in 10 years Sakics front office has traded the 1st round pick once,

Why on Earth do you think they would trade a 1st and a young nhler for a rental they can’t not keep, they do not operate like that,
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18 nov. 2022 à 8 h 6
#18
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Quoting: coga16
Manson they knew they could keep, kuemper they had no other choice bc of Seattle over paying for grubauer

You are agreeejng with my point,in 10 years Sakics front office has traded the 1st round pick once,

Why on Earth do you think they would trade a 1st and a young nhler for a rental they can’t not keep, they do not operate like that,


Avalanche are trying to win NOW, not later
18 nov. 2022 à 8 h 7
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Quoting: Knuckl3s
You sure Compher won't be re-signed?


Unless he takes a paycut, he’s gone. He’s a very useful player, but the Avs need him to be $1-2M cheaper to fit within their cap structure.
18 nov. 2022 à 8 h 7
#20
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Quoting: turtlemountain
Unless he takes a paycut, he’s gone. He’s a very useful player, but the Avs need him to be $1-2M cheaper to fit within their cap structure.


And he's not worth 3 million? Would you consider the 4 x 3.5M contract he signed several years ago a mistake by Sakic?
18 nov. 2022 à 8 h 15
#21
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Quoting: Knuckl3s
Avalanche are trying to win NOW, not later


They can be winning now and not make reckless trades. You know smart front offices do exist. Look at Florida they tried to win trading everything they have and now they burned their future and didn’t even get anywhere

Stop pretending like Horvat is The only trade they can make, they have other options to improve
18 nov. 2022 à 8 h 15
#22
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Quoting: coga16
They can be winning now and not make reckless trades. You like smart front offices do exist

Stop pretending like Horvat is The only trade they can make, they have other options to improve


It's not a reckless trade if it makes the team better NOW
18 nov. 2022 à 8 h 18
#23
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Quoting: Knuckl3s
It's not a reckless trade if it makes the team better NOW


It’s a reckless trade moving a young nhler who is cost controlled off your roster for a rental you can’t keep

Dude this is not rocket science, avs are not a dumb front office. They aren’t reckless in their trades, they are the opposite of that, they are beyond patient, Sakic and Macfarland set a price on something, if they can’t get it done at that cost they move on. They don’t over pay for rentals or get into bidding wars
18 nov. 2022 à 8 h 18
#24
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Quoting: coga16
At no point did I say that
And you clearly have no paid attention to the avs and how they have built their roster of the years of you think they do that kind of move

They don’t burn assets recklessly on rentals, this isn’t rocket science


Quoting: Knuckl3s
They did with Kuemper, and there was no guarantee that Manson was coming back in the off-season


Recklessly is being ignored here. Kuemper was an overpay for a rental but they were close to the season and in a bidding war. Manson was a total gamble n many believed he was going to go back to the Ducks. He was exactly what the Avs needed, but unlike Kuemper he wasn't traded for a roster player. That is a huge difference when a team is chasing cups.

Quoting: Canucks33
The idea that the Avs wouldn't even consider moving Newhook for a massive upgrade at center to win now because of value is absurd. Maybe they'd rather not give up on a young player, which is fine. But to say Newhook is more valuable than Horvat if you're trying to win the Cup this year is crazy.


Their plan isn't just to win a the cup this year, it's to win cups this year, and next year, and the next year, and the next year, group meeting to be held about following year. To say they wouldn't consider it, isn't true but it wouldn't take long to reject. Maybe if Horvat had a 7m extention with 2m retained by Canucks, the Avs would do it. His shooting % is a lil sus too.
18 nov. 2022 à 8 h 21
#25
Banni
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Quoting: coga16
It’s a reckless trade moving a young nhler who is cost controlled off your roster for a rental you can’t keep

Dude this is not rocket science, avs are not a dumb front office. They aren’t reckless in their trades, they are the opposite of that, they are beyond patient, Sakic and Macfarland set a price on something, if they can’t get it done at that cost they move on. They don’t over pay for rentals or get into bidding wars


Newhook's ceiling is in serious question right now with the lack of scoring he's put up IN A CONTRACT YEAR, plus he isn't a defensive ace either. It's not looking like he'll ever reach Horvat's ceiling. There were most certainly in a bidding war with Kuemper, and probably Manson to a degree. Lehkonen obviously doesn't count cause he was a pending RFA
 
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