Quoting: oliver_wahlstrom
Again, what part of your comment did I miss?
and lets go through the trades. Ill do the work for you:
Giroux: 2024 first-round pick, a 2023 third-round pick and forward Owen Tippett, with the first-round pick being top-10 protected. That isnt even close to what Ehlers got
Lindhom: Urho Vaakanainen, John Moore, a 2022 first-round draft pick, a 2023 second-round draft pick and a 2024 second-round draft pick. Thats not close to this, but that also included a cap dump. So a first, two 2nds and cap dump for Lindholm makes approximate sense for how the market was at that time.
Copp: Even tho at the time it was even less with conditions, the trade ended up being 30OVR, 55OVR and Morgan Barron. Thats much less than what I have here AND is after every condition was met.
So these arent equal returns, or even close.
I have no idea what I cherry picked? What part of your arguement did I not mention? Ill assess it all again here:
- First part doesnt matter, fans of any team can have opinions on anything
- hawks didnt blunder, they got tons of offers and picked the best one
- you want to see more comps --> yeah so do I. thats what i am asking for, yet nobody has given a comp that proves me wrong
1. You did say I was wrong when you said you disagreed - I didn't say you were wrong, literally said I might be wrong lol it's an opinion, just like yours
2. Liking Ehlers--> I like Wahlstrom, doesnt mean he is worth 10 picks - cherry picked reasoning
Didn't think I'd have to spell out the context (which really matters) but here you go:
A first and a top prospect for Giroux isn't far off the Cat return, especially when you factor in it was for 3 months of service and Philly had 0 leverage since this is the only place Giroux was willing to go.
A first & 2 2s for Lindholm is pretty close to a 1 2 3 that Cat got which you were using as a comp. Sure it included a small cap dump but an in season trade to a team that was selling and had cap space isn't the same as a true cap dump in the off season to solely clear space - most in season trades have salary coming back, especially in a tight cap world like we're in today. It's also, again, for 3 months of service.
A first, second & a Bish prospect is again pretty close to the Cat return, and yet again it was for 3 months of service.
How about Hagel? 2 firsts and a couple prospects / cheap players which makes sense since there's more team control involved in that one, but the return is pretty close to Cat return which is crazy b/c Cat is way better than Hagel (in other words this is a data point showing Cat deal was bungled).
I mean geez, even Dvorak got a 1st and a 2nd and he's half the player Cat is lol
I had no conviction in my opinion before but the more you think back at recent examples and dig into the data points / comps, the more it shows that the Cat deal was in fact an outlier so if that's what you're basing your trades off it's not a good example.
I'm sure this won't be enough for you and you'll discount the context of each scenario though