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Remaining Suitors for JT

Créé par: qwertymann
Équipe: 2022-23 Canucks de Vancouver
Date de création initiale: 18 juill. 2022
Publié: 18 juill. 2022
Mode - plafond salarial: Basique
Transactions
1.
VAN
  1. Carlo, Brandon
  2. Langenbrunner, Mason [Liste de réserve]
  3. Choix de 2e ronde en 2025 (BOS)
2.
VAN
  1. Bear, Ethan [Droits de RFA]
  2. Morrow, Scott [Liste de réserve]
  3. Choix de 2e ronde en 2023 (CAR)
CAR
    1. Miller, J.T.
    3.
    VAN
    1. Dobson, Noah [Droits de RFA]
    NYI
      1. Miller, J.T.
      4.
      VAN
      1. Lundkvist, Nils
      2. Choix de 1e ronde en 2023 (NYR)
      3. Choix de 3e ronde en 2025 (NYR)
      NYR
        1. Miller, J.T.
        5.
        VAN
        1. Liljegren, Timothy
        2. Choix de 1e ronde en 2023 (TOR)
        TOR
          1. Miller, J.T.
          6.
          VAN
          1. Dumba, Matt (750 000 $ retained)
          2. Choix de 1e ronde en 2023 (MIN)
          3. Choix de 3e ronde en 2024 (MIN)
          MIN
          Rachats de contrats
          Repêchage1e ronde2e ronde3e ronde4e ronde5e ronde6e ronde7e ronde
          2023
          Logo de VAN
          Logo de NYR
          Logo de TOR
          Logo de MIN
          Logo de VAN
          Logo de CAR
          Logo de VAN
          Logo de VAN
          Logo de NYR
          Logo de VAN
          Logo de VAN
          2024
          Logo de VAN
          Logo de VAN
          Logo de VAN
          Logo de MIN
          Logo de VAN
          Logo de VAN
          Logo de VAN
          Logo de VAN
          2025
          Logo de VAN
          Logo de VAN
          Logo de BOS
          Logo de VAN
          Logo de NYR
          Logo de VAN
          Logo de VAN
          Logo de VAN
          Logo de VAN
          TAILLE DE LA FORMATIONPLAFOND SALARIALCAP HITEXCÉDENTS Info-bulleBONISESPACE SOUS LE PLAFOND SALARIAL
          2382 500 000 $86 801 667 $1 250 000 $2 850 000 $-4 301 667 $
          Ailier gaucheCentreAilier droit
          Logo de Canucks de Vancouver
          7 350 000 $7 350 000 $
          C, AG
          UFA - 2
          Logo de Canucks de Vancouver
          6 650 000 $6 650 000 $
          AD
          UFA - 3
          Logo de Canucks de Vancouver
          4 750 000 $4 750 000 $
          AG, AD
          M-NTC
          UFA - 4
          Logo de Canucks de Vancouver
          4 125 000 $4 125 000 $
          C
          UFA - 1
          Logo de Canucks de Vancouver
          4 950 000 $4 950 000 $
          AD, AG
          UFA - 4
          Logo de Canucks de Vancouver
          3 250 000 $3 250 000 $
          AG
          M-NTC
          UFA - 2
          Logo de Canucks de Vancouver
          2 650 000 $2 650 000 $
          C, AG
          UFA - 2
          Logo de Canucks de Vancouver
          950 000 $950 000 $ (Bonis de performance850 000 $$850K)
          AG, AD
          UFA - 1
          Logo de Canucks de Vancouver
          1 000 000 $1 000 000 $
          AD, C
          UFA - 3
          Logo de Canucks de Vancouver
          925 000 $925 000 $ (Bonis de performance850 000 $$850K)
          AD, AG
          RFA - 2
          Logo de Canucks de Vancouver
          750 000 $750 000 $
          C, AG
          UFA - 1
          Défenseur gaucherDéfenseur droitierGardien de but
          Logo de Canucks de Vancouver
          7 850 000 $7 850 000 $
          DG
          UFA - 5
          Logo de Canucks de Vancouver
          6 000 000 $6 000 000 $
          DD
          M-NTC
          UFA - 2
          Logo de Canucks de Vancouver
          5 000 000 $5 000 000 $
          G
          UFA - 4
          Logo de Canucks de Vancouver
          7 260 000 $7 260 000 $
          DG
          NMC
          UFA - 5
          Logo de Canucks de Vancouver
          850 000 $850 000 $
          DD
          UFA - 1
          Logo de Canucks de Vancouver
          762 500 $762 500 $
          G
          UFA - 2
          Logo de Canucks de Vancouver
          1 500 000 $1 500 000 $
          DG/DD
          UFA - 1
          Logo de Canucks de Vancouver
          750 000 $750 000 $
          DG/DD
          UFA - 1
          Logo de Bruins de Boston
          4 100 000 $4 100 000 $
          DD
          UFA - 5
          Logo de Rangers de New York
          925 000 $925 000 $ (Bonis de performance850 000 $$850K)
          DD
          RFA - 2
          Logo de Maple Leafs de Toronto
          1 400 000 $1 400 000 $
          DD
          RFA - 2
          Logo de Wild du Minnesota
          5 250 000 $5 250 000 $
          DD
          M-NTC
          UFA - 1
          Laissés de côtéListe des blessés (IR)Liste des blessés à long terme (LTIR)
          Logo de Canucks de Vancouver
          2 500 000 $2 500 000 $
          DD
          UFA - 3
          Logo de Canucks de Vancouver
          3 500 000 $3 500 000 $
          AG, AD
          M-NTC
          UFA - 1
          Logo de Canucks de Vancouver
          891 667 $891 667 $ (Bonis de performance300 000 $$300K)
          AG, AD
          RFA - 1
          Logo de Canucks de Vancouver
          762 500 $762 500 $
          DD
          UFA - 1

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          18 juill. 2022 à 13 h 23
          #26
          Islanders Fan
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          Quoting: qwertymann
          Because the value that a young, NHL-ready, Top-4 RHD brings is greater than the 1st or the B level prospect that ISNT a RHD


          My point is the Isles don't trade Dobson because based on other offers on this ACGM they could trade different pieces and still acquire Miller for "less"
          18 juill. 2022 à 13 h 23
          #27
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          Quoting: cooliny
          Imo Dumba would have to be replaced with Addison or Faber to make talks worthwhile


          And I don't see that happening on our end, which is exactly why I think our offer would be beat. I personally wouldn't be opposed to swapping Addison for Dumba in a deal like that for Miller, but Miller would have to come with a reasonable extension (at or under $8M AAV) for me to stomach that. Again though, I just think Dumba, a protected pick, and Jost is probably the best offer Guerin would be willing to make.
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          18 juill. 2022 à 13 h 28
          #28
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          Quoting: joshelkin
          My point is the Isles don't trade Dobson because based on other offers on this ACGM they could trade different pieces and still acquire Miller for "less"


          How likely is Bode Wilde to be a Top-4 NHL Dman?
          18 juill. 2022 à 13 h 28
          #29
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          Quoting: qwertymann
          Dude, read the room. This ACGM was to see if there were any suitors missing (ie. I missed Minny). I dont see how a NYI/VAN trade makes sense either but it was done at the draft so the actual GMs of those teams think there is a match. I am just saying that is the only NYI piece that makes sense for VAN from my perspective. If you have an adequate grasp of reading comprehension then you could have saved BOTH of your comments.


          You clearly don’t have a grasp on what Miller is worth in a trade. The deal at the draft was most likely something around 2022 1st , 2nd + a prospect like Simon Holmstrom.
          18 juill. 2022 à 13 h 29
          #30
          Islanders Fan
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          Quoting: qwertymann
          How likely is Bode Wilde to be a Top-4 NHL Dman?


          If he got his vaccine it would be way more likely because Lou is keeping him in overseas exile. I like the player though
          18 juill. 2022 à 13 h 31
          #31
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          Quoting: Db1899
          You clearly don’t have a grasp on what Miller is worth in a trade. The deal at the draft was most likely something around 2022 1st , 2nd + a prospect like Simon Holmstrom.


          Are you still going?? I have acknowledged the discrepancy in Value with a Miller/Dobson swap... I am just saying that is the only NYI piece that makes sense for VAN from my perspective (I copy/pasted this sentence from my last response, seems you keep missing this)
          18 juill. 2022 à 13 h 39
          #32
          Banni
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          Easiest pass in history for the Rangers.
          18 juill. 2022 à 13 h 43
          #33
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          Quoting: Fotiu4U
          Easiest pass in history for the Rangers.


          Idk how many times we have to go over this but NYR offered more than this at the TDL and was rejected by VAN... this is a fair trade
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          18 juill. 2022 à 13 h 58
          #34
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          Quoting: qwertymann
          I read somewhere (maybe from Jeff Marek) that the Trocheck signing DOESNT take them out of the JT sweepstakes. Kind of makes sense since they lost Copp AND Strome.


          where does the cap space come from then?
          Copp AND Strome were never both coming back and Trocheck replaces Copp OR Strome.
          18 juill. 2022 à 14 h 0
          #35
          Lets Get Kraken
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          You can take Carolina off the suitors list.
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          18 juill. 2022 à 14 h 11
          #36
          westleysnipez
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          Quoting: TanSor
          I think our best offer is something like Dumba, top 10-15 protected 1st, and Jost. I have a hard time believing that offer wouldn't be beat


          In my opinion, that's a worse offer than Lundkvist + Chytil + Rangers' 1st that was denied at TDL.

          Dumba is a UFA next season, Jost is worse than Chytil, and the Minnesota 1st with Miller on the team likely comes in around 17-25 anyway.

          Canucks would need Faber/Addison + 2023 1st (Top-10 protected, sure) + Beckman/Khusnutdinov + Jost (for cap reasons), more if Miller was being retained.
          18 juill. 2022 à 14 h 19
          #37
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          Quoting: westleysnipez
          In my opinion, that's a worse offer than Lundkvist + Chytil + Rangers' 1st that was denied at TDL.

          Dumba is a UFA next season, Jost is worse than Chytil, and the Minnesota 1st with Miller on the team likely comes in around 17-25 anyway.

          Canucks would need Faber/Addison + 2023 1st (Top-10 protected, sure) + Beckman/Khusnutdinov + Jost (for cap reasons), more if Miller was being retained.


          We don't need retention, but again: I think our best offer would be Dumba, top 10-15 protected 1st, and Jost which as I've said all along I don't see how that offer is not beat.

          I don't see any way we move Faber, I could see Addison but I don't think Guerin would move him for a rental. Beckman/Khusnutdinov would surprise me, especially Khusnutdinov since we need centers, considering we have $13-14M in dead cap the next few years and will need ELC forwards.

          I love Miller but I just don't think we'll be the team that pays the price for him.
          18 juill. 2022 à 14 h 22
          #38
          LongtimeLeafsufferer
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          Really I don't see a market for Miller now. Now if a "name" forward gets injured during the season or a TDL to a contender might be the Canucks only option. Of course the Canucks are hoping Miller is on pace to a 100 point season like last year instead of more traditional 70 point season.
          18 juill. 2022 à 14 h 35
          #39
          we miss leo k
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          Reading more of the thread's conversation, I just wanted to jump in and say I think it's really limiting the return to just focus on getting an RD back, because these values are flying all over the place when you do that.

          BOS: Brandon Carlo is a decent defensive D (21-49-70 in 403 GP) who's 25 and has a reasonable 5x$4.1M deal. Mason Langenbrunner is a 5th round pick from 2020 who hasn't shown up on any Bruins prospect lists that I can find. A 2025 2nd has lower value since it's, y'know, three drafts away and hard to judge where it might land. This deal feels like a slam dunk for the Bruins to make if they want to keep pushing for the playoffs this year.

          CAR: Ethan Bear is 25 and also is another less offensively-minded RHD (13-34-47 in 190 GP). Morrow is considered to be *at worst* Carolina's #2 prospect, plus what's probably a late 2nd in this year's deep draft class. This is too much, IMO, and way more valuable than the Boston offer (would you trade Carlo/Langenbrunner/2025 2nd for Bear/Morrow/2023 2nd?)

          NYI: Dobson is the youngest NHL regular mentioned so far (22), and in 2021-22 he outscored Bear's career numbers (13-38-51) and got within shouting distance of Carlo's 403-game career scoring output. He's a much different player than anyone on the list so far, and I wouldn't consider trading him for either the Boston or Carolina packages, much less one-for-one with a walk year JT Miller. Even if he doesn't advance past this year's level, an RHD who can score 45-50 points while still being strong in his own end is a top-tier asset.

          NYR: Lundkvist just came over to North America as a 21-year-old this year and held his own, so the Top-4 upside he came over from Sweden with should still hold. I don't hate the idea of the Rangers trading him since they have a handful of good-looking D prospects, but I also don't think adding a 1st & a 3rd to Lundkvist is necessary. He's more valuable than Bear, Carlo, or Langenbrunner to me and if the ask is NIls++, I pass.

          TOR: This probably gets closest, to me? Liljegren is 23, has some experience in the NHL (5-18-23 in 61 GP this year) and should have room to grow. The pick is most likely in the mid/late 20s, so while it's a deep draft class, I can see the value being there for one year of Miller. But then you run into the problem that Toronto has no cap space - even if you fully retain on Miller, they *still* need to move out cap to make this deal work. I can't see the Leafs as a viable destination for Miller right now because of that.

          MIN: This value is completely weird. Dumba is a pending UFA making $6M who has settled in as a 35-40 point D per 82 GP. So I'm not sure why a cap-strapped Minnesota is a)retaining and b)adding so much draft capital to get a player in Miller who makes them slightly better offensively but forces them to push up a player that might not be ready into every day minutes. I don't know why you wouldn't ask for Calen Addison here if you're dead-set on getting an RHD.

          So yeah, I agree with the poster earlier who said the values are out of whack. I wouldn't move any of the other 5 deals for the Boston deal, and I honestly don't think any of the other 5 deals would get you Noah Dobson. And I seriously think if you get tunnel vision on filling a specific need with a JT Miller trade, you're going to get a weaker return or shut out other potential trade partners who might not be as flush in that asset.
          18 juill. 2022 à 15 h 15
          #40
          Banni
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          Quoting: qwertymann
          Idk how many times we have to go over this but NYR offered more than this at the TDL and was rejected by VAN... this is a fair trade


          Each time you conveniently omit that the supposed offer is a rumor AND if true, it would have been for 2 playoff runs, not just one, which is worth A LOT LESS. Easy PASS from the Rangers on your JT Miller rental.
           
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