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A dream that wouldnt happen MKII

Créé par: Mystaes
Équipe: 2022-23 Red Wings de Detroit
Date de création initiale: 10 juin 2022
Publié: 11 juin 2022
Mode - plafond salarial: Basique
Description
1) brought back the old well liked version of the monahan trade - Detroit gets a second and monahan Calgary gets massive cap relief and a strong middle six option with retention - at only 1.625m

2) Poolparty being available, I can see the oilers wanting either capspace or players but not primarily picks. So I offer them to get rid of kassian (as we need people eating salary anyways). 3.2m is a lot of flexibility (how the hell are you paying him this!?!). Might need tweaking. Original version had used pius but comments indicated he wouldn’t be of interest with retention

3) edited the bert trade to Carolina for a second instead of a 1st + necas

Someone else I’d love to target is Dach but given I already have 3 acquisitions here....
Signatures de joueurs autonomes
RFAANSCAP HIT
2850 000 $
21 750 000 $
31 100 000 $
22 500 000 $
24 000 000 $
UFAANSCAP HIT
12 000 000 $
45 500 000 $
55 500 000 $
Transactions
1.
DET
  1. Monahan, Sean
  2. Choix de 2e ronde en 2022 (CGY)
CGY
  1. Suter, Pius (1 625 000 $ retained)
2.
DET
  1. Necas, Martin [Droits de RFA]
  2. Choix de 2e ronde en 2022 (CAR)
CAR
  1. Bertuzzi, Tyler (2 375 000 $ retained)
3.
EDM
4.
DET
ARI
  1. Erne, Adam
Détails additionnels:
To anyone for anything. Suitable player but no room.
Rachats de contrats
Transactions impliquant une retenue de salaire
Repêchage1e ronde2e ronde3e ronde4e ronde5e ronde6e ronde7e ronde
2022
Logo de DET
Logo de DET
Logo de WSH
Logo de CGY
Logo de CAR
Logo de DET
Logo de DET
Logo de COL
Logo de VGK
Logo de DET
Logo de DET
Logo de LAK
2023
Logo de DET
Logo de DET
Logo de STL
Logo de DET
Logo de DET
Logo de DET
Logo de DET
Logo de DET
2024
Logo de DET
Logo de DET
Logo de DET
Logo de DET
Logo de DAL
Logo de DET
Logo de DET
Logo de DET
TAILLE DE LA FORMATIONPLAFOND SALARIALCAP HITEXCÉDENTS Info-bulleBONISESPACE SOUS LE PLAFOND SALARIAL
2382 500 000 $71 993 056 $0 $3 857 500 $10 506 944 $
Ailier gaucheCentreAilier droit
Logo de Red Wings de Detroit
925 000 $925 000 $ (Bonis de performance2 500 000 $$2M)
AD, AG
RFA - 2
Logo de Red Wings de Detroit
6 100 000 $6 100 000 $
C
NTC
UFA - 1
2 500 000 $2 500 000 $
AD
UFA - 1
5 500 000 $5 500 000 $
C, AG, AD
UFA - 5
4 000 000 $4 000 000 $
AD
RFA - 2
Logo de Red Wings de Detroit
2 625 000 $2 625 000 $
AG
UFA - 2
Logo de Red Wings de Detroit
894 167 $894 167 $ (Bonis de performance425 000 $$425K)
C
RFA - 1
Logo de Red Wings de Detroit
925 000 $925 000 $
AD, AG
RFA - 2
Logo de Red Wings de Detroit
1 750 000 $1 750 000 $
AD, AG
RFA - 3
Logo de Flames de Calgary
6 375 000 $6 375 000 $
C, AG, AD
M-NTC
UFA - 1
Logo de Red Wings de Detroit
2 750 000 $2 750 000 $
AD, C
UFA - 1
Logo de Red Wings de Detroit
1 460 000 $1 460 000 $
AG, C
UFA - 2
Défenseur gaucherDéfenseur droitierGardien de but
Logo de Red Wings de Detroit
820 000 $820 000 $ (Bonis de performance82 500 $$82K)
DG
RFA - 2
Logo de Red Wings de Detroit
863 333 $863 333 $ (Bonis de performance850 000 $$850K)
DD
RFA - 2
Logo de Red Wings de Detroit
3 000 000 $3 000 000 $
G
UFA - 1
Logo de Red Wings de Detroit
925 000 $925 000 $
DG
RFA - 4
Logo de Red Wings de Detroit
4 400 000 $4 400 000 $
DD
RFA - 2
Logo de Red Wings de Detroit
1 100 000 $1 100 000 $
DG
UFA - 1
Logo de Red Wings de Detroit
850 000 $850 000 $
DD
RFA - 1
5 500 000 $5 500 000 $
G
UFA - 5
Laissés de côtéListe des blessés (IR)Liste des blessés à long terme (LTIR)
Logo de Red Wings de Detroit
1 350 000 $1 350 000 $
DG/DD
UFA - 1
Logo de Red Wings de Detroit
4 000 000 $4 000 000 $
AG
UFA - 3
Logo de Red Wings de Detroit
2 000 000 $2 000 000 $
DG
UFA - 1
Logo de Oilers d'Edmonton
3 200 000 $3 200 000 $
AD
UFA - 2

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Best/Most realistic trade
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11 juin 2022 à 19 h 27
#1
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i think flames are gonna have to pay a little more to dump Monohan. Leafs payed a 1st to dump Marleau with a very similar contract when cap space wasn't stagnant
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11 juin 2022 à 19 h 31
#2
LongtimeLeafsufferer
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Some good thoughts on the trades. Like the UFA signings.
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11 juin 2022 à 19 h 31
#3
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Quoting: Santa
i think flames are gonna have to pay a little more to dump Monohan. Leafs payed a 1st to dump Marleau with a very similar contract when cap space wasn't stagnant


If we can get more/don’t have to dump Suter for the second I’m pretty down. But there are those who believe he has “some” value or isn’t quite a full 2nd to dump on his own,
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11 juin 2022 à 19 h 33
#4
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Not a chance Edmonton accepts that. Kassian's buyout would cost them just $675k next year, they aren't throwing in Puljujarvi to move him.
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11 juin 2022 à 19 h 33
#5
Fire Treliving
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If I'm Calgary I take that offer and run, have to pay a second but you rid yourself of Monahan and the cap hit for Suter half retained. That's a great deal for Calgary, you get a third line centre and you get relief for the free agents
11 juin 2022 à 19 h 39
#6
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Quoting: hunter4321
If I'm Calgary I take that offer and run, have to pay a second but you rid yourself of Monahan and the cap hit for Suter half retained. That's a great deal for Calgary, you get a third line centre and you get relief for the free agents


So probably went too far in the other direction then? (2nd And monahan for future considerations was considered too expensive). The cheap third line Center and salary cap are supposed to be really enticing to Calgary. Maybe I should add another pick coming back?
11 juin 2022 à 19 h 42
#7
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Quoting: CD282
Not a chance Edmonton accepts that. Kassian's buyout would cost them just $675k next year, they aren't throwing in Puljujarvi to move him.


What’s a realistic PP trade look like given it seems he’s out in Edmonton? Would foegele dump be better? Certainly not picks?
11 juin 2022 à 19 h 48
#8
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Quoting: Mystaes
What’s a realistic PP trade look like given it seems he’s out in Edmonton? Would foegele dump be better? Certainly not picks?

Why do you think he's out in Edmonton? I'm not seeing any justification for that.
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11 juin 2022 à 19 h 51
#9
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Quoting: CD282
Why do you think he's out in Edmonton? I'm not seeing any justification for that.


Holland’s interview. The reports from credible insiders. The cap situation while they still need significant changes and a goalie.
11 juin 2022 à 20 h 3
#10
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Quoting: Mystaes
Holland’s interview. The reports from credible insiders. The cap situation while they still need significant changes and a goalie.

Holland was asked about Puljujarvi's next contract and responded that he hasn't talked to his agent yet. What about that indicates that Puljujarvi is on his way out??

In any case, your valuation is all wrong. Puljujarvi's on-ice impact was top-5 in the league this year, he's not a throw-in.
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11 juin 2022 à 20 h 18
#11
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As long as you sign Copp I'm good with the Monahan trade. I don't like losing Bertuzzi but that might be worth it. But I don't think Carolina would accept that. I'm not big on JP and I never have been so.....
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11 juin 2022 à 20 h 23
#12
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Quoting: aedoran
As long as you sign Copp I'm good with the Monahan trade. I don't like losing Bertuzzi but that might be worth it. But I don't think Carolina would accept that. I'm not big on JP and I never have been so.....


The Carolina fans I’ve seen said Necas + bear would be their starter offer. But Necas + 1st was also slightly too much. So this was the compromise.

As for PP no one seems to be consistent with his value at all. He’s either the messiah or not worth it. And everytime I ask someone to clarify they don’t present an alternative. So might just drop that for mkiii. Lots of right wingers with this anyways.
11 juin 2022 à 20 h 37
#13
Lets Get Kraken
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Quoting: CD282
Holland was asked about Puljujarvi's next contract and responded that he hasn't talked to his agent yet. What about that indicates that Puljujarvi is on his way out??

In any case, your valuation is all wrong. Puljujarvi's on-ice impact was top-5 in the league this year, he's not a throw-in.


So he was top 5 in the league, but can’t score to save his life while playing with McDavid? Sounds about right why he would be on his way out. Whether PJ’s on ice impact was top 5 or bottom 5 in the league isn’t what matters to other teams. First glance they will see he played with McDavid for most of the season and couldn’t even put up 40 points. If he can’t even do that with McDavid, what’s the likelihood other teams can get more offensive production out of him. He is elite defensively, and would more than likely benefit from going to a team that actually has a structured defensive game, but his offensive game is not good enough to warrant him to get anything more than a 2nd in most people’s eyes.

As for the Canes trade, I’m not sure Canes do that since it seems they are running it back. Valuation is fine albeit probably still a bit high since Necas still can take that next step.
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11 juin 2022 à 20 h 44
#14
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Quoting: evelutions2
So he was top 5 in the league, but can’t score to save his life while playing with McDavid? Sounds about right why he would be on his way out. Whether PJ’s on ice impact was top 5 or bottom 5 in the league isn’t what matters to other teams. First glance they will see he played with McDavid for most of the season and couldn’t even put up 40 points. If he can’t even do that with McDavid, what’s the likelihood other teams can get more offensive production out of him. He is elite defensively, and would more than likely benefit from going to a team that actually has a structured defensive game, but his offensive game is not good enough to warrant him to get anything more than a 2nd in most people’s eyes.

As for the Canes trade, I’m not sure Canes do that since it seems they are running it back. Valuation is fine albeit probably still a bit high since Necas still can take that next step.


That was more or less the view. Kassian 3.2m hit for 2 years to avoid a buyout affecting them for 4 would be ~2nd round worth.

At this point asking for more then that for Pulju would be like wings fans asking for more then a high second for zadina - who is significantly younger and has more time to grow into a player who produces. Similar story though - when playing top six minutes, really good underlying metrics - and then doesn’t score.

We’ll see re Carolina. It’s called a dream that wouldn’t happen for a reason. I’m not even sure Steve is likely to trade bert. But as long as the valuation is close I’m happy - bert would be a real strong add for a push, great physical player who racks up points, 30 goal scorer, and they’d have him for less than 3m to boot. All depends on what the canes are looking at next year. The risk of course to Detroit would be Necas might never make that step and had a meh year.
11 juin 2022 à 20 h 50
#15
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Quoting: Mystaes
The Carolina fans I’ve seen said Necas + bear would be their starter offer. But Necas + 1st was also slightly too much. So this was the compromise.

As for PP no one seems to be consistent with his value at all. He’s either the messiah or not worth it. And everytime I ask someone to clarify they don’t present an alternative. So might just drop that for mkiii. Lots of right wingers with this anyways.


If you look at JPs stats compared to Zadina's and take in to account Zadina is a season behind JP they are on a very similar trajectory. About 75% of JPs points this year involved McDavid or Draisaitl That is where I stand on JP.
11 juin 2022 à 20 h 55
#16
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Quoting: aedoran
If you look at JPs stats compared to Zadina's and take in to account Zadina is a season behind JP they are on a very similar trajectory. About 75% of JPs points this year involved McDavid or Draisaitl That is where I stand on JP.


Sure, which is why i put his value at about a second (which is what I value a 3.2m (6.4m) over 2 years dump as). He is a bigger older zadina. I think he might benefit from a non oilers system though, especially with his defensive strengths
11 juin 2022 à 21 h 13
#17
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Quoting: Santa
i think flames are gonna have to pay a little more to dump Monohan. Leafs payed a 1st to dump Marleau with a very similar contract when cap space wasn't stagnant


Carolina was paid to buy him out so its not completely the same but you have the right priciple
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11 juin 2022 à 21 h 26
#18
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Quoting: evelutions2
So he was top 5 in the league, but can’t score to save his life while playing with McDavid? Sounds about right why he would be on his way out. Whether PJ’s on ice impact was top 5 or bottom 5 in the league isn’t what matters to other teams. First glance they will see he played with McDavid for most of the season and couldn’t even put up 40 points. If he can’t even do that with McDavid, what’s the likelihood other teams can get more offensive production out of him. He is elite defensively, and would more than likely benefit from going to a team that actually has a structured defensive game, but his offensive game is not good enough to warrant him to get anything more than a 2nd in most people’s eyes.

He's worth more than a 2nd.
Here's why.

He's among the very best in the league in on-ice impact:

CF% Rel: 4th among all forwards
FF% Rel: 5th
SF% Rel: 4th
GF% Rel: 5th
xGF% Rel: 3rd

NST link

You don't trade a young who has a top-5 impact in the entire league, especially when he's relatively affordable. There's no logical justification for it.
11 juin 2022 à 21 h 56
#19
Lets Get Kraken
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Quoting: CD282
He's worth more than a 2nd.
Here's why.

He's among the very best in the league in on-ice impact:

CF% Rel: 4th among all forwards
FF% Rel: 5th
SF% Rel: 4th
GF% Rel: 5th
xGF% Rel: 3rd

NST link

You don't trade a young who has a top-5 impact in the entire league, especially when he's relatively affordable. There's no logical justification for it.


PJ is one of those players who is more valuable to his own team compared to a team acquiring him. I get that, but comparing his offense to his defense is like comparing hockey to basketball. They are worlds apart. And teams look at a players offensive capabilities before looking at their defensive capabilities. And while there are exceptions to this unwritten rule, they are few are far between.

Many people, me included, view PJ as an older Kakko. Elite defensively, garbage offensively, even when they play with elite offensive players. PJ might be top 5 in the league in on ice impact, but that only gets you so far when you don’t score. PJ might not be labeled a complete bust yet, but he is going nowhere fast. Kind of why Kakko is a scratch tonight in favor of a 4th liner. If that is PJ’s future, I don’t know, but it’s looking like that is where he is heading. No acquiring team is going to pay more than a second for can’t even put up 40 points while flanking McDavid. And that microscope that he is under won’t help the Oilers.
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11 juin 2022 à 22 h 7
#20
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Quoting: evelutions2
PJ is one of those players who is more valuable to his own team compared to a team acquiring him. I get that, but comparing his offense to his defense is like comparing hockey to basketball. They are worlds apart. And teams look at a players offensive capabilities before looking at their defensive capabilities. And while there are exceptions to this unwritten rule, they are few are far between.

Many people, me included, view PJ as an older Kakko. Elite defensively, garbage offensively, even when they play with elite offensive players. PJ might be top 5 in the league in on ice impact, but that only gets you so far when you don’t score. PJ might not be labeled a complete bust yet, but he is going nowhere fast. Kind of why Kakko is a scratch tonight in favor of a 4th liner. If that is PJ’s future, I don’t know, but it’s looking like that is where he is heading. No acquiring team is going to pay more than a second for can’t even put up 40 points while flanking McDavid. And that microscope that he is under won’t help the Oilers.


From the link I posted which you clearly didn't read:

"Impressively, J.P. leads the forward group at both ends of the sheet; the Oilers have scored 3.38 goals per 60 when he’s out there (Draisaitl is second at 3.20, McDavid third at 3.11), and allowed just 1.97 per 60 (Kane is second at 2.00, Ryan McLeod third at 2.34)."

He facilitates offense in a big way, he just doesn't do a lot of scoring himself. If you follow the link and read to the end you'll see his grade A shot contributions are behind only McDavid, Draisaitl and Hyman. He's far from "garbage offensively" - that's just a terrible, uninformed take.

He's worth more than a 2nd.
 
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