wth....

Anaheim and Vancouver trades are horribly bad for Arizona (not to mention those retentions are stupid considering there is a limit to how many contracts a team can retain on).

When did Gardiner get positive value?

I like Dineen but Douglas is also 6'9 and puts up decent numbers. Guys like that dont grow on trees

Unsurprisingly the creator is a Canes fan

What's the 4-1-1 on Timmins? I thought he was a promising prospect with NHL potential

As much as I'd like to improve my teams, I don't feel right doing so by robbing other teams blind. That Anaheim trade would be horrible for Arizona even if you took out everything except Chychrun.

And for goodness' sake, PLEASE learn how to do the retention amount correctly. Figures like that just drive crusty old curmudgeons crazy.

He is. OP is an idiot, these trades are horrid and would never be considered by Arizona

Can’t see us trading our 2023 1st because that one guy that’s pretty good

Gardiner is LTIRetired. He more than likely will not be playing again. He is a good 1) LTIR player or 2) a good player to get you to the cap floor. So he would have value to quite a few teams.

that doesn't make his value positive

Except, it does. Carolina won't move him unless they have a reason to. They won't do anyone a favor and proved they're saavy enough to maneuver inside the LTIR space they have with Gardiner on it. For someone like Arizona to get him, they would have to give up an asset, which gives him positive value.

Lol what? Do you realize how many teams are going to want to dump cap this offseason or get off long term LTIR? Carolina doesn't suddenly "hold all the cards." Arizona could just go and pick up Seabrook or like Hornqvist for free instead. Nobody is going to pay you for Gardiner

Hornqvist is going to have Arizona on his M-NTC. So that's not happening... Tampa needs Seabrook to be cap compliant. There are very few deals like Gardiner's where the team doesn't need the contract and he'll never play again. Weber is another one, but that has cap recapture penalties looming. Gardiner's comes with no strings attached, is fully insured, and therefore costs almost nothing in terms of real money. If no one wants Gardiner, fine... but Carolina are under no requirements to move him, and will not pay to move him, meaning if a team wants that deal, they will have to pay for it.

Stralman waived to Arizona so that really doesn't matter, Hornqvist will be moved for certain next year and would probably prefer to go to Arizona then be flipped at the deadline then to some pretender like Vancouver or something.

Tampa doesn't need Seabrook at all to be compliant, if you think that then you don't understand how LTIR works

Arizona literally just acquired a deal like Gardiner's in Brian Little. There is also Kesler, the aforementioned Seabrook, Bishop, Weber (that recapture penalty only effects Nashville), and Shaw. Then there are teams that will look to move cap out of players still in the NHL like Hornqvist, Lucic, Monahan, Clifton, Nemeth, Zucker, Kassian, Keith, E. Johnson, Jensen, and probably many more.

You are right that Carolina doesn't technically need to move Gardiner but if they want to accrue cap space during the regular season to do something like what Florida did and add Giroux or similar then you can't be using LTIR. However nobody is going to pay for Gardiner

Kesler's deal is up at the end of the year, Bishop has an NMC so that might come into effect, yes likely not, but you never know. Weber's cap recapture would affect both Nashville AND the team that has the player, look at the Florida situation with the Luongo recapture. Yes, I know it's changed slightly, but it's still split. Shaw's deal is also up at the end of this year. Lucic has an NMC, Hornqvist has trade protection, as does Monahan, Nemeth, Keith, E Johnson. Most if not all of them do. Gardiner has an anti-Canada clause (7 team NTC). He's a better option than almost anyone else. If a team needs him to hit the floor, they'll have to pay, and he's a cleaner cut option than everyone else you mention. You're now just arguing for the sake of arguing.

Im not arguing for the sake of arguing. You are trying to justify a bad opinion that is completely baseless and shooting down every other option as "not possible because I said so"

Except, it's not. Gardiner has no trade protection against American teams, only a Canada NTC (7 team no trade). You listed a lot of other options, sure. None of them are as clean or make as much sense as the Gardiner deal. You're saying "Gardiner has negative value because I said so" and it's laughable!

Do you have a copy of his M-NTC? Also my exact words were "he does not have positive value"

Saying he doesn't have positive value implies he has negative value. You know exactly what you meant. Don't try and back out of it now.

I would say if Carolina wants to accrue cap space next year moving him would probably cost them a late round pick which is pretty negligible. But he won't bring back positive value

He doesn't have negative value, and Carolina could easily slot him in and get under the cap. They were only over by 1.5 WITH Gardiner on LTIR, to say they couldn't do it with Nino/Trocheck moving on shows a misunderstanding of Carolina's cap management. You can accrue cap space with a player out as long as you are below the cap with his hit.

You miss the point entirely

You've missed like 4 points. Lets just agree to disagree