Nakita is worse than Alex with worse contract. Literally Nikita makes Minnesota worse

Care to explain? Zadorov beats Goligoski in a lot of defensive advanced stats (xGF%, HDCF%, HDCA, HDGA). His contract is also better, though that is negated with the retention here (which I am fine with).

I think that trade is pretty good for us and considering Calgary has cap issues this season I think it actually works out pretty well for both teams.

That’s precisely what my thought process and rationale was. At the very least, I think it’s a somewhat interesting framework.

I really like it. Zadorov is basically being wasted on their 3rd pairing. This gives the Flames a more affordable, but still good, defenseman for cap flexibility and the Wild get an objective upgrade with added toughness to the blue line that we need. I'd even be fine throwing in a sweetener if we had to

Yeah I’d be curious to see what Flames fans think. IMO, they seem big enough and deep enough where they can afford to move Zadorov if it means bringing in a better offensive d man and gaining a bit of cap.

No thanks, we'll keep Zadorov

Fair enough, I was guessing on the CGY side. Is that a pretty firm no? Or is there a conversation to be had if MIN adds a sweetener?

Just no interest. Cap wouldn't work so you would have to take on at least Dube, which makes the deal very lopsided. After that Goligoski would be 3rd pair and is strictly worse defensively

What’s wrong with the cap? CGY gains about 1.2M in space and MN has plenty.

Ah didn't see the retention. Regardless, still weakens our 3rd pair

Right I understand that. I’m asking you if there’s a tipping point. Your 3rd pair gets worse defensively, but it gets better offensively and you gain cap space + some sweetener.

I’m specifically trying to understand what that sweetener would need to be? Does CGY agree if we add a 2nd (which MN wouldn’t do, but that’s beside the point)? Or are we talking something more palatable for MN - like a 4th?

Not here to argue that Goose is better at defense than Z. Trying to get clarity on what CGY values that difference to be.

You do realize Goligoski has a better PPG this year than any defenseman on the Flames except Andersson, right?

He'd also be 3rd on the Flames in terms of +/- as well with a +25 rating on the year so far. He's no where near as bad defensively as people think he is.

Only Kylington and Tanev have better +/-'s than Goligoski does.

While I'm certainly not opposed to grabbing Zadorov, moving out our best defenseman this year isn't exactly the best way to do it, imo.

Pay whatever you have to in order to get Z, but keep Goose. The team needs him if we're trying to make a push. Move out Benn, and stash Addison back down in Iowa for the rest of the year. Rotate Zadorov, Kulikov, and Merrill for the rest of the year as needed.

Yeah I guess I assumed Calgary wouldn’t simply subtract from their roster. They’d either need a replacement level player coming back or have another deal lined up for a diff d man entirely.

But I can’t see them just dealing Zadorov for futures. Unless of course it’s some ridiculous overpay, which MN wouldn’t do.

I'm more than happy to dump Goli. I see no reason for GGY to to this, it doesn't make them a better team.

Zadorov is a guy I'd put with Addison on the 3rd pair, not a guy I want as the 2nd pair d-man. It might work out okay as a quazi Scandella/Spurgeon pairing. I think it is just ends up rearranging the deck chairs with trying to play a 3rd pair d-man in a 2nd pair role though. Zadorov/Addison is a 3rd pairing I'd like to see.

The problem is I haven't liked any of MN's d-men paired with Spurgeon this season. On paper Brodin/Spurgeon should be a good pairing, on ice they just don't have any chemistry. It's odd because Brodin has worked well with everyone else he's ever been paired with.

Ok so lets clarify some things. As someone who has watched Zadorov all year. He is an excellent 3rd pairing defenseman, he is a subpar 2nd pairing defenseman. So from Minnesota's viewpoint this is not a smart move.

As for Calgary, they don't need the offense Goligoski provides and Big Z provides to the teams identity of "tough to play against." Its not about what needs to be added, its about it being a bad fit all around

Good for him, he's also producing significantly above expectation. +/- does not define defensive play

I’m not asking for your opinion on what you think is a shrewd move for MN. I don’t really care what you or others perceive to be “a fit.”

I’m simply asking you at what price would Calgary consider moving Zadorov for Goose with 50% retained? If we threw in Rossi would you? Yes. If we threw in a 1st would you? I’d imagine so, yes. If we throw in a 6th? No.

What is the tipping point? Put aside your own opinions on the deal. The question is one of value, not one of fit. There’s a difference.

Yeah I didn’t put any thought into the pairings, but I agree with what you summarized. As for why Calgary would do it, the main idea was cap space, offensive improvement in that specific position and presumably a sweetener that gets added.

I just can’t get any clarity on what that sweetener would need to be for them to have any real interest.

Probably the value of a 2nd or higher. Which I doubt Minny would be willing to pay

A 2nd? For a 3rd pairing defenseman? You must be joking.

I find that hard to believe, but I appreciate that you actually answered so kudos there

You miss my point entirely. Calgary has no use for Goligoski over Zadorov. If they wanted and offensive LD on the 3rd pair they would just bring Valimaki back up.

Flames are contending and Goligoski is a downgrade from Zadorov on their roster (personally I think both teams would be downgrading in the OP's trade). OP asked me ehat it would cost for Calgary to willingly downgrade from a Flames perspective so I answered

And your missing mine.

The point is Goligoski is a top 4 defenseman. Zadorov is not. You're not going to play him on a 3rd pairing regardless. Which is the entire issue we agree on, and are running around in circles on. But that doesn't mean we are paying you a 2nd to take on someone who isn't a cap dump for a lesser more inferior player.

If you read any of my other posts in this thread, you might of realized I don't think we should move Goligoski in any potential trade for Zadorov due to the fact that Goligoski has been our best defenseman this year. Moving your teams best defenseman for what is tantamount to a 3rd pairing guy is not what I would call a bright idea.

You keep calling him "lesser" and "inferior" when that is only correct on when comparing their offensive games. Zadorov is vastly better defensively.

Thats funny that you say "if you read any of my other posts" because you seem to have ignored all of mine. For example: