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3 way trade with DAL and ARI

Créé par: Imagine875948
Équipe: 2021-22 Penguins de Pittsburgh
Date de création initiale: 17 janv. 2022
Publié: 17 janv. 2022
Mode - plafond salarial: Basique
Description
PIT gets: Radulov (1 mil retained) + Gurianov + Crouse

DAL gets: Kapanen + Hallander + 2022 4th round pick (PIT)

ARI gets: Zucker + 2023 5th (PIT)
Transactions
1.
ARI
  1. Zucker, Jason
  2. Choix de 5e ronde en 2023 (PIT)
2.
PIT
  1. Gurianov, Denis
  2. Radulov, Alexander (1 000 000 $ retained)
DAL
  1. Hållander, Filip
  2. Kapanen, Kasperi
  3. Choix de 4e ronde en 2022 (PIT)
Rachats de contrats
Repêchage1e ronde2e ronde3e ronde4e ronde5e ronde6e ronde7e ronde
2022
Logo de PIT
Logo de PIT
Logo de PIT
Logo de PIT
Logo de PIT
2023
Logo de PIT
Logo de PIT
Logo de PIT
Logo de PIT
Logo de PIT
Logo de TOR
2024
Logo de PIT
Logo de PIT
Logo de PIT
Logo de PIT
Logo de PIT
Logo de PIT
Logo de PIT
TAILLE DE LA FORMATIONPLAFOND SALARIALCAP HITEXCÉDENTS Info-bulleBONISESPACE SOUS LE PLAFOND SALARIAL
2381 500 000 $79 411 539 $0 $0 $2 088 461 $
Ailier gaucheCentreAilier droit
Logo de Penguins de Pittsburgh
4 500 000 $4 500 000 $
AG, AD
UFA - 3
Logo de Penguins de Pittsburgh
8 700 000 $8 700 000 $
C
NMC
UFA - 4
Logo de Penguins de Pittsburgh
3 500 000 $3 500 000 $
AD, AG
UFA - 1
Logo de Penguins de Pittsburgh
2 636 364 $2 636 364 $
AD, C
UFA - 1
Logo de Penguins de Pittsburgh
9 500 000 $9 500 000 $
C
NMC
UFA - 1
Logo de Stars de Dallas
5 250 000 $5 250 000 $
AD
M-NTC, NMC
UFA - 1
Logo de Penguins de Pittsburgh
1 100 000 $1 100 000 $
AG, AD
UFA - 1
Logo de Penguins de Pittsburgh
1 000 000 $1 000 000 $
AG, C
UFA - 1
Logo de Stars de Dallas
2 550 000 $2 550 000 $
AD, AG
UFA - 1
Logo de Coyotes de l'Arizona
1 533 333 $1 533 333 $
AG, AD
UFA - 1
Logo de Penguins de Pittsburgh
2 200 000 $2 200 000 $
C, AG
UFA - 2
Logo de Penguins de Pittsburgh
2 750 000 $2 750 000 $
AG, AD
UFA - 4
Défenseur gaucherDéfenseur droitierGardien de but
Logo de Penguins de Pittsburgh
4 100 000 $4 100 000 $
DG
M-NTC
UFA - 2
Logo de Penguins de Pittsburgh
7 250 000 $7 250 000 $
DD
M-NTC, NMC
UFA - 1
Logo de Penguins de Pittsburgh
3 500 000 $3 500 000 $
G
UFA - 2
Logo de Penguins de Pittsburgh
4 025 175 $4 025 175 $
DG
UFA - 4
Logo de Penguins de Pittsburgh
4 400 000 $4 400 000 $
DD
UFA - 6
Logo de Penguins de Pittsburgh
4 875 000 $4 875 000 $
DG
M-NTC
UFA - 5
Logo de Penguins de Pittsburgh
750 000 $750 000 $
DD
UFA - 1
Logo de Penguins de Pittsburgh
750 000 $750 000 $
G
UFA - 1
Laissés de côtéListe des blessés (IR)Liste des blessés à long terme (LTIR)
Logo de Penguins de Pittsburgh
750 000 $750 000 $
AD, AG
UFA - 1
Logo de Penguins de Pittsburgh
1 725 000 $1 725 000 $
AG, AD
UFA - 1
Logo de Penguins de Pittsburgh
750 000 $750 000 $
AG, C
UFA - 1
Équipe de réserve
Logo de Penguins de Pittsburgh
1 250 000 $1 250 000 $ (125 000 $$125K125 000 $$125K)
G
UFA - 1
Logo de Penguins de Pittsburgh
750 000 $750 000 $ (0 $$00 $$0)
AG
RFA - 1
Logo de Penguins de Pittsburgh
725 000 $725 000 $ (0 $$00 $$0)
DG/DD
UFA - 1
Logo de Penguins de Pittsburgh
925 000 $925 000 $ (0 $$00 $$0) (Bonis de performance850 000 $$850K)
AG
UFA - 1
Logo de Penguins de Pittsburgh
750 000 $750 000 $ (0 $$00 $$0)
AG, AD
UFA - 2
Logo de Penguins de Pittsburgh
1 150 000 $1 150 000 $ (25 000 $$25K25 000 $$25K)
DG
UFA - 1
Logo de Penguins de Pittsburgh
725 000 $725 000 $ (0 $$00 $$0)
C, AD
UFA - 1

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17 janv. 2022 à 17 h 51
#1
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What's Arizona's incentive here?
17 janv. 2022 à 17 h 52
#2
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Quoting: Ledge_And_Dairy
What's Arizona's incentive here?


They will need to get to the cap floor next year and they can flip him at half retained for a decent amount of value
17 janv. 2022 à 18 h 3
#3
Chiggy
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Quoting: Imagine875948
They will need to get to the cap floor next year and they can flip him at half retained for a decent amount of value


That sounds like more of an offseason move for the. Also, Zucker has trade protection and would have to be convinced to go.
17 janv. 2022 à 18 h 4
#4
arky
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Quoting: Imagine875948
They will need to get to the cap floor next year and they can flip him at half retained for a decent amount of value


In this scenario Pitt needs to clear cap. If that is the case Arizona has cap space and will exact some form of incentive to take on cap. Even though they have to meet the cap floor they have alot of open spots and need to get to 63.5 or so to meet the floor. Their are many teams that need to clear cap and that being the case other teams will pay to clear cap and Arizona will get picks, prospects or a combination to take bad cap, just not take it for nothing.
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17 janv. 2022 à 18 h 4
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Quoting: Chigurrhh
That sounds like more of an offseason move for the. Also, Zucker has trade protection and would have to be convinced to go.


if they flip Zucker he would have more value now than next year
17 janv. 2022 à 18 h 4
#6
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Quoting: Imagine875948
They will need to get to the cap floor next year and they can flip him at half retained for a decent amount of value


They will literally be paid to get to the cap floor this offseason. They should not have to pay to do it
17 janv. 2022 à 18 h 5
#7
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Quoting: mikearky
In this scenario Pitt needs to clear cap. If that is the case Arizona has cap space and will exact some form of incentive to take on cap. Even though they have to meet the cap floor they have alot of open spots and need to get to 63.5 or so to meet the floor. Their are many teams that need to clear cap and that being the case other teams will pay to clear cap and Arizona will get picks, prospects or a combination to take bad cap, just not take it for nothing.


ARI can flip Zucker at half retained for a decent amnount of value
17 janv. 2022 à 18 h 6
#8
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Quoting: Ledge_And_Dairy
They will literally be paid to get to the cap floor this offseason. They should not have to pay to do it


Like I said, they can flip Zucker at half retained for some prospects and picks
17 janv. 2022 à 18 h 11
#9
Chiggy
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Quoting: Imagine875948
if they flip Zucker he would have more value now than next year


They can't really do that this year. They can only retain salary on one more player for this season (they are already retaining on OEL and Kuemper) and it will probably be Kessel.
17 janv. 2022 à 18 h 12
#10
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Quoting: Chigurrhh
They can't really do that this year. They can only retain salary on one more player for this season (they are already retaining on OEL and Kuemper) and it will probably be Kessel.


True,but they can still fip him at half retained for a decent amount
17 janv. 2022 à 18 h 13
#11
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Quoting: Imagine875948
Like I said, they can flip Zucker at half retained for some prospects and picks


Then you can pay them to take Zucker because he serves little value to Arizona
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17 janv. 2022 à 18 h 15
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Quoting: Ledge_And_Dairy
Then you can pay them to take Zucker because he serves little value to Arizona


Zucker doesnt have negative value. He's a very good player but just hasnt scored. He's done everything right but then cant score, its like he's been hit with a curse
17 janv. 2022 à 18 h 16
#13
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Quoting: Imagine875948
Zucker doesnt have negative value. He's a very good player but just hasnt scored. He's done everything right but then cant score, its like he's been hit with a curse


Well then he has negative trade value. Like Lucic or Bailey.
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17 janv. 2022 à 18 h 17
#14
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Quoting: Imagine875948
Zucker doesnt have negative value.


He does to Pittsburgh in this case. They need to move his cap to make this trade work. Arizona has the entirety of the leverage for this deal, it all falls apart without them taking on cap. You will have to pay them for them to be that broker.
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17 janv. 2022 à 18 h 17
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Quoting: Ledge_And_Dairy
Well then he has negative trade value. Like Lucic or Bailey.


No he doesnt. @Mr_Gardoki please explain
17 janv. 2022 à 18 h 21
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Quoting: Imagine875948
No he doesnt. Mr_Gardoki please explain


Well, I'm kind in between what both of you are saying. I can't say Zucker has positive trade value, but I don't think he has negative trade value to the degree of Lucic or Bailey. At this point the Pens don't have to add sweetener to move Zucker, but they do need the right situation to move him. IMO, and I've already hashed this out with the guy you're talking to who doesn't seem to like any real stats or facts, but I believe a trade revolving around Zucker and Crouse has a mutual benefit.
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17 janv. 2022 à 18 h 22
#17
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Quoting: Mr_Gardoki
Well, I'm kind in between what both of you are saying. I can't say Zucker has positive trade value, but I don't think he has negative trade value to the degree of Lucic or Bailey. At this point the Pens don't have to add sweetener to move Zucker, but they do need the right situation to move him. IMO, and I've already hashed this out with the guy you're talking to who doesn't seem to like any real stats or facts, but I believe a trade revolving around Zucker and Crouse has a mutual benefit.


The problem with that is that the value Arizona would get in flipping Zucker would still be located in their cap space, their retention.
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17 janv. 2022 à 18 h 23
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Quoting: Imagine875948
No he doesnt. Mr_Gardoki please explain


Yes he does. He is not producing, is overpaid, and is signed for multiple years. Trade value and team value are not the same thing. For example would you trade Kapanen and a 2nd for Monahan right now? Would you even trade Kapanen alone for him? Monahan is still a good hockey player but is not producing. Monahan has more value to Calgary directly because if he bounces back then he is good for the team, however his current market value is awful
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17 janv. 2022 à 18 h 24
#19
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Quoting: Byrr
The problem with that is that the value Arizona would get in flipping Zucker would still be located in their cap space, their retention.


AZ still needs to reach the cap floor and they're losing 90% of their contracts this off-season, so they get an upgrade from Crouse and a solid player to build their roster. While I'm sure they're not super concerned with filling out the roster with all great players, they still want some good players. They get a good player in Zucker with limited commitment.
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17 janv. 2022 à 18 h 24
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Quoting: Ledge_And_Dairy
Yes he does. He is not producing, is overpaid, and is signed for multiple years. Trade value and team value are not the same thing. For example would you trade Kapanen and a 2nd for Monahan right now? Would you even trade Kapanen alone for him? Monahan is still a good hockey player but is not producing. Monahan has more value to Calgary directly because if he bounces back then he is good for the team, however his current market value is awful


Actually yes I would do Kapanen for Monahan lol
17 janv. 2022 à 18 h 29
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Quoting: Mr_Gardoki
AZ still needs to reach the cap floor and they're losing 90% of their contracts this off-season, so they get an upgrade from Crouse and a solid player to build their roster. While I'm sure they're not super concerned with filling out the roster with all great players, they still want some good players. They get a good player in Zucker with limited commitment.


Which they could also do for free in the offseason. There's no real value there to Arizona outside of flipping him and its the cap retention making that possible. Holding on to Zucker for next year would just lower his value if anything. No reason to expect he'll have a better season playing for a depleted Coyotes team than he has for the Penguins.
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17 janv. 2022 à 18 h 29
#22
arky
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My problem is cap space is like gold. If they take him on they then have to retain cap to move him and it cost them money. Most teams will take cap for a price then they flip him for even more. They do not take on cap unless they need the player if it fails they then flip him. Again they will want something to take him or they walk and then Pens have to trad him and even pay some one else. Lastly, I am always saying they do not need him and they can flip him, well if he gets hurt then they can not flip him. All the risk is with Arizona, none with Pittsburgh and no team is going to take in that, becuase that is what gets GM's fired. Yes will they take him, sure for a 5th round pick and they give up a player, no. They could trade Crouse and get picks and then they could take on Zucker for a price and then flip him as you say and get even more.
17 janv. 2022 à 18 h 32
#23
Banni
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I think what many people miss with is AZ is not everyone is going to want to play there since they're very much in super raw rebuild. They won't be able to attract high-end players even with overpaying. They will have to overpay for mediocre players and trying to accomplish that ALL through Free Agency is going to crazy hard because they literally only have three forwards under contract and three RFA forwards, one of which is Crouse, so either they overpay to keep Crouse or they move him and while they can probably get a 3rd for him, they will still have to find a FA to fill his spot which is much easier said than done in the video-game world of making trades and signings.
17 janv. 2022 à 18 h 34
#24
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Quoting: Byrr
Which they could also do for free in the offseason. There's no real value there to Arizona outside of flipping him and its the cap retention making that possible. Holding on to Zucker for next year would just lower his value if anything. No reason to expect he'll have a better season playing for a depleted Coyotes team than he has for the Penguins.


I think you're oversimplifying how easy this is to do in the off-season. There's a limited number of players and if you think they're just going to go out so easily to find ten or eleven forwards that will not only help them reach the cap floor, but also WANT to come play there right now you're sorely mistaken and I swear I'm not trying to be rude here. This is just the reality.

AZ is not a destination for good players right now. It's unfortunately a destination for players who can't get jobs elsewhere and those players will not help you reach the cap floor.
17 janv. 2022 à 18 h 37
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Quoting: Mr_Gardoki
I think you're oversimplifying how easy this is to do in the off-season. There's a limited number of players and if you think they're just going to go out so easily to find ten or eleven forwards that will not only help them reach the cap floor, but also WANT to come play there right now you're sorely mistaken and I swear I'm not trying to be rude here. This is just the reality.

AZ is not a destination for good players right now. It's unfortunately a destination for players who can't get jobs elsewhere and those players will not help you reach the cap floor.


I think you underestimate how easy it will be. They don't want to compete now, they are actively tanking. Their goal isn't to be good. Arizona is a destination for players in general. A nice, warm climate. Offer a free agent an extra million over his worth to play for them, easy. 'We'll give you extra money and a bigger opportunity than you'll see elsewhere then flip you to a contending team at the deadline.' is a pretty attractive offer.

We also saw how they just dealt with this in the last offseason without any problems at all. They ate cap from all over the league and got paid to do it. This is what the OP is asking them to do again just without the paying them part.
 
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