Not a terrible offer, but he would definitely cost at least that much

I think that is a good offer. Something I would be willing to give up as well

That's an okay offer, I think it gets beat tho, I don't see van trading horvat unless the offer blows us away

I think Canucks accept. Works for both teams.

don't know if the wings have any solid non-seider RD prospects but i think the canucks would be looking for one of those

Tuomisto would probably be the best RHD prospect. Detroit is stacked with LHD currently, Edvinsson, Johansson, Wallinder, Buium, McIsaac, Viro, etc.

Yeah, I would’ve gone with one of the Wings’ many LD prospects but I know Vancouver already has that side set in stone for the foreseeable future. And you’re right, the RD pipeline has a giant chasm between Seider and the next best young guy, so Tuomisto was the best I could use without overpaying. Not as promising as Johansson or Wallinder, but still a fellow second round pick (#35) that’s only 20 years of age.

yeah, the canucks have hughes and OEL on the left for the long term but not a lot on the right. don't know enough about tuomisto as a prospect to make a call lol but seems like a decent offer if he's got decent nhl potential

Would Hronek be available?

Probably not, would leave us pretty weak right now. But who knows I wouldn't be totally opposed to it depending on who we select in this year's entry draft.

I think Hronek would probably make the most sense as a target for the Canucks.

Horvat for Hronek + 2023 1st (protected). Do the Canucks need to add? How much?

Yeah, Detroit isn’t trading first round picks now come on. That contract for Horvat doesn’t add value especially when you think it would cost a locked up young top 4 RD +.

The thread we're in has Detroit trading a first. Canucks aren't moving Horvat without a first coming back.

Is there a first & Hronek in OP? When has a 2C with one more year on contract returned a lottery first + top 4 RHD with team control? Or comparable value? You can ask for a first sure but let’s get realistic on comparable value. If our end has Hronek + first round pick in it then Horvat isn’t the target it would be EP.

I know Hronek would be the best player for the Canucks to target, but giving up him and a first round pick likely wouldn’t be a good idea for the Wings. With our top 4 RHD being limited to Seider and Hronek for the foreseeable future with the lack of higher end talent on that side, I wouldn’t move Hronek unless I’m at least getting another decent RHD back. While getting Horvat solves a problem, trading Hronek without a replacement creates another one.

I can offer you a slightly used Tyler Myers as a replacement 🤣.

The question was what's the cost, imo that was the cost. Canucks shouldn't move Horvat without a RD coming back and I don't think Hronek is good enough for a 1 for 1 swap. Maybe Det just isn't a fit.

Closest comparable is Duchene (0.66ppg 2 years prior and including the trade season, 2 years left) who was moved for a top 4 D and lottery pick.

Horvat: 0.7ppg 2 years prior and trade season, 2 years left.

Yeah, it might just not work if that’s the ask. I was actually thinking about countering with an offer that included Myers lol. That’s probably the only way it would work, and I honestly wouldn’t be too opposed to it, but the price would have to be right.

That’s a bit of a stretch considering the pick was from Ottawa who imploded going from 98 points (losing conference finals game 7) to 67 points. The top 4 defensemen you’re referring too was a prospect that was drafted in the second round with one year more of development time. So I guess if we’re using hindsight and everything goes completely in Vancouver’s favor then sure. There’s a reason that lottery picks (knowingly) don’t get moved in the salary cap era & why protections are on almost all of them now. So essentially using one of the most lopsided trades in the cap era that involved a ton of luck and development isn’t a great baseline for your opinion.

I mean I would absolutely expect any pick from Det to be lottery protected.

Duchene was the closest comparable I could find (almost exact PPG and contract status) so I feel like it was pretty fair to compare them. The Duchene trade was viewed as a good trade without the benefit of hindsight as well.

Players like Horvat just don't get traded all that often. I guess others off the top of my head at RyJo for Jones, and the first ROR trade (31OA, Compher, Zadorov (who was highly touted at the time))

Yeah, I'm not sure how to include Myers and keep it fair.

At 50% retention (3mil AAV), is he at all attractive as a Hronek replacement.

At that AAV for only three more seasons, I could deal with that. He's not the same defenseman that he was in his prime, but I wouldn't mind counting on him to anchor the second pairing for a bit. With his more defensive style, I could see him as a better fit to pair with our upcoming prospects than Hronek (though not as good). While that still leaves our RHD in limbo, at least it postpones doomsday until 2024 so Yzerman can find a more permanent solution. As for valuing the trade, how would this be?

VAN Receives:
Filip Hronek
2022 2nd (DET)

DET Receives:
Bo Horvat
Tyler Myers ($2,000,000 retained - 33.33%)

It would be pretty hard to stomach moving Bo and not getting a first back, though moving Myers would be nice.

I'd say maybe with a little less retention on Myers the trade is close to "fair" but still not a trade I would make. If that makes sense.

You can come the players but the issue is the disingenuous framing of the return. Would you say it’s safe to expect a team that just went to game 7 of the conference finals the next year to have a top 5 pick? Or even label it a lottery pick? Then label a prospect one year removed from being selected in the second round as a top 4 defensemen? That’s taking out all the development from that point to current state and isn’t the norm. There isn’t a great comp for young top 4 RHD + lottery first rounder. The first one that comes to mind for a 2C would be Stepan but it had some other components in it. We can look at the Eichel trade and I’d wager most fans would say Hronek >= Krebs and Detroit 1st > VGK. If the discussion is Vancouver would only trade Horvat for an overpayment then sure we’re not going to have a fruitful discussion and that’s fine if you want to build around Horvat. I’m merely questioning the comp used in your determination as that’s what I use to determine the “value of X player”. That being said what would you say EP is valued at comparatively? If Horvat costs Hronek + 1st I’d be curious what the + would need to be.