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Fiction just try to figure out value

Créé par: mastersp4
Équipe: 2021-22 Canadiens de Montréal
Date de création initiale: 1 déc. 2021
Publié: 1 déc. 2021
Mode - plafond salarial: Basique
Transactions
MTL
    Anywhere to Cup contenders
    ANA
    1. Price, Carey (5 250 000 $ retained)
    Détails additionnels:
    Informations : He's back at 100%
    So what's the value here, I'm not able to make my mind up around he's value
    Rachats de contrats
    Transactions impliquant une retenue de salaire
    Repêchage1e ronde2e ronde3e ronde4e ronde5e ronde6e ronde7e ronde
    2022
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    2023
    Logo de MTL
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    2024
    Logo de MTL
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    TAILLE DE LA FORMATIONPLAFOND SALARIALCAP HITEXCÉDENTS Info-bulleBONISESPACE SOUS LE PLAFOND SALARIAL
    2381 500 000 $63 097 144 $597 561 $1 557 500 $18 402 856 $
    Ailier gaucheCentreAilier droit
    Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
    5 500 000 $5 500 000 $
    AG, AD
    M-NTC
    UFA - 2
    Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
    4 450 000 $4 450 000 $
    C
    UFA - 4
    Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
    6 500 000 $6 500 000 $
    AD, AG
    M-NTC, NMC
    UFA - 6
    Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
    2 125 000 $2 125 000 $
    AD, AG
    UFA - 3
    Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
    863 333 $863 333 $ (Bonis de performance537 500 $$538K)
    C
    UFA - 1
    Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
    5 500 000 $5 500 000 $
    AD, AG
    M-NTC
    UFA - 6
    Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
    1 150 000 $1 150 000 $
    AG, AD
    UFA - 1
    Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
    750 000 $750 000 $
    C, AG
    UFA - 2
    Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
    3 400 000 $3 400 000 $
    AD, AG
    UFA - 4
    Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
    750 000 $750 000 $
    AG, AD
    UFA - 1
    Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
    750 000 $750 000 $
    C
    UFA - 1
    Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
    950 000 $950 000 $
    C, AG, AD
    UFA - 1
    Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
    880 833 $880 833 $ (Bonis de performance300 000 $$300K)
    AG, AD
    UFA - 2
    Défenseur gaucherDéfenseur droitierGardien de but
    Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
    1 750 000 $1 750 000 $
    DG/DD
    M-NTC
    UFA - 1
    Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
    2 343 750 $2 343 750 $
    DD
    M-NTC, NMC
    UFA - 4
    Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
    925 000 $925 000 $
    DG/DD
    UFA - 1
    Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
    3 500 000 $3 500 000 $
    DD
    UFA - 4
    Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
    2 875 000 $2 875 000 $
    G
    UFA - 2
    Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
    894 167 $894 167 $ (Bonis de performance637 500 $$638K)
    DG
    RFA - 1
    Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
    750 000 $750 000 $
    DD
    UFA - 1
    Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
    750 000 $750 000 $
    G
    UFA - 1
    Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
    859 167 $859 167 $ (Bonis de performance82 500 $$82K)
    DG
    RFA - 3
    Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
    750 000 $750 000 $
    DG/DD
    UFA - 1
    Laissés de côtéListe des blessés (IR)Liste des blessés à long terme (LTIR)
    Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
    4 500 000 $4 500 000 $
    AG
    UFA - 3
    Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
    7 857 143 $7 857 143 $
    DD
    UFA - 5
    Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
    875 000 $875 000 $
    DG/DD
    M-NTC
    UFA - 3
    Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
    3 400 000 $3 400 000 $
    AG, AD
    UFA - 2
    Logo de Canadiens de Montréal
    950 000 $950 000 $
    AG, AD, C
    UFA - 1

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    1 déc. 2021 à 10 h 20
    #1
    Habs 2010
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    I was wondering the same thing, honestly there seems to be a disconnect on his value around the league vs what fans around the league think.

    LeBrun on Insider Trading talking Price's future: "Where does a 34-yr old future HOFer fit in a plan of a rebuild if that's what Jeff Gorton plans to do, there are teams around the league, some contenders, I can tell you already that are intrigued to find out where that all goes"

    My thoughts, $10.5M Carey Price was essentially the reason MTL beat TOR and their big 4 @ $40M. He did it the year before vs Crosby and Malkin too. MTL was outplayed in both series but Price was the difference. If there is any contender who is ready to make an aggressive run for the cup but are worried about goaltending, then Price should be their guy.
    mastersp4 a aimé ceci.
    1 déc. 2021 à 10 h 38
    #2
    Lets Get Kraken
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    With how big a difference maker Price is, plus having 50% of that massive contract retained, that is worth at least a 1st rounder. Price will end up in the HOF, and that caliber of play is not found in every goalie. I think you could make a strong argument for a 1st round pick and a high end center prospect in the case for the Habs. A first round pick in 2023 would be ideal for the habs, and then a very strong center prospect to boot would be an absolute win for the habs.
    1 déc. 2021 à 10 h 39
    #3
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    Lets be honest. Pric is still a big game goalie and can be one of the top 3 goalies in the game.

    However, at 10.5mil for FIVE MORE YEARS, I don;t think anyone wants anything to do with that. As you say above, you could retain half at 5.25, which is ridiculous to even think about, and it makes his salary for what he might still bring to the table worth it for another year or two. BUT again, you are talking about a 34 yr old goalie for 5 more years at 5.25mil that wasn;t great the past couple of seasons (until the playoffs), who might get injured or decide hes had enough at any time.

    So while I'm sure somebody would give good value if he had a 1 or 2, or even a 3 year contract, I don;t think you get much value back in return for him and his 5 yrs EVEN at 50% retention.

    And if I'm MTL I dont retain 5.25mil for 5 yrs without a good return.

    And I just cant see any teams (especially those who need a number 1 goalie and have some cap space) making a deal and offering anything near value.

    Price on a 1-3 yr contract at 5-8mil, thats worth a 1st and a good prospect, Price on a 5 yr deal (when he hasn;t played this year andf might not be the same), does not get that return
    CD282 a aimé ceci.
    1 déc. 2021 à 10 h 43
    #4
    Lenny7
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    Quoting: Shanesaw9
    I was wondering the same thing, honestly there seems to be a disconnect on his value around the league vs what fans around the league think.

    LeBrun on Insider Trading talking Price's future: "Where does a 34-yr old future HOFer fit in a plan of a rebuild if that's what Jeff Gorton plans to do, there are teams around the league, some contenders, I can tell you already that are intrigued to find out where that all goes"

    My thoughts, $10.5M Carey Price was essentially the reason MTL beat TOR and their big 4 $40M. He did it the year before vs Crosby and Malkin too. MTL was outplayed in both series but Price was the difference. If there is any contender who is ready to make an aggressive run for the cup but are worried about goaltending, then Price should be their guy.


    I'm flip flopping back and forth on this...I think it's nearly impossible to come up with an actual value on Price.
    -The NMC hurts the value. He waived for Seattle, but there was a near-zero chance that they were going to take on that contract, plus it's close to his hometown.
    -The playoff numbers are very nice, but it's hard to skip over the below league average numbers that he's put up in 3 of the past 4 regular seasons.
    -The playoff numbers ARE very nice.
    -The actual money that's left on the contract is pretty palatable. You're getting 4 years of Carey Price for a total of $15.625 mil in actual cash. That's verrrrry nice.
    -The fact that the cap hit goes through his age 38 season is kind of scary.
    -The list of teams that are in the market for a goalie doesn't seem like it'd be very big...most teams are pretty set, and the ones that aren't are tight against the cap going forward. Edmonton? Pittsburgh would be kinda fun if Jarry struggles?

    I'm absolutely torn. I'm sure someone would offer a reasonable package, I just can't see it being insanely large though. Lots of question marks, but also the name value is there. If I were a betting man, I'd say that whatever we guess for a return will be 100% wrong tears of joy

    Edit: If I'm the Habs, I'm probably not moving him unless he asks for a trade anyway. And retaining 50% is a rough move a couple of years down the road anyway.
    mastersp4 a aimé ceci.
    1 déc. 2021 à 10 h 44
    #5
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    Put it this way:

    What cup contender needs a goalie and has cap space?
    What cup contender needs a goalie and can move depth/inconsequential salaries and futures for Price?

    There aren;t any. And most of them have cap issues moving forward. And if they did do it, theyd have to send you some cap dumps
    CD282 a aimé ceci.
    1 déc. 2021 à 10 h 45
    #6
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    Quoting: Lenny7
    I'm flip flopping back and forth on this...I think it's nearly impossible to come up with an actual value on Price.
    -The NMC hurts the value. He waived for Seattle, but there was a near-zero chance that they were going to take on that contract, plus it's close to his hometown.
    -The playoff numbers are very nice, but it's hard to skip over the below league average numbers that he's put up in 3 of the past 4 regular seasons.
    -The playoff numbers ARE very nice.
    -The actual money that's left on the contract is pretty palatable. You're getting 4 years of Carey Price for a total of $15.625 mil in actual cash. That's verrrrry nice.
    -The fact that the cap hit goes through his age 38 season is kind of scary.
    -The list of teams that are in the market for a goalie doesn't seem like it'd be very big...most teams are pretty set, and the ones that aren't are tight against the cap going forward. Edmonton? Pittsburgh would be kinda fun if Jarry struggles?

    I'm absolutely torn. I'm sure someone would offer a reasonable package, I just can't see it being insanely large though. Lots of question marks, but also the name value is there. If I were a betting man, I'd say that whatever we guess for a return will be 100% wrong tears of joy


    That's probably the toughest players and situation to evaluate.
    Lenny7 a aimé ceci.
    1 déc. 2021 à 10 h 46
    #7
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    Quoting: Hammerwise
    Put it this way:

    What cup contender needs a goalie and has cap space?
    What cup contender needs a goalie and can move depth/inconsequential salaries and futures for Price?

    There aren;t any. And most of them have cap issues moving forward. And if they did do it, theyd have to send you some cap dumps


    Edm could with moving Koskinnen and have some nice prospect. Not sayin they will pull the trigger put they have the munitions to do it
    1 déc. 2021 à 10 h 47
    #8
    Lenny7
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    Quoting: mastersp4
    That's probably the toughest players and situation to evaluate.


    100%. I think it's important to remember that Gorton never asked Lundqvist to waive over the past couple of years that he was in NY either though, even though the team was struggling. Gotta assume that it's very much a "If he asks to be moved, we'll honor it, if he doesn't, then we'll carry on."
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    1 déc. 2021 à 10 h 48
    #9
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    Quoting: Lenny7
    100%. I think it's important to remember that Gorton never asked Lundqvist to waive over the past couple of years that he was in NY either though, even though the team was struggling. Gotta assume that it's very much a "If he asks to be moved, we'll honor it, if he doesn't, then we'll carry on."


    Price will be probably the 1st player to have a meeting with Gorton, Gallagher and Petry after
    Lenny7 a aimé ceci.
    1 déc. 2021 à 10 h 49
    #10
    Lenny7
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    Quoting: mastersp4
    Edm could with moving Koskinnen and have some nice prospect. Not sayin they will pull the trigger put they have the munitions to do it


    They do, but they also don't have a ton of space moving forward. They have about $10 mil in space next year, with 9 or 10 guys to sign to fill out the roster. If Keith retired, sure, there'd be some room, but right now, they don't. They'd pretty much have to send a dump back to Montreal, which seems foolish considering the Habs would already be eating 50% on Price.
    mastersp4, Hammerwise et CD282 a aimé ceci.
    1 déc. 2021 à 10 h 51
    #11
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    i don't think there's a lot of value there. his contract is too long, his health questionable, and his play declining. habs keep him until his buyout is cheap enough.
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    1 déc. 2021 à 11 h 0
    #12
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    The main question that needs to be asked/answered is how much longer Price is actually going to play. With everything that has happened over the last few seasons its not a safe assumption he will play out his deal. That to me changes the conversation a lot.

    If Price tells teams he has 3 years left(to the end of 23-24) with an in kind agreement to mutually terminate at that point he becomes a extremely valuable asset at 50 percent retained. 5.25 would make him the 13th highest cap hit goalie . Pretty much any team can afford him. As much as people here try to put him down his quality start numbers are still strong so he is giving good games more often than average and he has the ability to steal series in the playoffs.

    On a side note Montreal retaining on him is not remotely an issue. Retaining is an issue when:

    Retained cap hit + replacement player is more than the original player. The habs can retain on Price and find a replacement starter and likely still have cap space left.
    1 déc. 2021 à 11 h 21
    #13
    Hop on the Slaftrain
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    Elliotte Friedman said teams are watching very closely what's going on with Jeff Gorton and whether or not he thinks Price is in the long-term plans.
     
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