Forums/Armchair-GM

Habs Sell Freidge notes

Créé par: Cabbie91
Date de création initiale: 19 nov. 2021
Publié: 19 nov. 2021
Équipe: 2021-22 Canadiens de Montréal
Explications
Elliote per 32 thoughts in response to what the habs would get for Chiarot "at least a 1st rounder, the scope on him is very positive as a playoff player" Notes Edmonton comes to mind
Transactions
1.
MTL
  1. Lavoie, Raphael
  2. 2022 1e round pick (EDM)
EDM
  1. Chiarot, Ben (1 600 000 $ retained)
2.
MTL
  1. 2023 6e round pick (WPG)
WPG
  1. Perreault, Mathieu
3.
MTL
  1. 2023 5e round pick (NYI)
NYI
  1. Wideman, Chris
4.
MTL
  1. Ranta, Sampo
  2. 2023 2e round pick (COL)
COL
  1. Drouin, Jonathan
Rachats de contrats
  • Karl Alzner: 1 958 333 $
Transactions impliquant une retenue de salaire
  • Ben Chiarot: 1 600 000 $ (45.71%)
ANNÉE DE REPÊCHAGERONDE 1RONDE 2RONDE 3RONDE 4RONDE 5RONDE 6RONDE 7
2022
CAR
EDM
MTL
MTL
ANA
CAR
MTL
TBL
MTL
MTL
MTL
STL
2023
MTL
MTL
COL
MTL
MTL
MTL
NYI
MTL
WPG
MTL
2024
MTL
MTL
MTL
MTL
MTL
MTL
TAILLE DE LA FORMATIONPLAFOND SALARIALCAP HITEXCÉDENTS BONISESPACE SOUS LE PLAFOND SALARIAL
2381 500 000 $75 303 394 $597 561 $1 982 500 $6 196 606 $

Formation

Ailier gaucheCentreAilier droit
MTL
Toffoli, Tyler
4 250 000 $
AG, AD
UFA - 3
MTL
Suzuki, Nick
863 333 $
C, AD
UFA - 1
MTL
Caufield, Cole
880 833 $
AD, AG
RFA - 2
MTL
Hoffman, Mike
4 500 000 $
AG, AD
UFA - 3
MTL
Dvorak, Christian
4 450 000 $
C, AG
UFA - 4
MTL
Gallagher, Brendan
6 500 000 $
AD
NMC NTC
UFA - 6
COL
Ranta, Sampo
925 000 $
AG
RFA - 2
MTL
Poehling, Ryan
750 000 $
C, AG
RFA - 2
MTL
Anderson, Josh
5 500 000 $
AD, AG
NTC
UFA - 6
MTL
Lehkonen, Artturi
2 300 000 $
AG, AD
RFA - 1
MTL
Evans, Jake
750 000 $
C, AD
UFA - 1
MTL
Armia, Joel
3 400 000 $
AD, AG
UFA - 4
Défenseur gaucherDéfenseur droitierGardien de but
MTL
Edmundson, Joel
3 500 000 $
DG
NTC
UFA - 3
MTL
Petry, Jeff
6 250 000 $
DD
NMC NTC
UFA - 4
MTL
Price, Carey
10 500 000 $
G
NMC
UFA - 5
MTL
Romanov, Alexander
894 167 $
DG
RFA - 1
MTL
Kulak, Brett
1 850 000 $
DG
UFA - 1
MTL
Allen, Jake
2 875 000 $
G
UFA - 2
MTL
Norlinder, Mattias
859 167 $
DG
RFA - 3
MTL
Savard, David
3 500 000 $
DD
UFA - 4
Laissés de côtéListe des blessés (IR)Liste des blessés à long terme (LTIR)
MTL
Niku, Sami
750 000 $
DG/DD
RFA - 1
MTL
Paquette, Cédric
950 000 $
C, AG, AD
UFA - 1
MTL
Weber, Shea
7 857 143 $
DD
UFA - 5
MTL
Pezzetta, Michael
750 000 $
AG, C
RFA - 1
MTL
Byron, Paul
3 400 000 $
AG, AD, C
UFA - 2

Unités spéciales

Avantage numérique 1
Toffoli, T.
Suzuki, N.
Hoffman, M.
Caufield, C.
Norlinder, M.
Avantage numérique 2
Armia, J.
Dvorak, C.
Gallagher, B.
Romanov, A.
Petry, J.
Infériorité numérique 1
Dvorak, C.
Lehkonen, A.
Edmundson, J.
Petry, J.
Infériorité numérique 2
Suzuki, N.
Evans, J.
Romanov, A.
Savard, D.

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19 nov. 2021 à 9 h 3
#1
Rejoint: mars 2017
Messages: 16,176
Mentions "j'aime": 4,927
Holland has already stated that he's not using the first on a rental, it would only be used on a player with term. He's building for the long term.
19 nov. 2021 à 9 h 9
#2
Démarrer sujet
Rejoint: févr. 2016
Messages: 1,063
Mentions "j'aime": 28
Quoting: CD282
Holland has already stated that he's not using the first on a rental, it would only be used on a player with term. He's building for the long term.


I understand that lol, this is what is being reported and speculated by somebody much more in the know than either of us. Don't shoot the messenger.
OlegP a aimé ceci.
19 nov. 2021 à 9 h 12
#3
Rejoint: juill. 2016
Messages: 2,080
Mentions "j'aime": 876
And... Edmonton would insta-regret it (a bit like the Leafs with Foligno last season)
CD282 a aimé ceci.
19 nov. 2021 à 9 h 25
#4
Go Habs Go
Rejoint: mars 2017
Messages: 8,245
Mentions "j'aime": 2,146
Quoting: Xspyrit
And... Edmonton would insta-regret it (a bit like the Leafs with Foligno last season)


That's not really a fair evaluation. New setting, injury, and he was 3-1 on the scoreboard at even strength. He was a good addition and did his job other than personal production.
Shanesaw9, Xspyrit et OlegP a aimé ceci.
19 nov. 2021 à 9 h 27
#5
Rejoint: mars 2017
Messages: 16,176
Mentions "j'aime": 4,927
Quoting: Cabbie91
I understand that lol, this is what is being reported and speculated by somebody much more in the know than either of us. Don't shoot the messenger.


I'll take Holland's statement over Friedman's speculation all day.
19 nov. 2021 à 9 h 31
#6
Rejoint: août 2020
Messages: 695
Mentions "j'aime": 266
I dont think Chiarot going to land a first plus a solid prospect like Lavoie, probably an either or situation, if i'm the habs i would take Lavoie and a 2nd or even a 3rd, instead of try to snag a late first, cuz lets be honest, theres a very high chance the habs screw up their selection with that pick anyways.
MountRoyal a aimé ceci.
19 nov. 2021 à 10 h 59
#7
Rejoint: août 2020
Messages: 4,971
Mentions "j'aime": 2,921
Drouin isn’t getting anything remotely close to that return. Easy easy no from COL.
TJTwolf a aimé ceci.
19 nov. 2021 à 12 h 23
#8
Rejoint: oct. 2019
Messages: 1,617
Mentions "j'aime": 944
While I think Perreault for a 6th is a reasonable price, I doubt Winnipeg makes that trade and instead they would bring up the less expensive Gustafsson if they had the cap space to fit him in (which they don't currently).

Perreault probably ends up somewhere other than Winnipeg.
19 nov. 2021 à 16 h 8
#9
Rejoint: mars 2017
Messages: 16,176
Mentions "j'aime": 4,927
Just checked out Chiarot's "rels", which compare him to his teammates.

CF% rel - negative every single year of his career
SF% rel - negative 6 of the last 7 seasons
GF% rel - negative last 3 seasons and 6 of 8
xGF% rel - negative 6 of last 7
SCF% rel - negative 7 of 8
HDCF% rel - negative 6 of 7

These are not good numbers, in fact they are quite bad. Worse, they're largely caused by poor defensive metrics - he allows more shots against than average of his teammates, he allows more goals against, more scoring chances and more high danger corsi. It isn't due to zone starts either, he generally gets about 50% offensive zone starts.

He had one good playoff run where the refs allowed him to hack and whack opponents at will, and Habs fans think he's suddenly a 1st pairing defenseman who is worth a whole ton. Genuinely he's a replacement level guy and has been his entire career.

http://naturalstattrick.com/playerreport.php?fromseason=20212022&thruseason=20212022&stype=2&sit=5v5&stdoi=oi&rate=r&v=p&playerid=8475279

Actually, the results from the past 2 playoff runs are worse than his regular season results: http://naturalstattrick.com/playerreport.php?fromseason=20212022&thruseason=20212022&stype=3&sit=5v5&stdoi=oi&rate=r&v=p&playerid=8475279.php?fromseason=20212022&thruseason=20212022&stype=2&sit=5v5&stdoi=oi&rate=r&v=p&playerid=8475279
19 nov. 2021 à 16 h 13
#10
Banni
Rejoint: mars 2017
Messages: 2,471
Mentions "j'aime": 1,158
Quoting: Xspyrit
And... Edmonton would insta-regret it (a bit like the Leafs with Foligno last season)


Teams will pay! They do every year. Its like buying a 6 figure Gretzky rookie card that was lost in the fires of BC this Summer. I'm sure that person regrets it but it just takes one GM to pay the price and they always do. Chiarot is literally a scarce product much like a rookie card of Wayne-O. His value will be bloated by the TDL. 1st+ at a minimum
19 nov. 2021 à 16 h 15
#11
Banni
Rejoint: mars 2017
Messages: 2,471
Mentions "j'aime": 1,158
Quoting: habs_need_Scoring
I dont think Chiarot going to land a first plus a solid prospect like Lavoie, probably an either or situation, if i'm the habs i would take Lavoie and a 2nd or even a 3rd, instead of try to snag a late first, cuz lets be honest, theres a very high chance the habs screw up their selection with that pick anyways.


Lavoie isnt much of a prospect,. He's projected as a 4th liner with size. Oilers fans have overvalued their prospects here for years, Benson, Caleb Jones. Magic beans
19 nov. 2021 à 16 h 28
#12
Rejoint: mars 2017
Messages: 16,176
Mentions "j'aime": 4,927
Quoting: OlegP
Teams will pay! They do every year. Its like buying a 6 figure Gretzky rookie card that was lost in the fires of BC this Summer. I'm sure that person regrets it but it just takes one GM to pay the price and they always do. Chiarot is literally a scarce product much like a rookie card of Wayne-O. His value will be bloated by the TDL. 1st+ at a minimum

Chiarot is a replacement level defenseman, has been his entire career.
19 nov. 2021 à 21 h 30
#13
Rejoint: juill. 2016
Messages: 2,080
Mentions "j'aime": 876
Quoting: OlegP
Teams will pay! They do every year. Its like buying a 6 figure Gretzky rookie card that was lost in the fires of BC this Summer. I'm sure that person regrets it but it just takes one GM to pay the price and they always do. Chiarot is literally a scarce product much like a rookie card of Wayne-O. His value will be bloated by the TDL. 1st+ at a minimum


We'll see. David Savard returned a very late 1st and a 3rd. Chiarot doesn't have the same resume
20 nov. 2021 à 0 h 2
#14
Rejoint: janv. 2017
Messages: 3,537
Mentions "j'aime": 893
Not for the Avs. Firstly Drouin has basically zero trade value right now and secondly there is a thing called a salary cap.
20 nov. 2021 à 0 h 43
#15
Banni
Rejoint: mars 2017
Messages: 2,471
Mentions "j'aime": 1,158
Quoting: Xspyrit
We'll see. David Savard returned a very late 1st and a 3rd. Chiarot doesn't have the same resume


You serious?! Savard sucks and is 2nd pair at best and thats generous. Chiarot has been top pair on Montreal and Winnipeg. I shouldnt have to explain to you that Chairot is a better player
20 nov. 2021 à 7 h 53
#16
Rejoint: oct. 2019
Messages: 1,617
Mentions "j'aime": 944
Quoting: OlegP
You serious?! Savard sucks and is 2nd pair at best and thats generous. Chiarot has been top pair on Montreal and Winnipeg. I shouldnt have to explain to you that Chairot is a better player


Chiarot was a passenger on the top pair in Winnipeg (2015-16 and 16-17) when Byfuglien was the top guy. When Byfuglien went down to the 2nd pairing, so did Chiarot.

Chiarot doesn't suck, but he is not able to drive a top pairing.
Xspyrit a aimé ceci.
20 nov. 2021 à 14 h 12
#17
Rejoint: juill. 2016
Messages: 2,080
Mentions "j'aime": 876
Modifié 20 nov. 2021 à 14 h 19
Quoting: OlegP
You serious?! Savard sucks and is 2nd pair at best and thats generous. Chiarot has been top pair on Montreal and Winnipeg. I shouldnt have to explain to you that Chairot is a better player


That will be an unpopular take

Obviously we were not talking about NOW but more what these guys did in the past until last trade deadline (for Savard) and this year for Chiarot. Chiarot had a great first season with the Habs and really good playoffs as well but outside of that, no GM in their right mind would consider spending a 1st round pick on him. If they do is because they hope that they would get that level from him.

Savard's incoming decline was becoming pretty apparent, Julien Brisebois was ready to overpay because he knew what his team needed. It might happen for Chiarot as well depending on the market at the deadline. Just getting a 1st for Chiarot would already be a pretty big win. More than that would be shocking but markets fluctuate so anything can happen.
27 nov. 2021 à 13 h 13
#18
Banni
Rejoint: mars 2017
Messages: 2,471
Mentions "j'aime": 1,158
Quoting: Mr_Canoehead
Chiarot was a passenger on the top pair in Winnipeg (2015-16 and 16-17) when Byfuglien was the top guy. When Byfuglien went down to the 2nd pairing, so did Chiarot.

Chiarot doesn't suck, but he is not able to drive a top pairing.


Semantics. Literally everyone agrees that he will get a 1st+ including the pundits because of scarcity. It's only the naysayers from here that question it
27 nov. 2021 à 14 h 59
#19
Rejoint: oct. 2019
Messages: 1,617
Mentions "j'aime": 944
Quoting: OlegP
Semantics. Literally everyone agrees that he will get a 1st+ including the pundits because of scarcity. It's only the naysayers from here that question it


I never opined on his value. Just giving you background that he just happened to be on the top pair because he shot left and Byfuglien was the top pair driver. That is reality.
 
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