Forums/Armchair-GM

Lets just tank

Créé par: Chuckforit
Date de création initiale: 16 nov. 2021
Publié: 16 nov. 2021
Équipe: 2021-22 Canadiens de Montréal
Explications
Bergevin wouldn't do this, but anyone with a freaking iota of vision for the future can see that this year is the right year to tank...

----------------------

A few things taken into consideration for this tank setup :

Hoffman is coming back soon, hence why he is in the lineup. Same thing for Paquette and Perreault except I'm putting them as healthy scratch for now. Niku might also be back soon enough.

Price isn't coming back to play this year. He might, but I have chosen to believe he won't for this specific setup.

Allen comes back from injury to be a big brother to Primeau. They share games 50/50 as much as possible so Primeau gets some experience.

Byron stays on LTIR for now. Rumor is he might be back to play towards the end of december, but I have disregarded that fact for this setup.

Weber's career is over. Drouin said it - albeit by mistake - but it's clear. Rumor is he's been offered a pro scout job in the habs' front office. He might already be transitionning towards that.

-------------------------

Explanations for the moves and the signings :

Montembault on waivers
Pretty much self-explanatory, I think Minnessota might pick him up on waivers, if not them or any other team he goes to Laval and finishes his contract there (if there aren't anymore injuries).

Kulak trade
Clearing space on the blue line (along with Wideman). This gives more space for Romanov, Niku, Norlinder and Brook to get some NHL experience.

Toffoli trade
I'll admit this one is kind of a doozy. Considering the current situation with injuries with Vegas, Toffoli could jump in to help them get back on track right now. In the future, when Pacio, Stone and others come back healthy, he can still play on the middle 6 and contribute offensively. The three prospects coming back are not exactly elite potential, but getting prospects from Vegas has worked well so far for the teams willing to trade with them (see also; Pacioretty trade, Nolan Patrick trade, etc.)

Wideman trade
Anaheim have had a good start all things considered, Wideman can help their RHD depth and second powerplay unit.

Petry trade
Petry goes back to Edmonton, who needs RHD depth to stay competitive. At this point in his career, he can be a leader on any team and he now has actual playoff experience - which Edmonton is lacking. It's been rumored that he regrets leaving Edmonton before McDavid was drafted, so his NMC/M-NTC won't be an issue. Salary retained to sweeten the deal, which for the next 3 season after this one is not really gonna be a problem for the habs cap-wise.

Chariot trade
Chariot goes back to Winnipeg. He's having an above average start of the season and Winnipeg could use a veteran like him once the playoff starts. Salary retained to sweeten the deal, doesn't really matter since it's only for the rest of the season.

Jacob Olofsson signing
We need to bring this guy over to the NHL. He's 21 and showing real potential as a two-way player. He could fit really well with Evans and Gally (more on that below), as he works as hard as anybody and has a really good work ethic.

-----------------------------

Explanations for the line combinations :

First line
Drouin - Dvorak - Anderson
This line should be playing against the other team's top line. Dvorak isn't a first line center offensively, but he is really responsible and works hard. Drouin and Anderson play well together and can keep the other team's offensive defensemen in check.

Second line
Hoffman - Suzuki - Caufield
To those saying Caufield needs to play in Laval for the rest of the year, I say ''Nah...''. Seriously tho, I think giving Suzuki a less stressful role as a second-line center will help him be successful. Also, complimenting him with Hoffman and Caufield, who can both shoot it from anywhere, is a - potentially - deadly combination, or at least in my mind.

Third line
Olofsson - Evans - Gallagher
As mentionned above, I think this guy should come over to the NHL already. I really see a potential fit with Evans and Gally and this line's primary role would definitely be as follows : Be agressive on the forecheck, try to create scoring chances off the rush and go straight for the net to get rebounds. A perfect combination of speed, swiftness and determination.

Fourth line
Lekhonen - Poeling - Armia
To be honest, this one is kind of a placeholder for Armia and Lekhonen. I can't really see myself trading those two without a tangible return. Poeling could go back to Laval to play a more offensive role there and be replaced by Paquette and/or Perreault.

First pair
Edmundson - Savard
You can call this the ''stay-at-home-first-pair''. Simple; they play against the other teams' best lines. Up to 25 minutes a game if they have to. Hopefully they don't get injured....

Second pair
Romanov - Niku
Romanov should play as physical and however he wants to play. He's been hyped way too much by the media as the next Markov or whatever and I think everybody can see right through that now. I think he can be a Alexei-Emelin-type and can make the other teams forward think twice about entering the zone on his side. He's also only 21, so his development will continue for the next 3 to 4 years. Niku is charged with staying put in case Romanov misses a check or whatever... He can also take care of the defensive zone exit pretty well with his first pass vision.

Third pair
Norlinder - Brook
This pair is designed to give a chance to defensive prospects. I would start with Norlinder and Brook but they could switch with other prospects as much as once every two games or so. Ghule, Fairbrother and Belpedio can have their go at it as well.

Powerplay and Penalty kill
Pretty much the way it is right now if you replace Wideman with Niku, Petry with Brook and Kulak with Norlinder. Edmundson and Savard stay on the ice as much as possible for the penalty kill.

Scratches
Xavier Ouellet - Sorry bud, but you are only here in case every defensive prospects we have signed gets injured. Get used to the press box...
Cedric Paquette - As mentionned above, he can come in if somebody gets injured or plays bad on the bottom six (Mostly Poeling).
Perrault - Same thing as Paquette.

Taxi Squad
I just put every player who had one year left on their contract in here, don't pay attention to it. NHL should've kept the taxi squad concept this year though (For the Senators and the Sharks...)

-----------------------------

Conclusion

This was put together in about half an hour, so you can definitely call this half-assed if you so please. I am open for debate concering the trades and the line combinations or if you have any pent-up anger to deliver at someone.

Cheers.
Transactions
1.
MTL
    Waivers (I'm picking Minnesota, but it could be whoever)
    MIN
    1. Montembeault, Samuel
    2.
    MTL
    1. 2023 6e round pick (VGK)
    VGK
    1. Kulak, Brett
    3.
    MTL
    1. Donovan, Ryder [Liste de réserve]
    2. Ellis, Noah [Liste de réserve]
    3. Vikman, Jesper [Liste de réserve]
    4. 2023 4e round pick (VGK)
    Détails additionnels:
    Pick is top 10 protected
    VGK
    1. Toffoli, Tyler (2 000 000 $ retained)
    2. 2023 5e round pick (MTL)
    4.
    MTL
    1. 2023 5e round pick (ANA)
    ANA
    1. Wideman, Chris
    5.
    MTL
    1. Wanner, Maximus [Liste de réserve]
    2. 2023 2e round pick (EDM)
    EDM
    1. Petry, Jeff (2 500 000 $ retained)
    6.
    MTL
    1. Johannesson, Anton [Liste de réserve]
    2. 2024 2e round pick (WPG)
    WPG
    1. Chiarot, Ben (1 750 000 $ retained)
    Rachats de contrats
    • Karl Alzner: 1 958 333 $
    Transactions impliquant une retenue de salaire
    • Tyler Toffoli: 2 000 000 $ (47.06%)
    • Jeff Petry: 2 500 000 $ (40%)
    • Ben Chiarot: 1 750 000 $ (100%)
    • Brett Kulak: 925 000 $ (50%)
    • Ben Chiarot: 1 750 000 $ (50%)
    • Artturi Lehkonen: 1 150 000 $ (50%)
    ANNÉE DE REPÊCHAGERONDE 1RONDE 2RONDE 3RONDE 4RONDE 5RONDE 6RONDE 7
    2022
    Logo de CAR
    Logo de MTL
    Logo de MTL
    Logo de ANA
    Logo de CAR
    Logo de MTL
    Logo de TBL
    Logo de MTL
    Logo de MTL
    Logo de MTL
    Logo de STL
    2023
    Logo de MTL
    Logo de MTL
    Logo de EDM
    Logo de MTL
    Logo de MTL
    Logo de VGK
    Logo de ANA
    Logo de MTL
    Logo de VGK
    Logo de MTL
    2024
    Logo de MTL
    Logo de WPG
    Logo de MTL
    Logo de MTL
    Logo de MTL
    Logo de MTL
    Logo de MTL
    TAILLE DE LA FORMATIONPLAFOND SALARIALCAP HITEXCÉDENTS Info-bulleBONISESPACE SOUS LE PLAFOND SALARIAL
    2381 500 000 $64 491 727 $597 561 $1 590 000 $17 008 273 $

    Formation

    Ailier gaucheCentreAilier droit
    Logo de MTL
    Drouin, Jonathan
    5 500 000 $
    AG, AD
    NTC
    UFA - 2
    Logo de MTL
    Dvorak, Christian
    4 450 000 $
    C, AG
    UFA - 4
    Logo de MTL
    Anderson, Josh
    5 500 000 $
    AD, AG
    NTC
    UFA - 6
    Logo de MTL
    Hoffman, Mike
    4 500 000 $
    AG, AD
    UFA - 3
    Logo de MTL
    Suzuki, Nick
    863 333 $
    C
    UFA - 1
    Logo de MTL
    Caufield, Cole
    880 833 $
    AG, AD
    RFA - 2
    Logo de MTL
    Olofsson, Jacob
    925 000 $
    C
    RFA
    Logo de MTL
    Evans, Jake
    750 000 $
    C, AD
    UFA - 1
    Logo de MTL
    Gallagher, Brendan
    6 500 000 $
    AD
    NMC NTC
    UFA - 6
    Logo de MTL
    Lehkonen, Artturi
    1 150 000 $
    AG, AD
    UFA - 1
    Logo de MTL
    Poehling, Ryan
    750 000 $
    C, AG
    RFA - 2
    Logo de MTL
    Armia, Joel
    3 400 000 $
    AD, AG
    UFA - 4
    Défenseur gaucherDéfenseur droitierGardien de but
    Logo de MTL
    Edmundson, Joel
    3 500 000 $
    DG
    NTC
    UFA - 3
    Logo de MTL
    Savard, David
    3 500 000 $
    DD
    UFA - 4
    Logo de MTL
    Primeau, Cayden
    880 833 $
    G
    RFA - 1
    Logo de MTL
    Romanov, Alexander
    894 167 $
    DG/DD
    RFA - 1
    Logo de MTL
    Niku, Sami
    750 000 $
    DG/DD
    UFA - 1
    Logo de MTL
    Allen, Jake
    2 875 000 $
    G
    UFA - 2
    Logo de MTL
    Norlinder, Mattias
    859 167 $
    DG
    RFA - 3
    Logo de MTL
    Brook, Josh
    795 000 $
    DD
    UFA - 1
    Laissés de côtéListe des blessés (IR)Liste des blessés à long terme (LTIR)
    Logo de MTL
    Ouellet, Xavier
    737 500 $
    DG/DD
    UFA - 1
    Logo de MTL
    Weber, Shea
    7 857 143 $
    DD
    UFA - 5
    Logo de MTL
    Paquette, Cédric
    950 000 $
    C, AG, AD
    UFA - 1
    Logo de MTL
    Byron, Paul
    3 400 000 $
    AG, AD
    UFA - 2
    Logo de MTL
    Perreault, Mathieu
    950 000 $
    AG, AD, C
    UFA - 1
    Logo de MTL
    Price, Carey
    10 500 000 $
    G
    NMC
    UFA - 5
    Équipe de réserve
    Logo de MTL
    Teasdale, Joël
    763 333 $ (0 $)
    AD, AG
    RFA - 1
    Logo de MTL
    Khisamutdinov, Arsen
    795 000 $ (0 $)
    C
    UFA - 1
    Logo de MTL
    Dea, Jean-Sébastien
    750 000 $ (0 $)
    C
    UFA - 1
    Logo de MTL
    Dauphin, Laurent
    750 000 $ (0 $)
    C
    UFA - 1
    Logo de MTL
    Vejdemo, Lukas
    750 000 $ (0 $)
    C, AG, AD
    UFA - 1
    Logo de MTL
    Baddock, Brandon
    750 000 $ (0 $)
    AG, C
    UFA - 1
    Logo de MTL
    Belpedio, Louis
    750 000 $ (0 $)
    DD
    UFA - 1
    Logo de MTL
    McNiven, Michael
    750 000 $ (0 $)
    G
    UFA - 1

    Unités spéciales

    Avantage numérique 1
    Caufield, C.
    Suzuki, N.
    Hoffman, M.
    Drouin, J.
    Niku, S.
    Avantage numérique 2
    Gallagher, B.
    Dvorak, C.
    Anderson, J.
    Brook, J.
    Norlinder, M.
    Infériorité numérique 1
    Dvorak, C.
    Gallagher, B.
    Edmundson, J.
    Savard, D.
    Infériorité numérique 2
    Evans, J.
    Armia, J.
    Romanov, A.
    Niku, S.

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    16 nov. 2021 à 23 h 46
    #1
    pmb
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    didn't read that.
    16 nov. 2021 à 23 h 48
    #2
    MisstheWhalers
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    You're basically giving Chiarot away here but the Jets are pretty flush with LHD.

    You're getting essentially nothing for Petry.. Lol
    Long term retention like that isn't realistic, no GM would ever do that.
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    16 nov. 2021 à 23 h 50
    #3
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    Quoting: pmbrouillard
    didn't read that.


    Yup, I really went in on the details

    TLDR ; Habs need to tank.
    16 nov. 2021 à 23 h 59
    #4
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    Quoting: MisstheWhalers
    You're basically giving Chiarot away here but the Jets are pretty flush with LHD.

    You're getting essentially nothing for Petry.. Lol
    Long term retention like that isn't realistic, no GM would ever do that.


    Johannesson is an underated prospect, but the 6th round pick is pretty much magic beans, I'll give you that.

    Petry's value is way down, and salary cap retention isn't used enough especially if you are going into a rebuild. We're talking about 2.5M for the next three years after this season, that's about what Lekhonen makes. I prefer trading Petry while he is still worth something instead of a bottom 6 depth forward.

    An argument could be made to change the 3rd round pick for a 2nd to be fair...
    17 nov. 2021 à 0 h 10
    #5
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    I like your thinking but I think your value are way too low. Chiarot could get us at least a 2cnd round pick, if not a first. He’s what a contender look for, a big guy who can play a lot of minutes. Instead of meh prospect, we should go get a first for Toffoli. Petry with retaintion could get us a prospect and a pick. Id also put Poehling on that 3rd line, I dont see anything great about Olofsson. He’s not even an Ahl player.
    Chuckforit a aimé ceci.
    17 nov. 2021 à 0 h 13
    #6
    Ken Holland Hater
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    Thats all u want for petry?? i get he's had a down year or whatever but jeez.
    MisstheWhalers et BigBadBurke a aimé ceci.
    17 nov. 2021 à 1 h 0
    #7
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    Modifié 17 nov. 2021 à 1 h 10
    Quoting: seanross
    I like your thinking but I think your value are way too low. Chiarot could get us at least a 2cnd round pick, if not a first. He’s what a contender look for, a big guy who can play a lot of minutes. Instead of meh prospect, we should go get a first for Toffoli. Petry with retaintion could get us a prospect and a pick. Id also put Poehling on that 3rd line, I dont see anything great about Olofsson. He’s not even an Ahl player.


    I agree the return value may be low, I did this in 30 minutes with the goal of clearing every player who potentially wouldn't be part of the core for MTL in two to three years.

    Chariot for a first would surprise me. It's not exactly the same situation as, for example, what Goodrow was traded for two years ago. As stated in another comment above, Johannesson is really underated. The 6th round pick could be moved up to a 3rd, I might agree.

    The ''meh prospects'' are actually playing well right now and will continue to develop. Noah Ellis is a big RHD who can move the puck well, he's gonna play in the NCAA for at least the next two years. Donovan is a big right-handed center with speed and hand hability. Vikman is a 6-2-1 goalie playing in the WHL this year, although he doesn't have the greatest stats it is still an actual tangible return instead of a 5th round or later pick. You could make an argument about another prospect from another team being a better return by himself than those three for sure, but I specifically looked at the VGK prospect pool and that's what, in my mind, would be an acceptable return. The 4th round pick could also be changed for a 3rd.

    I am of the pick-a-player-instead-of-a-pick school, meaning that you know what you get with a player right now instead of waiting to see what you can have with a pick two years from now.

    Which is exactly what you get with Wanner, a prospect, another big RHD who can move the puck with ease. I changed the 4th round pick to a 2nd, since everybody seems to value Petry more highly. The difference between a 1st round pick and a 2nd round pick from Edmonton this draft year (meaning 20th or more) won't really change much.

    Poeling on the 3rd line instead of Evans, I don't know... Maybe if Evans gets injured or plays badly, which for the time being he is very not.

    Olofsson has been playing in the SHL, Sweden's elite hockey league, for two years and a half now. I would argue that the level of players between AHL and the SHL are actually closer then most people think. These are real men with real skill playing in Sweden nowadays. Same with the NCAA and the Liiga.
    17 nov. 2021 à 1 h 4
    #8
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    Quoting: Petey232323
    Thats all u want for petry?? i get he's had a down year or whatever but jeez.


    I changed the 4th round pick for a 2nd, after reconsideration. He is going to be 34 in december, so there isn't a potential for him to get better. This trade was set on selling right now instead of waiting for his value to drop.

    Also, considering that Holland has been critized for his defensemen acquisition since taking over in EDM, you could argue that he wouldn't counter-offer on a trade like this, which is ideal.
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    17 nov. 2021 à 6 h 45
    #9
    LongtimeLeafsufferer
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    I thought Habs were tanking without trading their best players. Oilers really can't afford Petry now and not next year even with retention, though I still think Petry could get more in a trade
    CD282 a aimé ceci.
    17 nov. 2021 à 8 h 55
    #10
    PittsburghModelMyAss
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    Quoting: Petey232323
    Thats all u want for petry?? i get he's had a down year or whatever but jeez.


    Quoting: palhal
    I thought Habs were tanking without trading their best players. Oilers really can't afford Petry now and not next year even with retention, though I still think Petry could get more in a trade


    and to think Berg was offered Jake Bean & a 1st from carolina for Petry last year... ughhh these last years of "making" the playoffs really set us back a while
    17 nov. 2021 à 9 h 21
    #11
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    Winnipeg doesn't have the need or cap space for Chiarot.
    17 nov. 2021 à 10 h 19
    #12
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    Quoting: Chuckforit
    Yup, I really went in on the details

    TLDR ; Habs need to tank.


    Quoting: Chuckforit
    Johannesson is an underated prospect, but the 6th round pick is pretty much magic beans, I'll give you that.

    Petry's value is way down, and salary cap retention isn't used enough especially if you are going into a rebuild. We're talking about 2.5M for the next three years after this season, that's about what Lekhonen makes. I prefer trading Petry while he is still worth something instead of a bottom 6 depth forward.

    An argument could be made to change the 3rd round pick for a 2nd to be fair...


    Quoting: Chuckforit
    I changed the 4th round pick for a 2nd, after reconsideration. He is going to be 34 in december, so there isn't a potential for him to get better. This trade was set on selling right now instead of waiting for his value to drop.

    Also, considering that Holland has been critized for his defensemen acquisition since taking over in EDM, you could argue that he wouldn't counter-offer on a trade like this, which is ideal.

    Edmonton simply doesn't have the cap space to make a trade like this. Also, they don't have a need at RHD, so they likely wouldn't want to devote a bunch of cap / trade resources to an addition there. The only way something like this would work is if you were to take Ceci or Barrie back in the deal. Both are playing at or above expectations at the moment, so I'm not sure how it affects the other pieces of the trade, but that would have to be the basis of any Petry-to-Edmonton trade.
    17 nov. 2021 à 10 h 29
    #13
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    Quoting: MisstheWhalers
    You're basically giving Chiarot away here but the Jets are pretty flush with LHD.

    You're getting essentially nothing for Petry.. Lol
    Long term retention like that isn't realistic, no GM would ever do that.

    Meant to tag you on my comment:
    Quoting: CD282
    Edmonton simply doesn't have the cap space to make a trade like this. Also, they don't have a need at RHD, so they likely wouldn't want to devote a bunch of cap / trade resources to an addition there. The only way something like this would work is if you were to take Ceci or Barrie back in the deal. Both are playing at or above expectations at the moment, so I'm not sure how it affects the other pieces of the trade, but that would have to be the basis of any Petry-to-Edmonton trade.
    17 nov. 2021 à 13 h 50
    #14
    MisstheWhalers
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    Quoting: CD282
    Meant to tag you on my comment:


    Yeah I know, I was just commenting from the one angle of how he's giving Petry away and long term retention is very unrealistic, Edmonton would have to make space somehow if they were going to make this deal but I didn't feel like going there, I don't get into every detail of a trade proposal with all my comments.. Lol
    CD282 a aimé ceci.
     
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