Both of those offers are really easily topped

Easy no from ottawa

Yeah Ottawa doesn't touch that deal. Formenton is a good young player who will be cost controlled for a long time.

Not sure that gets it done for ANA either.

If anyone offers that or more for Manson they are dumb. Holl is better than Manson alone.

I'd be really upset if Dorion trades a young asset like Formenton this way.

And I like Mikheyev, if he's available for picks, LMK the price

Formenton has struggled to start the year. Struggling players have decreased values, plus he’s an RFA at the end of the season. Mikheyev has proven to be a top 9F in the league, Formenton might but nobody’s sure as yet.




As for Manson, David Savard was traded for 1st, a 3rd and a depth player. Manson is traded for a 1st, a replacement RHD with 2yrs left at 2 million (that has a lot of value in league look at the contracts Tucker Poolman and Cody Ceci signed), and a depth player. If a team give up more than the Leafs they got fleeced.


Also to everyone point nobody accepts traded from the Leafs unless they are fleeced. If you remove your bias from all of these trades they’re fair value.

He’s been struggling, maybe we can add a late pick in a future draft to sweeten the pot.

Honestly trying to build Toronto a true shutdown line that can score. Formenton speed would excel with Kase play driving ability, and would flourish with Kampf defensive prowess

Then Toronto should probably stop healthy scratching him

Maybe Calgary should stop playing Monahan on the 4th line.

You’re giving ifs, ands and buts. Holl was scratched to show him he needs to step up his game. At the end of the day an RHD with2 yrs left at 2 million that can play top 4 minutes carries a lot of value.

Toronto has 7 legit dman and Holl would easily be a top 4 dman on 50% of team in the NHL without a doubt.

My bias? Manson is one of the best defenseman that will be available at the deadline. Simple supply and demand. The other trade is laughable, you offered an injured pending UFA for one of Ottawa top prospects, thats not bias lol

Monahan's playing 2nd line center lmao, he started out at 4C because he was still recovering from surgery. Completely different situation from Holl, who is just not very good. Top 4 on 50% of teams is amusing, name 10.

Formenton is not a top prospect in Ottawas pool lol. He’s played multiple NHL games the previous seasons and this season. He isn’t even Calder eligible. I wouldn’t even put Formenton in ottawas top 10 affialted prospects with their depth in their prospect pool.

Also to your point David Savard was the only big defenceman on the market last year. I gave up more than Tampa did on thr David Savard deal lmfao.

Yet I am bias…

Pittsburgh, Vegas, Edmonton, Sabres, Ottawa, Blue Jackets, Kraken, Canucks, Arizona, Chicago, Rangers, Kings.

I’ve named more than 10 and those are all teams he’d be a top 4 dman on currently

I never called you bias, you called me that.

You still failed to justify how your Formenton trade is remotely fair. Mikheyev jolds almost zero trade value right now.

Last years defense market had a lot more than just Savard

I can say with confidence arizona and Vancouver are the only teams he gets top 4 in there

No it didn’t have more than Savard. Ekholm was never in the market. Any any other dman that was avaible that was a top 4 dman. The answer is you can’t.

LMFAOOOOOOO

Crazy, there’s no point of convincing you. Not even gonna bother responding to you. Funny how when it’s a leafs player everyone calls them terrible but refuses to actually provide evidence supporting their cause. All the analytics support Holl is a 4/5 dman in this league. Unfortunately we have players with higher potential and younger that we have more control over a longer period. Which is why Holl has been out of the lineup

They have in fact

I guess Mike Reilly, Erik Gudbranson, and Brandon Montour were never traded. All of which are capable of playing top 4 minutes, 2 of which are about the same caliber as Holl

LOL no. Even if you add a 2nd, Ottawa is not doing that (and I think Dorion is easily one of the worst GMs around) but at least they know the value of their young guys

Formenton most likely just not available. It would probably take a significant player for them to consider including in a package.



The problem you have here... is that Formenton only has 42 NHL GP experience and just turned 22 y/o.

He plays ~12-13 mins on a struggling team with very little veteran talent (Connor Brown and not much after that). Almost 2 of these minutes are PK minutes

He is also HEAVILY deployed as a defensive forward. Since last season, a 65/35 ratio of his zone starts have been in the defensive zone. No surprise as he plays mostly with shutdown forwards like Connor Brown and Nick Paul (Tierney too)

You have to keep in mind that the young guys in Ottawa have to do everything on their own, they have zero support

It would be a pretty stupid mistake to trade Formenton carelessly

Lets go through those teams you named and list the 4+ defense that would definitely be ahead of Holl in the depth chart.
Pittsburgh: Letang, Matheson, Marino, Dumoulin, Pettersson.
Vegas: Pietrangelo, Theodore, Martinez, Hague. (McNabb is a 50/50)
Edmonton: Nurse, Barrie, Ceci, Bouchard. (Klefbom if he was healthy)
Buffalo: Dahlin, Miller, Jokiharju, Bryson. (Butcher is debatable)
Ottawa: Chabot, Zub, Brannstrom. Ok Holl could make that top 4
Columbus: Werenski, Bean, Gavrikov, Boqvist
Seattle: Giordano, Oleksiak, Larsson, Dunn, Soucy, Lauzon. (did you seriously name Seattle?)
Chicago: S. Jones, McCabe, Murphy, DeHann, Kalynuk, Mitchell.
NYR: Trouba, Fox, Miller Lindgren, Lundkvist.
Los Angeles: Edler, Doughty, Anderson, Roy, Walker.

So to reiterate, you named 13 teams and he 9nly makes top 4 in 3 of them

Ok, I think there's only one way to settle this.

Formenton and Mickheyev race, once around the rink.

If Formenton wins, he stays, if he loses the trade goes through.

Clearly you don't know anything about the Sens prospect pool. Sanderson, Pinto, Brannstrom, JBD, Greig. At most there are 5 propsects ahead of him. He also jumped all the way up from 47th to 20th in Pronman's latest 2017 redraft, ahead of Comtois, Timmins, Oettinger, Hague, Studnicka, Joki, Foote, Texier.... he hasn't struggled at all.

Point per game in his D+1 year, almost 2 ppg in the playoffs and played a significant role on Canada's wjc team. D+2 year was over a ppg again and almost 2 ppg in the playoffs again. D+3 he went pro and spent the whole year in the AHL where he had almost 30 goals and just under a ppg while making the allstar game and winning the fastest skater. Covid hit during the d+4 year, Belleville was terrible and his numbers reflected that. Ottawa was almost equally bad but he played well. He's in his d+5 year and this is the first time he's made the team and stuck out of camp. The team's been rough but he's been a bright spot.

He hasnt struggled at all. He excels at his role and in no way is he a depreciating asset. His value isnt hindered by the fact that he's an rfa this year either. No idea why you even brought that up... he's just going to sign another contract. If you want him then you're going to have to pay a lot for Dorion to send him 4 hours up the 401 to their biggest rivals.

Also I don't know what you think Mikheyev's value is, especially considering he's injured and a ufa at the end of the season but I promise you that it's nowhere near what you think it is.

Bruv, Filip Guftasson, Lassi Thompson and Tyler Boucher are all ahead of Formenton in Ottawas prospect pool. If even put Soodgard, and maybe even Vitali Ambramov.

Also did you ever considered that Ottawa doesn’t like to spend money? They have Norris, Branstrom, Tierney, Paul to name a few up this season. They’re already not an attractable market due to location and it’s owner, they’ll be forced to overpay for a lot of its players. It will be impossible to keep all of em. Just like the Leafs were forced to shed their drafted depth so will Ottawa.